NOSFET APEX-01

[Unventor]

I think it would be nice is moderators @meepmeepmayer made a thread that @NOSFET Electric Dreams could make official posts in. And that we had a debate threat that people could discuss things in. Right now it is hard to find something useful here as discussions keep going off the track. In a month from now this will only be worse.  This could also help in @NOSFET Electric Dreamsnot having to answer sake type of questions again and again. He can eg copy a link to a post and then use a reply in the official corner if he thinks it makes it easier to see the context he is answer. 

This way it is easier to spot news vs people with  waiting for a release and having a EUC delivered. 

[Asphalt]

2 hours ago, onewheelkoregro said:

Aren't EUC's generally run in 2p? 

UL certified 1P modular packs would provide a lot of flexibility in battery configurations. 
Ultralight EUCs usually run 1P centred above the motor.
A 2P EUC would have balanced packs on either side of the body.
EUCs have run 3P, 5P and even 9P.
Most common are 4P and 6P.

The nice thing about 1P packs is that it would be less expensive to swap out if the smartBMS identified an issue with one of the packs.

[Sholphin02]

9 hours ago, Asphalt said:

The high cost of UL certification would be a good reason for manufacturers to standardize battery packs across their line-up.
If there was a standard modular 1P pack for each voltage, then wheels could be designed to carry additional parallel packs as desired.

67V - 16S1P - 300Wh

84V - 20S1P - 375Wh

100V - 24S1P - 450Wh

126V - 30S1P - 563Wh

134V - 32S1P - 600Wh

151V - 36S1P - 675Wh

168V - 40S1P - 750Wh

200V - 48S1P - 900wh

Hopefully the diminishing returns of the voltage wars will plateau soon and the industry can standardize on a "normal voltage" (100V?) and a "performance voltage" (200V?)

This could be the start of hot-swap packs, allowing for lighter wheels and making it easier to travel abroad with wheels.

That would be truly revolutionary.  +1

[dimos15]

Lovely wheel @NOSFET Electric Dreams , do you know if it is going to be an Ewheels exclusive or something similar?

Are we going to see it in Europe from oneride or myewheels?

[fbhb]

1 hour ago, dimos15 said:

do you know if it is going to be an Ewheels exclusive or something similar?

Of course, @NOSFET Electric Dreams would be best placed to answer this with complete certainty. However, I have read elsewhere online Jack answering someone's question regarding availability to a specific UK dealership so I personally would definitely NOT expect this to be an exclusive to eWheels and very likely available Globally!

[fbhb]

Xaio Wu looking over the Apex-01:

Video courtesy of Telegram

Edited Monday at 10:51 AM by fbhb

[Robse]

30 minutes ago, fbhb said:

Xaio Wu looking over the Apex-01:

Video courtesy of Telegram

Very innovative design, but it is absolutely certain that if there is even the slightest play between the teeth of the 2 half gears that must be locked against each other, then any movement of the wheel ( = all the time while riding ) will cause friction and decay of the gears. Furthermore, one could well expect that the two small "locking screws" will cause lots of problems.

[Julianjc84]

42 minutes ago, fbhb said:

Xaio Wu looking over the Apex-01:

Video courtesy of Telegram

it is truly amazing how perfectly aligned the 'frame' and 'sliders' are. Compared to the Begode range of T4/Masters/Blitz Those stanchion poles are looking impressive!. For how 'smooth' and easily the wheel and suspension rolls through the adjustments.
side note: The adjustable light brightness modes seem cool and no silly 'flashing modes'
 

[Funky]

23 minutes ago, Robse said:

Very innovative design, but it is absolutely certain that if there is even the slightest play between the teeth of the 2 half gears that must be locked against each other, then any movement of the wheel ( = all the time while riding ) will cause friction and decay of the gears. Furthermore, one could well expect that the two small "locking screws" will cause lots of problems.

I literally said the same thing some posts ago.. (page 12 at bottom) Slightest play - over time those teeth gonna disappear.. If they are locked in place without any movement at all, then everything will be fine.

Also - let's be honest here, how often will people adjust that suspension. Most will set it once and never adjust it again..... Making this whole gear/teeth setup pointless. 

Edited Monday at 11:44 AM by Funky

[Robse]

10 minutes ago, Funky said:

I literally said the same thing some posts ago..

Also - let's be honest here, how often will people adjust that suspension. Most will set it once and never adjust it again..... Making this whole gear/teeth setup pointless. 

oh, i did not see that ;-)

Maybe one wheel with 2 users with different "body proportions" ?.. ehh      Or one adjustment for paved roads, and another for jumping offroad?

[Rawnei]

Honestly I think it's mostly a gimmick and people want to min/max it, set and forget.

[litewave]

2 hours ago, fbhb said:

Xaio Wu looking over the Apex-01:

Video courtesy of Telegram

Approximate translation (OpenAI)

“We’re talking about the two biggest features of this wheel. One is that the kickstand can be adjusted—it can be raised or lowered. In some extreme downhill situations, the kickstand might scrape against stairs or slopes, and we can lift it a bit to avoid that. This method ensures safety when doing more extreme off-road activities. Another feature is that the pedal height can be adjusted, and it can either have suspension or no suspension, which is adjustable. You can also lock it in place. When there is suspension, you can adjust it directly by locking it in place for no suspension.

The biggest feature of this wheel is that the suspension travel can be adjusted, and the height of the pedals relative to the bike frame can also be adjusted. How do we adjust it? You can see now that the height is set quite high. In a moment, we’ll see how much lower it can go. After turning off the power, we loosen these two screws, press it down completely, and then you can move the wheel up and down. As you can see, there are many teeth here, and each one represents a different bike height and suspension travel setting. When you adjust it to the lowest point, the suspension is locked, meaning the suspension travel is at its shortest. When it’s adjusted to its lowest point on the ground, we need to make sure the teeth are aligned properly. Once aligned, we press down and tighten these two screws. After that, you’ll notice that the pedal is significantly lower compared to when the suspension was active.

When doing off-road riding, we want the suspension travel to be longer and the pedals higher to avoid scraping the pedals. But if you’re on a track or doing some road racing, lowering the pedals and turning off the suspension will allow for faster acceleration, quicker braking, and more agile steering. These different settings are great for advanced users to adapt to various riding environments. Additionally, the lights on this wheel are transparent and have three different brightness modes. At night, the side visibility is improved, making it less likely for you to miss seeing something.”

[Asphalt]

From an engineering design perspective, the adjustable suspension looks magnificent. The manufacturing finish and sliding smoothness look incredible.

The kickstand reminds me of the OG Sherman kickstand that folded up for riding, then folded down to support the wheel. It would make sense for the Apex 01's kickstand to be used in a similar way, rather than leaving it down and having it knocked upwards when doing steep drops or stairs. Curious to know if the the "collision-proof" kickstand claim will stand after the wheel takes a tumble down the side of a mountain or it's first high-speed cutout.
It is a little odd to design a minimalist performance wheel that saves weight by removing the trolley handle, yet still has a kickstand.

I'd like to know how much real-world testing the wheel has been through already, or if Nosfet is taking the usual EUC manufacturer approach of letting influencers do the QA testing?

Hopefully some of these real-world questions will be answered soon:

• How will the adjustable suspension mechanism perform in the cold? Will those tight tolerances loosen and create issues?
• How will the wheel perform with mud and debris? This wheel is intended to be used off-road, and the mudguard is designed to break off, which could leave the suspension mechanism exposed to mud, sand, grit, rocks, water, snow, etc. The stanchions are also exposed (although in the Xaio Wu video it looks like they've added a cover plate <with no heel pad> - which will add weight).
• How will the wheel endure being hosed down after several muddy trail rides? It looks like there are many cavities that will be difficult to clear debris and ingress from.
• Does the IPX6 rating just apply to the electronics? Or also long-term usage of mechanical components as well?
• How will the screws on the bottom of the battery case endure impacts and debris from trail riding?
• How often will the suspension need maintenance?
• How easy is it to disassemble and replace components?
• Will each component be available or will the whole adjustable suspension unit need to be replaced?
• Will there be replacement parts be available at launch?
• Will warranties be handled by dealers or directly with Nosfet? If Nosfet, who do we contact? Jack?
• Will Nosfet have it's own app or will it use LeaperKim's or rely on EUCWorld?
• Will this wheel support all LeaperKim firmware updates, or will it branch it's own firmware? How responsive is the Nosfet dev team? If they're using LeaperKim's software devs, how long can we expect support? What happens if Leaperkim and Nosfet part ways? Will the Apex01 continue to be supported?
• How is carrying this very tall wheel? Will you have to lock the suspension in the lowest position in order to lift this wheel, if you're not a tall person?

 

[Asphalt]

36 minutes ago, litewave said:

Approximate translation (OpenAI)

When doing off-road riding, we want the suspension travel to be longer and the pedals higher to avoid scraping the pedals. But if you’re on a track or doing some road racing, lowering the pedals and turning off the suspension will allow for faster acceleration, quicker braking, and more agile steering. 

Makes me wonder why manufacturers don't make a lighter track racing wheel with no suspension?

[mhpr262]

2 hours ago, Robse said:

it is absolutely certain that if there is even the slightest play between the teeth of the 2 half gears that must be locked against each other, then any movement of the wheel ( = all the time while riding ) will cause friction and decay of the gears

Nothing is more easily fixed than that (if there actually should be play which I doubt), simply by putting one or two thin strips of aluminium foil between the half gears, as shims.

[PourUC]

2 hours ago, Funky said:

I literally said the same thing some posts ago.. (page 12 at bottom) Slightest play - over time those teeth gonna disappear.. If they are locked in place without any movement at all, then everything will be fine.

Also - let's be honest here, how often will people adjust that suspension. Most will set it once and never adjust it again..... Making this whole gear/teeth setup pointless. 

The 'most people' you refer to would just by a Lynx. If you are buying this over the Lynx then it would come in handy. For instance, highest travel when doing big jumps/drops or extremely rutted out trails then knocking it down to around 100 for normal off-road and smaller jumps. Then down again if doing a slow group ride.

All complaints about the features of this wheel not being used by the mainstream seem to forget that the Lynx exists, and this isn't trying to compete there.

[PourUC]

33 minutes ago, mhpr262 said:

Nothing is more easily fixed than that (if there actually should be play which I doubt), simply by putting one or two thin strips of aluminium foil between the half gears, as shims.

My suggestion was a small amount of epoxy put onto the teeth. Like JB weld or similar, just brushed on to make a thin layer.

[PoiuzZ]

19 hours ago, Skampster said:

Personally, I think EUC racing is the stupidest sport ever invented, and I love EUC’s. I just can’t make myself watch it, it just looks retarded. . 

I'm surely going back into it and it's not for your pretty eyes... it's a solo sport like many others. You do it for yourself not any other guy looking at it... If you don't get the feeling, than fair well.

[DavidB]

I am intrigued by the suspension design. Not the gear teeth aspect but the linkage arrangement. Quite inboard compared to other shock systems but it appears at the expense of wheel height.

[ffq]

43 minutes ago, DavidB said:

我对悬架设计很感兴趣。不是齿轮方面，而是连杆布置。与其他减震系统相比，悬架相当靠内，但似乎以牺牲车轮高度为代价。

The suspension seems similar to the designs of the S18 and S22 models. This kind of design doesn't waste much body height since the shock absorption follows the slope of the wheel, which makes a lot of sense.

If you look at Begode's suspension, that's where body height is sacrificed because their shock absorption is oddly upward-facing, which is quite foolish. Maybe they have no choice, as good designs are often patented.

[PoiuzZ]

18 minutes ago, ffq said:

Maybe they have no choice, as good designs are often patented.

The irony comming from a patented invention everyone stole from🤣🤣🤣

I guess it only goes one way hey... (don't get me wrong, I was all about pushing the technology but now they start to get fist by their own game...)

For what it's worth, I agree the teeth of the Apex should have be engineered a bit better... but really eager to hear some longterm feedback...

[onewheelkoregro]

11 minutes ago, PoiuzZ said:

The irony comming from a patented invention everyone stole from🤣🤣🤣

I guess it only goes one way hey... (don't get me wrong, I was all about pushing the technology but now they start to get fist by their own game...)

For what it's worth, I agree the teeth of the Apex should have be engineered a bit better... but really eager to hear some longterm feedback...

If the teeth fail to hold the suspension you would just have the minimum suspension height right?

[PoiuzZ]

1 minute ago, onewheelkoregro said:

If the teeth fail to hold the suspension you would just have the minimum suspension height right?

Well... imagine you are at the top... and it will crack several levels... not even that... just the play...

[PoiuzZ]

From what is shown i'm not even sure what would happen as the last step isn't secured better than others... I didn't take too much time into it but that's seems it from memory... (I have a bad one, please be kind😅)

[PoiuzZ]

The all point is to avoid issues like "TheBlackCobra" just shared... I mean... something will stop the shock for sure...