Police offers just told me it's 500$+ fine to ride EUC?

[zer0dayexploit]

6 hours ago, eevees said:

We are getting news coverage on this because it turns out that riding on the sidewalk is only a $81 fine so police are essentially encouraging us to ride on the sidewalk which is much more dangerous to public safety. I've attached a copy of the segment on CKNW. Daily Hive is also picking up the story. Listen here: https://www.facebook.com/532110631/videos/3507940889418582/

Thank you! I just listened to the whole interview. You stated its safety and benefits fantastically. You put across a really good image and encouraged the general rider community to keep riding safely and keep them approved and accepted by the general public.

Edited July 12, 2023 by zer0dayexploit

[winterwheel]

What people here don't get, and I know this is beating a dead horse, but dressing in full gear and riding around in public makes wheelers look like menaces to society. Great that it makes the riders feel themselves to be safe, but to many in the public this makes us look like we are engaging in a super dangerous activity around cars, pedestrians, small children etc. It does not help make the case for legalization.

 

[zer0dayexploit]

3 hours ago, winterwheel said:

What people here don't get, and I know this is beating a dead horse, but dressing in full gear and riding around in public makes wheelers look like menaces to society. Great that it makes the riders feel themselves to be safe, but to many in the public this makes us look like we are engaging in a super dangerous activity around cars, pedestrians, small children etc. It does not help make the case for legalization.

 

Actually that’s a pretty interesting take and I’d say I agree with a small exception.
 

Full face helmet makes perfect sense because there’s no handlebars and if we fall, chin hits the ground. Gloves and knee pads make sense for the same reason. When the rider visually appears like a power ranger however it seems to “look” faster or riskier to others. I can’t bash people for wearing protective gear but I think making it look more casual/less intense with the same amount of protection would play a role. 
 

I think it has very little to do with the overall public perception though. Being courteous, not speeding past cyclists, leaving room when passing, signalling and stopping at every moment necessary, and informing people of the practicality of these devices is far more effective. And if you dress like a power ranger, ensure that those who ask you about unicycling know that extensive gear is your preference, not a requirement, and that wheels are safe, reliable and come in many smaller/slower/less gear dependent forms. You never know who is/knows a cop, a lawmaker, a future ambassador or someone who’s had a bad encounter with another unicyclist.

[0000]

3 hours ago, winterwheel said:

Great that it makes the riders feel themselves to be safe, but to many in the public this makes us look like we are engaging in a super dangerous activity around cars, pedestrians, small children etc. It does not help make the case for legalization.

Wait a minute, are you saying we shouldn't be wearing gear on the off-chance that years later some totally rational and altruistic group of politicians might grace us mere peasants subjects citizens with their unbiased consideration and hand down, from on high, a writ of permission to travel unnaccosted atop our micro-vessels on our own public roads? I think you may be harboring some misconceptions about certain political realities we all live with.

Politics aside, if you're riding with or through traffic, you are almost by definition, engaged in a dangerous activity. The risk is inherent to the tech because of the possibility of experiencing a cut-out, electrical failure or otherwise. If a cutout occurs at any significant amount of speed, the rider is going to the ground and could possibly get run over depending where/when it happens. You can't undangerous that, you can only take steps to mitigate risk, gear obviously being one of those mitigation factors.

I've personally saved myself from numerous injuries to hands, forearms/elbows, chest, knees, feet, and even eyes (branches) thanks to a religious adherence to gear. I've also startled a few people here and there who weren't expecting to run into a power ranger on their hike. If it's between my safety and their comfort, it's no contest, my safety comes first. Plus kids love seeing real life power rangers and that's always fun to experience.

[zer0dayexploit]

3 hours ago, Vanturion said:

Wait a minute, are you saying we shouldn't be wearing gear on the off-chance that years later some totally rational and altruistic group of politicians might grace us mere peasants subjects citizens with their unbiased consideration and hand down, from on high, a writ of permission to travel unnaccosted atop our micro-vessels on our own public roads? I think you may be harboring some misconceptions about certain political realities we all live with.

Politics aside, if you're riding with or through traffic, you are almost by definition, engaged in a dangerous activity. The risk is inherent to the tech because of the possibility of experiencing a cut-out, electrical failure or otherwise. If a cutout occurs at any significant amount of speed, the rider is going to the ground and could possibly get run over depending where/when it happens. You can't undangerous that, you can only take steps to mitigate risk, gear obviously being one of those mitigation factors.

I've personally saved myself from numerous injuries to hands, forearms/elbows, chest, knees, feet, and even eyes (branches) thanks to a religious adherence to gear. I've also startled a few people here and there who weren't expecting to run into a power ranger on their hike. If it's between my safety and their comfort, it's no contest, my safety comes first. Plus kids love seeing real life power rangers and that's always fun to experience.

No that’s not at all what I’m saying. I’m saying please wear your gear, as much as you need. I’m making a guess that when people look like power rangers, it looks intimidating/fast. For example, I can choose to wear a motocross jersey over my chest/elbow pads so it looks more like I’m wearing a regular shirt, but keeping the same protection. Motorcycle jeans with integrated knee pads look casual but offer fantastic protection. Choices that are identical in safety, but visually less jarring to a bystander/policeman that may perceive you as “prepared for speed”

 

I am a massive advocate for proper gear. Looking bubble wrapped vs looking casual (and keeping padding hidden or covered etc) gives the general appearance that what is being done is really not as risky, fast or dangerous.

For example: would you drive in somebody else’s car if they asked you to put a helmet, 5 point harness and racing gloves on just to go down the road? I would personally be a bit hesitant.

On the other hand, a car stuffed full of safety proofing, airbags and reinforcements offers the same protection in everyday driving, but to a passenger or spectator, the car seems a fair bit less risky, intimidating or race focused.

the same safety, but styled differently. 
I maybe interact with one or two people a day through conversation about my wheel, but at least 150+ people SEE me riding every day, that’s why that impression matters. 

 

As for weaving in and out of traffic that is not at all what I meant. When I said passing, I was referring to cyclists in cycle lanes and smaller roads. I tend to avoid riding on more car focused roads unless necessary, and if I am able to keep with traffic. If I am in traffic I am obviously not riding dumb, and am turning off to the nearest side street as soon as possible. 

Edited July 12, 2023 by zer0dayexploit

[Cerbera]

I tend to take every opportunity I can to 'dress down' and at least wear some sort of coat over all my armour in order not to emphasise it, but for most of the Summer it's just too hot to do it, so then I do find myself in full Stormtrooper mode for all to see (please let's not call us Power Rangers, the shittest of all the superheroes / armour wearing icons !).

I agree with @winterwheel that this has a polarising effect, and the reaction I get from the people I see varies quite widely. A lot of people think it's quite cool, and some feel a need to tell me that, more occasionally someone from the older generations will comment that 'it's about time' we see people dressed up properly for what they are doing, and some find the whole look / setup laughably ridiculous, and the more nervous members of the pedestrian public (those sweet old ladies you see about particularly) do seem more apprehensive, the more of it is on show. It also signals to police and authorities that we are taking safety seriously, but again, a corollary is that the axe swings both ways, and you stand out more to them in the first place...

I think it doesn't help with the 'angry dogs' problem either, but I suspect the helmet more in that case.

I had a black and white thing going on with clothes long before my wheels and armour came along, but occasionally I do find myself wishing I'd gone for the black variants of my body-kit. But then again, I am better seen by traffic and people alike in all that white, which is probably good for safety, so it's swings and roundabouts...

 

Edited July 12, 2023 by Cerbera

[techyiam]

Most  of the year, I don't dress like a power ranger.

The two most common questions I get asked are, how fast does it go? Or, isn't it dangerous to ride that thing?

The problem that I see is many people have already have seen how fast they go. It wasn't like that even a year ago.

When I tell them that it goes like an e-bike, they don't seem to believe me. 

[Mango]

Yes, during the last year, more people have commented to me that they have seen riders blitzing down roads at high speeds. People (and police) are catching on.

I've seen myself a lot of Sherman riders, but now I am seeing EX30 riders. Mostly the same usual suspect of riders.

Whenever I am asked how fast my wheel goes, I just say 25km/h.

[techyiam]

Frankly, I found the talk show interviews clear up a few things that I didn't know before.

Basically, if one rides on bike paths, bike routes, etc, a rider doesn't have to worry about getting ticketed.

Riders who ride on main roads, especially near the downtown core, are the most at risk of getting a ticket,

As stipulated in the pilot project, electric scooters are not allowed to be ridden on main roads. 

 

I don't drive anymore so I don't see how others ride? Where I ride, I rarely see another rider on a wheel. 

Have many riders already migrated to main roads? The other day, I saw someone on a wheel riding along Cambie crossing 37th Ave. I couldn't believe it. I was on 37th, which is a designated bike route. Cambie is one of the major arteries with no bike lanes along that stretch. No wonder someone got a ticket there.

 

It makes more sense now why police have never bothered with me. I don't go on main roads unless it is basically empty at specific locations and times.

 

 

 

Edited July 12, 2023 by techyiam

[Cerbera]

1 hour ago, techyiam said:

Have many riders already migrated to main roads?

When I started off on lowlier wheels I steered clear of all roads, pretty much without exception, except to cross them. Now I am on a much bigger, faster, more capable machine I am increasingly tempted to add 'some roads' to the list of places I consider it acceptable to be, and that is because now I feel like I have a machine that can hold its own there, or at least move amongst traffic in the same capacity as a cyclist would. But until a legal class is established for us I know I am safest from undue attention from authorities if I am on pavements and cycleways. So for the daily town runs, that's where I mostly stay. However, since the new wheel, on days where I am feeling unusually 'brave' I will now take on those long country back roads where you'll only expect to meet a car every 5 mins or so, if that, in the pursuit of longer, more ambitious, more interesting rides.

At the weekend I normally head up to the local country park via the cycle path out of town. On the way out of town there is a main road, with fast traffic on it, but with a dedicated cycle lane, next to some of the worst pavement to be found in the local area. Here the law is working in opposition to safety, so I maintain exactly equal cognitive dissonance about where I am best placed here. Safest is in the cycle lane where the road is smooth and predictable, NOT on the hideously bumpy and overgrown pavement there. Yet if I would like police to continue to ignore me, I have to be on the rubbish pavement. Sometimes I take the risk (mainly if the road behind me is empty when I start) and other times I chicken out and put up with the potholes.

At the end of the day the law has already chosen 'neither' as the answer, and although I'm sure all of us would like the option to be on roads, cycleways AND pavements, depending on what is clearest / safest at the time, I doubt the law will give us anything like that range of choice as it evolves, if any choice at all !

Edited July 12, 2023 by Cerbera

[techyiam]

On 7/12/2023 at 8:46 AM, Cerbera said:

At the end of the day the law has already chosen 'neither' as the answer, and although I'm sure all of us would like the option to be on roads, cycleways AND pavements, depending on what is clearest / safest at the time, I doubt the law will give us anything like that range of choice as it evolves, if any choice at all !

In Canada, federally, without the sufficiently high  numbers of euc riders out there, I don't foresee the federal government regulating electric wheels. In other words, in Schedule III of the Canada Motor Vehicle Safety Act, it would be unlikely to see another class of vehicles created to add electric wheels. 

This then brings us to the provincial government. In BC, the provincial Motor Vehicle Act basically deems every motorized vehicle illegal unless it is explicitly permitted and regulated by the Act. Hence, automatically, electric wheels are illegal because the BC provincial law makers haven't gotten around to it yet.

What I like to see is for the provincial government to classified electric wheels the same way they are regulating electric scooters now. In this way, the police then has no need to resort to giving out the "no insurance to operate a motor vehicle on public roads" ticket.

 

Edited July 21, 2023 by techyiam

[winterwheel]

For the record, as many here already know, I wear zero gear. And miracle of miracles, in my sixth year of daily riding I haven't had a reason to change that. In fact I feel I have no choice but to *NOT* wear gear to counteract the public perception generated by the many "power rangers" in our community.

Don't get me me wrong. I don't begrudge people some people wearing gear if that floats their boat. I don't think it makes them safer but that's just me. 

What I do begrudge is the endless nattering at those who don't wear gear that they should. This is so f***ing counter productive to the overall goal of getting us legal.

[Funky]

3 minutes ago, winterwheel said:

For the record, as many here already know, I wear zero gear. And miracle of miracles, in my sixth year of daily riding I haven't had a reason to change that. In fact I feel I have no choice but to *NOT* wear gear to counteract the public perception generated by the many "power rangers" in our community.

Don't get me me wrong. I don't begrudge people some people wearing gear if that floats their boat. I don't think it makes them safer but that's just me. 

What I do begrudge is the endless nattering at those who don't wear gear that they should. This is so f***ing counter productive to the overall goal of getting us legal.

Question: How fast you normally go? 

I normally wear only wrist guards, when riding to job and around city..(2-4km trips) But same time i go quit a bit slower, than i usually do at "fun" rides.

[winterwheel]

My top speed most days is is the 48-42 range.

48-52

[Funky]

Just now, winterwheel said:

My top speed most days is is the 48-42 range.

48-52

km/h right? Dam that's to fast even for my liking.  

[winterwheel]

1 minute ago, Funky said:

km/h right? Dam that's to fast even for my liking.  

Yes. That's been my speed window almost right from the start. On bike paths I'm a bit slower but parts of my commute are on roads; on those parts I push it a bit to keep my spacing with traffic.

[zer0dayexploit]

Damn no gloves even? I’m not a gear fanatic but that would just feel weird for me. 

[Funky]

13 minutes ago, winterwheel said:

Yes. That's been my speed window almost right from the start. On bike paths I'm a bit slower but parts of my commute are on roads; on those parts I push it a bit to keep my spacing with traffic.

And how many times have you fallen? Or have flown like a superman?

I have had only one crash, where i flew like a bird about ~3 meters landing on belly.(Wheel turned 90 degree sideways in sand..) Luckily i was riding in 20km/h speeds and on sandy road - so no damage.

Can't imagine what would happen at ~50km/h speeds and on asphalt.  Hands alone would have been gone for weeks.. As your skin would been scraped off the palms. (If you land on hands that is.. If not then maybe nose gone.)

[winterwheel]

Falling and flying like superman are what people do when they strap on max gear and ride big wheels without fear or caution. I am not one of those people. 

 

[Funky]

17 minutes ago, winterwheel said:

Falling and flying like superman are what people do when they strap on max gear and ride big wheels without fear or caution. I am not one of those people. 

 

Aside from that sandy fall. (I even knew i will fall that day. Because i was going off-road and in pretty deep sand. Wheel was going left right all the time. Almost riding like on ice.)

I'm also not one of those people.. Doh at some point your EUC will stop working. That will be the day - you will regret your choice.

 I can't imagine falling in daily ride on smooth asphalt also. As i don't take any risks and ride pretty defensively. Heck i even ride much slower, when i don't gear up. But when wheel stops working suddenly? What then?

 

Edited July 13, 2023 by Funky

[Mango]

1 hour ago, winterwheel said:

My top speed most days is is the 48-42 range.

48-52

25 km/hr is my limit with no gear, even then I'm riding on familiar routes where I know where all the potholes and hidden dangers lurk.
 

Anything above that speed, you're looking at moderate road rash at a minimum. Accidents are just that, unplanned dismounts 😜

[zer0dayexploit]

haha @winterwheel’s basically just saying “I’m built different”

[Funky]

12 hours ago, zer0dayexploit said:

haha @winterwheel’s basically just saying “I’m built different”

He just doesn't care, if wheel will stop working one day.  

If i knew wheel will not fail me at all. I would not wear any gear at all. But back in my mind - i always know any moment something can die in my wheel, battery, motherboard, hall sensor... And that will make me crash.

I never leave my home without wrist guards, because i know - i will land on my hands when i fall. At those slower speeds.. Simply because i will try to run out of the fall and then land on my belly/hands. 5 second to put them on are worth it VS having no hands for weeks, as all palms are scraped and hurting to do anything.

As for helmet and knee guards (rest of my "gear"). Those i only use for "fun/faster" rides.

Edited July 14, 2023 by Funky

[Mango]

18 hours ago, Funky said:

if wheel will stop working one day

A2 gifted by Begode to influencer cut out at 15mph. Riders suffers two broken bones and dislocation in ankle area.

[Funky]

1 hour ago, Mango said:

A2 gifted by Begode to influencer cut out at 15mph. Riders suffers two broken bones and dislocation in ankle area.

That's Begode - who cares.. Begode riders are used to it by now.

Edited July 15, 2023 by Funky