Inmotion V14 Adventure: a new trail wheel from Inmotion

[YCC]

Does any guys have the real world data of no load speed of V14 tested? 

I saw some video showed only 100kpm, however, the official announcement showed 110kpm.

[SoleCycle]

On 11/26/2023 at 12:29 PM, techyiam said:

there are also complaints of suspension being too firm.

On 11/26/2023 at 6:42 PM, techyiam said:

I heard that the suspension was so stiff, that the people were speculating perhaps a suspension component was defective.

You mentioned "too firm" in your post above, which is a very different statement than "so stiff, that the people were speculating perhaps a suspension component was defective."

I just want to request a careful consideration of language.

"too firm" evokes a response like this

On 11/26/2023 at 4:59 PM, Unventor said:

...when you look at what the main target user is set from Inmotion side it might not be the case. 

People that do stunt rides and hardcore off road would need a stiffer suspension.

And I just mention it because my hope is that the street riders -- who want to adapt this off-road wheel for their relatively tame street needs -- refrain from complaining and trying to get Inmotion to to do things like weaken their suspension. I see way too much feedback of this nature in all the forums.

• We need good street wheels.
• And we need good off-road wheels.

When street riders weigh in and complain to change off-road wheels (and vice versa), we end up with generic wheels. It's fine if a street rider wants to mod an off-road wheel for their needs (pedal lowering, slick tires, softer suspension, etc..) But I don't want to end up buying off-road wheels and having to mod it just to be sufficient for off-road needs.

Personally, I suspect that I'll have to modify the V14 suspension with longer stanchions and adjusted suspension linkage to match, just so that I can have excellent off-road capability. 85mm travel has proven to be ideal for street riders and I suspect that their influence has already compromised the off-road design decisions in the V14.

By Jason's post, it does appear that,

On 11/26/2023 at 8:26 PM, Jason McNeil said:

there is a potential problem with the vertical stanchions getting stuck.

I find it interesting that it's a stanchion problem as opposed to a linkage problem. Any problem is disappointing but it feels like progress, as all other suspension issues on other wheels have largely been with linkage design and fabrication choices. Hopefully this means proper evolution.

[techyiam]

1 hour ago, goodsignal said:

You mentioned "too firm" in your post above, which is a very different statement than "so stiff, that the people were speculating perhaps a suspension component was defective."

I just want to request a careful consideration of language.

"too firm" evokes a response like this

Early testers mentioned stiff suspension. So stiff that a dealer (not ewheels) was investigating whether something in the suspension  (sliders, linkage, or shock etc.) was defective.

Next thing you know, Jason posted this:

On 11/26/2023 at 5:26 AM, Jason McNeil said:

Yes, Inmotion is updating the mold on some of the stanchion parts, will provide precise details on what's being changed early next week. To set expectations, this is what was communicated for those interested in getting their batch 1 V14s before Christmas. 

 

 

[techyiam]

1 hour ago, goodsignal said:

I find it interesting that it's a stanchion problem as opposed to a linkage problem. Any problem is disappointing but it feels like progress, as all other suspension issues on other wheels have largely been with linkage design and fabrication choices. Hopefully this means proper evolution.

Kingsong makes a great suspension shock actuating rising-rate linkage.

V14 is Inmotion's first linkage suspension.

Begode is the only manufacturer that has a linkage design problem so far.j

Having said that, Kingsong had slider design issues with the S20 and S22.

Edited November 28, 2023 by techyiam

[SoleCycle]

4 minutes ago, techyiam said:

Kingsong makes a great suspension shock actuating rising-rate linkage.

V14 is Inmotion's first linkage suspension.

Begode is the only manufacturer that has a linkage design problem so far.j

Having said that, Kingsong had slider design issues with the S20 and S22.

Thanks for the elaboration and greater perspective. I admit to my own perspective being limited to 16" (12" rim) wheels, as larger wheels aren't on my radar.

My limited experience is that S18 suspension was terrible. That could very well be as a result of their fabrication choices while their fundamental design may have been okay. Begode's suspension design flaws are a bit embarrassing.

[techyiam]

50 minutes ago, SoleCycle said:

My limited experience is that S18 suspension was terrible. That could very well be as a result of their fabrication choices while their fundamental design may have been okay. Begode's suspension design flaws are a bit embarrassing.

Leaper Kim's hydraulic suspension is the real deal.

Out of the box, they work like they should.

Additionally, all sliding joints are wet lubed in an oil bath inside a sealed unit.

For your average rider, the maintenance should be considerable lower than its competitors. 

Edited November 28, 2023 by techyiam

[techyiam]

Although, there may have been a misstep in the omission of a batch 1 sample testing prior to shipping, Inmotion responded quickly in identifying the cause of the issues, coming up with the fixes, and putting them into production for the next batch.

It is really good to see manufacturers are responding this quickly.

This is so much better than how Kingsong dealt with the S22 for those who remember. Aside from some minor revisions, the S22 wasn't really fixed until the release of the S22 Pro.

[dimos15]

4 hours ago, techyiam said:

Although, there may have been a misstep in the omission of a batch 1 sample testing prior to shipping, Inmotion responded quickly in identifying the cause of the issues, coming up with the fixes, and putting them into production for the next batch.

It is really good to see manufacturers are responding this quickly.

This is so much better than how Kingsong dealt with the S22 for those who remember. Aside from some minor revisions, the S22 wasn't really fixed until the release of the S22 Pro.

The s22 pro has 125v mosfets.. my friend bought one and fried the controller on the first day. They haven't fixed it at all..

[techyiam]

7 hours ago, dimos15 said:

The s22 pro has 125v mosfets.. my friend bought one and fried the controller on the first day. They haven't fixed it at all..

Oh. Sorry to hear.

I am not sure how to interpret this data point.

Is this an outlier, or did you friend operate his S22 Pro outside the design point.

However, I haven't seen a large number of complaints of fried controllers online for a while now. The dealers / distributors would have a better picture.

Was your friend's controller replaced under warranty?

I was afraid of controller board frying when I bought my S22 about 2 months ago. However, mine is still working fine. When I ride, I am not hard on the controller, except for when I am accelerating hard off the line, or during hard braking.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 29, 2023 by techyiam

[Rawnei]

6 hours ago, dimos15 said:

The s22 pro has 125v mosfets.. my friend bought one and fried the controller on the first day. They haven't fixed it at all..

The S22 has 150V mosfets.

  

5 hours ago, techyiam said:

I was afraid of controller board frying when I bought my S22 about 2 months ago. However, mine is still working fine. But, when I ride, I am not hard on the controller, except for when I am accelerating hard off the line, or during hard braking.

My controller is early batch, holding up fine, been riding hard.

Edited November 29, 2023 by Rawnei

[techyiam]

1 hour ago, Rawnei said:

The S22 has 150V mosfets.

  

My controller is early batch, holding up fine, been riding hard.

I don't know if there is any truth to it.

I have read somewhere where someone claims some of the early batch had 150 V mosfets, and then, KIngsong reverted back to 125 V mosfets.

[Rawnei]

16 minutes ago, techyiam said:

I don't know if there is any truth to it.

I have read somewhere where someone claims some of the early batch had 150 V mosfets, and then, KIngsong reverted back to 125 V mosfets.

They had plans of changing mosfets to 125V, this was during the electronics shortage where there was a shortage of mosfet supplies, the dealers caught the plan and complained enough to make them think again, this is what I heard at least.

[dimos15]

9 hours ago, techyiam said:

I don't know if there is any truth to it.

I have read somewhere where someone claims some of the early batch had 150 V mosfets, and then, KIngsong reverted back to 125 V mosfets.

This thing has already been discussed in another thread. Every s22 pro comes with 125v mosfets..

 

Edited November 29, 2023 by dimos15

[Clem604]

 

[Jason McNeil]

23 minutes ago, Clem604 said:

 

If you have a Batch 1 V14, whatever you do, don't do this jump from the thumbnail, it's what broke JC's stanchions . The caption should be with the arrow to 'Broken'.

Edited November 29, 2023 by Jason McNeil

[Unventor]

On 11/28/2023 at 9:52 AM, SoleCycle said:

You mentioned "too firm" in your post above, which is a very different statement than "so stiff, that the people were speculating perhaps a suspension component was defective."

I just want to request a careful consideration of language.

"too firm" evokes a response like this

And I just mention it because my hope is that the street riders -- who want to adapt this off-road wheel for their relatively tame street needs -- refrain from complaining and trying to get Inmotion to to do things like weaken their suspension. I see way too much feedback of this nature in all the forums.

• We need good street wheels.
• And we need good off-road wheels.

When street riders weigh in and complain to change off-road wheels (and vice versa), we end up with generic wheels. It's fine if a street rider wants to mod an off-road wheel for their needs (pedal lowering, slick tires, softer suspension, etc..) But I don't want to end up buying off-road wheels and having to mod it just to be sufficient for off-road needs.

Personally, I suspect that I'll have to modify the V14 suspension with longer stanchions and adjusted suspension linkage to match, just so that I can have excellent off-road capability. 85mm travel has proven to be ideal for street riders and I suspect that their influence has already compromised the off-road design decisions in the V14.

By Jason's post, it does appear that,

I find it interesting that it's a stanchion problem as opposed to a linkage problem. Any problem is disappointing but it feels like progress, as all other suspension issues on other wheels have largely been with linkage design and fabrication choices. Hopefully this means proper evolution.

I have 2 things to this post. 

First off I am not against V14 as an off road focused EUC.  Nor that some riders do jumps or stus or how you class that type of riding. 

This is not how I use my EUCs. That is why I still think Inmotion did the smart thing to use a suspension that can be change to the riders liking. This add to the versatility despite having a specific target group in mind. 

I do not view it at a deal breaker that a problem have surfaced in the initial launch. It is not ideal, but with the fast launch cycle all brands keep up, this is a symptom of this. The good part is Inmotion seems to be on the ball and have a solution in the pipeline. 

I am still tracking how the V14 is progressing but today we just got 10-15cm of snow and now with negative temps continuing I doubt I get to ride much for some time.  In the spring I might be ready to buy a new EUC. So the timing of this launch suits me super fine. 

[Ro.man]

Inmotion states shock E2E of 200mm in their manual. Does anybody know the stroke length?

[fbhb]

17 minutes ago, Ro.man said:

Inmotion states shock E2E of 200mm in their manual. Does anybody know the stroke length?

The shock InMotion are using is essentially a Fastace, with a progressive spring, so for the 200mm version the stroke is 52.5mm:

[Ro.man]

1 hour ago, fbhb said:

The shock InMotion are using is essentially a Fastace, with a progressive spring, so for the 200mm version the stroke is 52.5mm:

Thank you!
So imperial size is 7.875x2.0”

[Uras]

On 11/28/2023 at 7:52 PM, SoleCycle said:

"too firm" evokes a response like this

if someone rides a wheel and it is too firm, then that is what it is. Suspension is ideally set up for the individual and their needs.

Edited December 1, 2023 by Uras

[ORDO NOVUS]

On 11/28/2023 at 11:52 AM, SoleCycle said:

You mentioned "too firm" in your post above, which is a very different statement than "so stiff, that the people were speculating perhaps a suspension component was defective."

I just want to request a careful consideration of language.

"too firm" evokes a response like this

And I just mention it because my hope is that the street riders -- who want to adapt this off-road wheel for their relatively tame street needs -- refrain from complaining and trying to get Inmotion to to do things like weaken their suspension. I see way too much feedback of this nature in all the forums.

• We need good street wheels.
• And we need good off-road wheels.

When street riders weigh in and complain to change off-road wheels (and vice versa), we end up with generic wheels. It's fine if a street rider wants to mod an off-road wheel for their needs (pedal lowering, slick tires, softer suspension, etc..) But I don't want to end up buying off-road wheels and having to mod it just to be sufficient for off-road needs.

Personally, I suspect that I'll have to modify the V14 suspension with longer stanchions and adjusted suspension linkage to match, just so that I can have excellent off-road capability. 85mm travel has proven to be ideal for street riders and I suspect that their influence has already compromised the off-road design decisions in the V14.

By Jason's post, it does appear that,

I find it interesting that it's a stanchion problem as opposed to a linkage problem. Any problem is disappointing but it feels like progress, as all other suspension issues on other wheels have largely been with linkage design and fabrication choices. Hopefully this means proper evolution.

first lets clarify that travel distance doesnt play any role without taking in consideration travel of shock absorber,

 

everyone from you is just fooled my marketing department of euc manufacturers.

 

you can enlarge stanchions travel by any amount, BUT if your shock absorber remains 200mm*55mm travel, you ll have absolutely same bad suspension,

so s18,s19,v14 etc. are same crap from different buckets, and yes they are not made for extreme.

 

spring works like a battery that acumulates energy, that is later dissipated by oil. so s22 that is well reassmbled and tightened will be good extreme wheel cause it has larger shock absorber 240*75mm with larger travel distance 130mm

 

so v14 with crappy old 200*55mm shock is nothing but fake and bait for ppl that dont understand how suspension works

[Planemo]

17 minutes ago, ORDO NOVUS said:

will be good extreme wheel cause it has larger shock absorber 240*75mm with larger travel distance 130mm

Your post doesn't make much sense. My MTB uses 'only' a 65mm stroke but has 160mm travel.

55mm stroke shocks are fairly standard on 150mm travel MTB's.

So both the above examples run shorter shocks than your 75mm but still have more wheel travel.

Ergo, shock stroke doesn't bear any real relevance to wheel travel when linkages are employed.

[ORDO NOVUS]

15 minutes ago, Planemo said:

Your post doesn't make much sense. My MTB uses 'only' a 65mm stroke but has 160mm travel.

55mm stroke shocks are fairly standard on 150mm travel MTB's.

So both the above examples run shorter shocks than your 75mm but still have more wheel travel.

Ergo, shock stroke doesn't bear any real relevance to wheel travel when linkages are employed.

you are totally wrong. First of all, you should learn what is castor and that is why your bike experince is irrelevant here.

then, realize when you hit  bump, suspension has to absorb certain amount of energy.

on 240*75mm absorber you can choose softer spring and get smoother experience on small bumps because of easiness of initial effort WITHOUT sacrificing total amount of energy that can be acumulated by coil and then dissipated by bigger amount of oil. On hard drop you can install coil that will allow you not to bottom out and feel ok.

 

tl;dr 240*75 shock is better than 200*55 both for smooth ride and hard drops

Edited December 1, 2023 by ORDO NOVUS

[Planemo]

1 minute ago, ORDO NOVUS said:

you are totally wrong. First of all, you should learn what is castor and that is why your bike experince is irrelevant here.

When someone posts a pic of a McPherson strut in order to support their argument about rising rate linkage systems I know I'm wasting my time.

1 minute ago, ORDO NOVUS said:

tl;dr 240*75 shock is better than 200*55 both for smooth ride and hard drops

Nope. All depends how the linkage is designed.

[ORDO NOVUS]

Just now, Planemo said:

When someone posts a pic of a McPherson strut in order to support their argument about rising rate linkage systems I know I'm wasting my time.

Nope. All depends how the linkage is designed.

it was shown to make u understand that you know absolutely nothing if you are comparing behaviour of suspension with caster and without it.