Police offers just told me it's 500$+ fine to ride EUC?

[RoboFixIt]

I was just picking up some Chipotle here when 2 cops come in line and say I could get a fine for riding anywhere in town even Bike Paths? Then they said I could only drive on private property and all I could say is "I never heard that before... Thank you officer"

Anyway I got it on video maybe I should upload it but I think it's BS?

[Cerbera]

55 minutes ago, ElectronxCycles said:

Anyway I got it on video maybe I should upload it but I think it's BS?

I don't think it is BS. I suspect he's right.

We don't have the numbers yet to demand legality, and most Government agencies find it much easier and more convenient to just globally ban something on public highways than create or alter an existing a regulation structure to accommodate it. I read the other day that it was recently 'officially' confirmed that they are illegal for street use in all states across America too, which must be hugely depressing for all those that live there and have been doing it so freely for so long ! How much difference that makes to people's decision to ride or not is another thing altogether. But at the moment, the vast majority of us, I would say, are relying 100% on police discretion or them having better things to do than go after EUC riders. I am horribly aware that could change overnight. There was already a crackdown on PEVs in my home town the other day that I only managed to avoid by being tipped off beforehand by someone who had already been stopped, and threatened with confiscation !

They are not legal here either in the UK, and I hate not being able to get insurance, and not being able to demonstrate to authorities that I can reliably do this safely and considerately, or at least AS safely as bicycles and motorbikes. We also need them to stop only legalising machines that have pathetic, fun-killing speed limits imposed as well - that is not the case for any other class of vehicle, and shouldn't be for us either. We should be accountable, like everyone else, for the speed we are doing in the circumstances we are doing it, not by what the maximum possible speed of our units might be. Grumble grumble - it's a horrible state of affairs and I don't like it ! 

Edited October 22, 2022 by Cerbera

[techyiam]

2 hours ago, ElectronxCycles said:

I was just picking up some Chipotle here when 2 cops come in line and say I could get a fine for riding anywhere in town even Bike Paths? Then they said I could only drive on private property

Did this take place in Vancouver, or somewhere else? In other word, were they Vancouver Police, or RCMP officers? 

I don't know about the $500, but euc's are considered illegal vehicles off private properties.

The BC provincial pilot project for six regions for electric scooters don't include euc's. 

Hence, they can write you for operating an illegal vehicle on public roads, bike paths, or in bike lanes. But unlike e-bikes over 500 W, I think  euc's are not illegal offroad. 

However, I thought the police wasn't going to enforce the law. I have ridden by and stopped next to police cruisers all the time, and none have bat an eye.

I hope there haven't been a change in enforcement policy, recently.

Buying and modding a Rover 6 Plus is starting to look more attractive. Importing a powerful e-bike is now illegal since Feb. 2021, even for off-road use, in Canada. It is a federal law.

This really bad news.

Edited October 22, 2022 by techyiam

[techyiam]

Did anyone else in greater Vancouver got warned or ticketed recently? 

This could spell big trouble for EEVEES if police start enforcing the law.

[David 1200]

I’m in the military and I go on base a lot with my EUC…… let me tell you they did not like me. I used to get stopped all the time. Every single time they stopped me they didn’t know what they were stopping me for. They would always let me go in the end regardless of how it went. …. Finally after 10+ times it came down to stay on the sidewalk and wear proper protection and we will leave you alone.

[Tawpie]

2 hours ago, Cerbera said:

I read the other day that it was recently 'officially' confirmed that they are illegal for street use in all states across America

Oh golly, I hope not. Do you recall where you read this?

[Cerbera]

Yeah, it was here, which has been notably amended since I Reddit (no pun intended). Still not exactly good news, but slightly less awful than an outright ban and impending enforcement.

Edited October 22, 2022 by Cerbera

[David 1200]

23 minutes ago, Cerbera said:

Yeah, it was here, which has been notably amended since I Reddit (no pun intended). Still not exactly good news, but slightly less awful than an outright ban and impending enforcement.

You had me worried for a second…. Did some quick research and the three sources I looked at were saying that EUCs can go pretty much anywhere a bicycle can go

[RoboFixIt]

2 hours ago, techyiam said:

Did this take place in Vancouver, or somewhere else? In other word, were they Vancouver Police, or RCMP officers? 

Right down town Vancouver BC, not sure if it was RCMP though, I will check my GoPro 360 footage and find out later. I just got new lend covers moments ago so the video should be good quality.

Anyway I had no idea what to say at the time and I was a little shocked to be confronted by the cops at Chipotle while I was ordering a burrito lol

Edited October 22, 2022 by ElectronxCycles

[Tawpie]

1 hour ago, Cerbera said:

Yeah, it was here, which has been notably amended since I Reddit (no pun intended). Still not exactly good news, but slightly less awful than an outright ban and impending enforcement.

In the State of Washington, the State Legislature had to deal with EUCs because, well, Shane Chen was based here. As of 2015 (I think), low powered single wheeled self balancing vehicles are classified as Electric Personal Assistive Mobility Devices and are allowed by state law on roads with speed limits under 35 mph with local jurisdictions free to restrict them further. High powered ones (3 hp) are outside the definition of an EPAMD and because they're not specifically included as EPAMDs, are in a gray area. But the language used to add EUCs to the EPAMD definition is quite clear: if they're not an EPAMD, they are unregulated and can be ridden wherever and whenever, subject to local law. Most localities don't have time to deal with a bunch of loonies on circus toys.

As to operating an unlicensed unregistered motor vehicle on public roads, state law says we're allowed to drive unlicensed off road vehicles on most low-speed-limit public roads so the Reddit post isn't "quite" accurate.

Fun thing about the US is that "states rights" is a big deal. We like to be able to make our own rules for our own state, or county, or town. It's rather chaotic, but it's how we've rolled since 1776.

But wow, I really hope Vancouver isn't going to enforce their existing ban. That would mean I have to (gawd) walk. Or pedal a bicycle around the seawall. Good thing I bring a car.

Edited October 22, 2022 by Tawpie

[gon2fast]

3 hours ago, ElectronxCycles said:

I should upload it

No, the less press the better right now. 

And the ding dong that wrote that Reddit posting knows nothing of Fight Club rules...

[Cerbera]

Somebody should start a religion we could all subscribe to, where it could be one of our sacred and most treasured 'rituals' is to ride EUCs to the glory of the great whatever in the sky. I wonder how far the free right to practice religion would extend ?

'' Yes officer, I am just conducting the EUCharist !"

 

Edited October 22, 2022 by Cerbera

[techyiam]

1 hour ago, Tawpie said:

Good thing I bring a car.

Nah, you have a Sherman. Put your Mten3 in a backpack and ride up. If you ride your mten3 around the seawall, pretty sure, no park ranger will bother you. 

[techyiam]

1 hour ago, ElectronxCycles said:

Anyway I had no idea what to say at the time and I was a little shocked to be confronted by the cops at Chipotle while I was ordering a burrito lol

That is pretty odd. I usually ride pass by some Vancouver police officers, I will learn the hard way soon enough.

Edited October 22, 2022 by techyiam

[RoboFixIt]

4 hours ago, techyiam said:

Did this take place in Vancouver, or somewhere else? In other word, were they Vancouver Police, or RCMP officers? 

Finally looking over the 360 footage here and they had an RCMP badge

[alcatraz]

If you've got annoying police around then I suggest to ride a (physically) smaller wheel on the sidewalks. If you come on a Begode Master to a new area you're more likely to get in trouble.

You can get one later or ride one where the police aren't. If you have to ride in the city then ride something that looks innocent. V8 Tesla 18XL etc. It would take one hell of a cruel officer to fine you for riding that on the sidewalk. 

After there are other riders you can start upgrading slowly. 

Edited October 22, 2022 by alcatraz

[alcatraz]

Shermans, S22s, Commanders, Masters, T4s are the wheels that will be in the eyes of law enforcement first.

[techyiam]

6 minutes ago, ElectronxCycles said:

Finally looking over the 360 footage here and they had an RCMP badge

Thank you.

That is really good news. I don't have to get an e-bike after all. 🙂

I have a hunch that your incident has to with this particular couple of RCMP officers. I was at UBC stopped at a red light right next to an RCMP cruiser, waiting for the light to turn green. Nothing happened.

Whew, that got me worried. Big fast wheels are now back on the table. 🙂

[RoboFixIt]

14 minutes ago, alcatraz said:

If you've got annoying police around then I suggest to ride a (physically) smaller wheel on the sidewalks. If you come on a Begode Master to a new area you're more likely to get in trouble.

You can get one later or ride one where the police aren't. If you have to ride in the city then ride something that looks innocent. V8 Tesla 18XL etc. It would take one hell of a cruel officer to fine you for riding that on the sidewalk. 

Good idea yeah I'm going to go back to using the s18

[The Brahan Seer]

My local police had seen me around for a while, then one day they decided to stop me. They told me the rules etc which I said I understood and I pleaded my case by  saying I'm like an ambassador, I ride respectfully, I'm 53 and responsible. Wish I could get insurance, registered etc but not possible etc etc. Have full bike licence, wear all the gear, helmet. He asked how fast my wheel could go and I told him the truth. I gave them all my details. They said they would prefer I ride out with the main roads as much as possible, and as long as they don't get any complaints then they will turn a blind eye. Of course that was only one officer and not traffic police which fortunately we don't see in my neck of the woods very often. 3200 miles (5000kms) on and all seems well.  

[techyiam]

Thanks for posting your video. 

They are certainly Vancouver Police. Watch your time stamped video below st 0.25 playback speed.

They said they gave you a fair warning. Not good. 

This is really bad news. It is possible that they will start enforcing the law from now on. Unfortunately, in BC, there isn't a specific law for this. So they treat this as an illegal motor vehicle operating on public road without insurance. This is not right because euc's cannot do anywhere as much damage as a 6000 lbs. SUV, for example.

I am surprised, since BC provincial government wants to reduce carbon footprint, and have started a pilot project to see whether PEV'S are viable. Unfortunately, when the program was finally introduced, they only listed electric kick scooters, and not the other PEV'S, that they initially talked about. E-bikes are under a different law, and are legal already. So the intent was there, but the government did not explicitly include euc's. But I thought it could be fine as long as they don't enforce the law to the letter, after all, euc's are PEV's.

It really such a big shame, since the law is not evidence based. Euc's are only illegal because euc's are not explicitly written in law to be legal. In other words, every new type of motorized vehicle are illegal because the government has not got to it to say they are legal.

Euc's are not illegal because of the accidents and property damages statistics, or that they dangerous to rider or to others.

Set playback speed to 0.25.

 

[PLEASE_DELETE]

Deleted.

Edited March 17 by PLEASE_DELETE

[Funky]

1 hour ago, /Dev/Null said:

The whole world/laws make NO SENSE.  We are doomed to eventually get wiped out by climate change as we are encouraged to keep driving our fossil fuel based, large multi-thousand pound vehicles rather than ride a 60 pound electric wheel, because it isn't "licensed/insured".  It's ridiculous.  I have no hope for humanity as they focus on the wrong things completley.

 You don't say? World and laws makes no sense.. Laws mostly are made by rich and in power, to get richer and more powerful. But poor get poorer and have less say in their own life. The whole world is ducked up.. Most of us already know that. - Sadly you can't do anything to change that. Follow everything told like sheeps or get punished.

 

Time to time i simply wanna die. Because world and everything is dumb/unfair/pointless.  I personally don't have any "dreams/goals" and don't give a shit about anything anymore..  Sorry my suicidal feelings are showing again...

Edited October 22, 2022 by Funky

[Cerbera]

7 hours ago, The Brahan Seer said:

They told me the rules etc which I said I understood and I pleaded my case by  saying I'm like an ambassador, I ride respectfully, I'm 53 and responsible. Wish I could get insurance, registered etc but not possible etc etc.

Yes, this. We should all do this ! 

[Cerbera]

2 hours ago, /Dev/Null said:

Does anyone else find this whole discussion discouraging?

Not discouraging, in that it's not going to put me off, just depressing.

2 hours ago, /Dev/Null said:

The whole world/laws make NO SENSE.  We are doomed to eventually get wiped out by climate change as we are encouraged to keep driving our fossil fuel based, large multi-thousand pound vehicles rather than ride a 60 pound electric wheel, because it isn't "licensed/insured".  It's ridiculous.  I have no hope for humanity as they focus on the wrong things completely.

They don't make any sense, but as the few proponents of a new and largely unknown method of transport, we should perhaps expect it. Law catches up very slowly, unless it is Government, infringing on human rights, and then it goes remarkably quickly !

I'll never forget that the first cars in Britain had to be preceded by a man on foot holding a red flag, and if a horse was coming the other way, the car driver was to entirely disassemble his vehicle and conceal its parts in adjacent foliage so as not to frighten the horse as it passed. We can laugh about that now, but it's not so different to Government's attitude towards the likes of us currently, and before us drone pilots, who are now regulated into the ground, and nearly all the fun has been sucked out of that hobby by pointless bureaucracy. That happened because even though we did have the numbers, we didn't refuse to cooperate enough, and just accepted licensing, and a whole load of largely punitive restrictions that were sponsored by lobby groups whose personal interest it was to keep hobbyists out of the airspace they wanted for their commercial flight highways, that as yet haven't happened ! I've still got my drone, but it's no fun to use it any more.

But I am damned if I am going to let them take EUCing away from me as well. As I'm sure many of you know, once you start, it's a lifestyle thing and you simply have to keep doing it !

So I'll do everything I can to do it well, and safely and considerately, but one thing I am not going to do is not do it at all.