NeprisFin Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I have been asking from forum users via private messages what wheels they prefer or recommend. I have been emailing sellers about specifics of their EUC's. I have googled reviews, youtube videos and specifications so much that my employer started to question my work motivation and my wife started questioning me on why I'm spending all my time with my mobile. Combined I have ruined things at work and at home and I haven't even started to ride yet! I feel that it has been totally worth it and now I want to share my findings, tell you what I have decided to buy, from where and why (if anybody is interested). My use case and initial thoughts "I live in southern Finland so my few first months riding will be in snow ice and water. I will use the EUC for my daily trips to work and back (14km one way)." Finnish legislation says that EUC must have a motor of 1000W or smaller and its highest allowed speed is 25km/h. It is recommended that in the EUC there is front and back lights but also lights carried by the driver are allowed. Bigger wheel should mean more stability and comfort on a long trip. Biggest wheel that is tested in a big scale (a lot of users and a lot of experience about them written online) is 18" and the two most trusted brands seems to be Gotway and King Song. They both have 680wh battery version as I thought that would be sufficient for my needs and it would have enough reserve on a cold day when the capacity is lower. Gotway is the speed king but that is something that I cannot enjoy as the legislation limits the highest speed. Also Gotway does not have driving light of its own. Gotways safety is good I haven't heard about even one shutdown of death (SOD) case. King Song is investing pretty much to research and development and they want to be near the customers. For example they attended to CES fairs and Tina from King Song was replying to my emails which was super nice and made me feel wanted as a customer. King song has the needed lights. It's highest speed is over the 25km/h but it can be limited via the app (this is possible also with Gotway). Basically Gotway and King Song are pretty much neck and neck on my needs. King Song has the bluetooth speakers but I dont need them and actually its just another component that you need to seal from water and a component that can go broken. King song has the lights but with Gotway I can attach the lights to myself. The lights with king song is again one more component that can be broken and needs to be sealed from the elements. Battery dilemma with king song made my mind that I will buy a Gotway Msuper. In reality I dont think this is serious or a real problem in use but made another minus for King Song. You can read more about the issue from here: http://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/2554-ks-14-battery-configuration/ Where to buy? Next I just needed to figure out where to buy the EUC from. Excellent source for ideas is this thread: http://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/458-where-to-buy-incomplete-reseller-list/ My first thought for the matter was that I want to buy it as close as possible from the source. So I looked it up from aliexpress and ebay. Aliexpress did not accept paypal so that was that for me. Next stop was Ebay. From there I found one with a decent pricing but if I would buy it from there (with this particular seller) I would have had to pay the taxes and related fees if I were unlucky. While I was browsing ebay I stumbled to a King Song being sold by Gyroroue Shop in France. This would rule out the taxes and related fees AND I would get 24 month warranty for the device and 12 months for the battery. This was the time I made the decision to buy the King Song over the Gotway that I originally decided to buy as it was EASIER and cheaper for me although I still had my doubts with the device itself. If my doubts would become reality there would be the warranty to manage the risk. With Gotway there would not be that kind of risk management in place or atleast not within the same price range. In France there is also another reseller but their webshop is made with Prestashop and they still had the default theme on it. That does not look professional to me so I chose the before mentioned Gyroroue Shop. TL;DR WHAT!? King Song 18" KS-18A EUC WHERE!? Gyroroue Shop France WHY!? 24 months warranty, professional looking webpage, generally trusted device with enough battery capacity and power. Additionally it was cheaper than the rival (within EU). Where are we now? I ordered the item few hours ago (this morning). I am now waiting to get the device to Finland and start learning to drive with it. Sidetrack driving clothes / equipment I ordered black elbow pads, knee pads, a onesie with Batman logo on it as a driving overall/suit and Emerson FAST helmet with face mask, rails for flashlights, NVG gopro mount and a helmet cover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mich Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Sounds like you are quite adventurous, first EUC, riding will be in snow ice and water :-) . I live in Prague, when there is a snow in the streets (usually two weeks in a year), I'll switch from bike to public transit. A few days ago, I was dealing with the same problem, which EUC to buy and where. I've decided to order Gotway MCM4 from china for several reasons. 1. it's quite a bit cheaper 2. i don't really care about warranty, because it doesn't cover crashes :-( 3. I can use the money i save to buy another EUC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DS Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Hey @NeprisFin, Good choice and you did quite a deep research before. I'm in a process to look where to buy KS14 800W from and being also in the EU-zone I'm in a similar situation as you. Because currently in China is holiday season, can you share a little more of your experience with Tina from King Song: 1. Do they sell directly to the costumers? 2. If yes, are their offers with more competitive price tags than from resellers? 3. How do they offer to ship and do they offer prepaid tax shipping with a forward company (tax and custom are included in the shipping price)? 4, What is their return policy, warranty and after sale customer support? Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeprisFin Posted February 8, 2016 Author Share Posted February 8, 2016 Hi @DS, They dont normally sell directly but if your country does not have a reseller they can do an exception. The price is quite a lot cheaper but they do not have much choise on payment methods, and I understood that they dont have taxes included to the price. I dont know how they support you after the sale and I dont know about their warranty or return policy. @mich congrats on your MCM4! It was one of my picks too until I decided that I need a bigger wheel for my daily 28km (combined) ride. I busted my knee a year ago badly so I had to give up my dreams about making a comeback and going pro in thaiboxing. I guess this EUC business in snow and ice (or just water currently) is my substitute for the thrills or adventures Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DS Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Thank you @NeprisFin and hey...seems like you are extreme rider...don't forget to use extreme protective gear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeprisFin Posted February 8, 2016 Author Share Posted February 8, 2016 Hah! You are welcome @DS Im not an extreme rider. Just your everyday wannabe EUC commuter on his batman suit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonopanic Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 i live in germany and i think, there is no Official KS Base yet. The france prices from the official base there are higher than from a shop in germany. So i fight with me to buy from oversea. My choice is the KS16, there is a nice preorder price from the factory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DS Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 41 minutes ago, Sonopanic said: there is a nice preorder price from the factory. I have not heard of KS16 factory preorder, only Milbay Australia I think is doing that. But in any case be prepared for loooong wait...new products are easily announced but hard to get into real production. I was also considering at some point to wait for KS16 but finally decided to stay on the proved upgraded line...and yesterday I've ordered KS14, 800W, 680Wh from Netherlands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonopanic Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 Is 14" not too small for the city ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DS Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 I'd say that 14" could be small for off road which I do not intend to do, but for the city...you are supposed to ride basically flat pavement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 1 hour ago, Sonopanic said: Is 14" not too small for the city ? Not really, even after about 2000km going around in Paris I haven't even once (unintentionally) found a pothole deep enough to through me off a 14" Gotway (depends of course also on the individual level of attention paying to the road). All being equal I would prefer 16", but I haven't any data point to suggest that this is a real issue. 1 hour ago, DS said: I'd say that 14" could be small for off road which I do not intend to do, but for the city...you are supposed to ride basically flat pavement. You must be kidding, or live in a different world... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeprisFin Posted February 10, 2016 Author Share Posted February 10, 2016 The wait - frustratos maximus They did not warn me. The longest wait of my life started as soon as I saw from the UPS tracking page that the holy grail of all electric vehicles has been picked up. Im updating the tracking page in avarage a few hundred times per hour and screaming of joy when there is an update. When there is no new information I'm ripping my hair and squirming in agony. The Black Hole for all that is good is located in Germany near the border of Holland. Not even the faint screams of my King song hollering "daddy help me". This 7th level of hell is called Herne-Boernig. Its an infamous place where people have lost their oculus rifts from the first patch for several hours. These poor souls of course died to the horrors of the wait. Now their ghosts wander and appear while you expect the least. They will tell you horrific stories of this place where the satans henchmen called UPS couriers drop their beloved cargo. My KS18A entered the nightmare called Herne-Boernigs yesterday just before 11:00. It has been running away from the grimreaper since then. No news so far. Over 24 hours. I can feel how my life is fading, the candle of my life getting darker... They did not warn me. Now I warn you.Train your mind - be ready for it. Get yourself ready for The Wait... ... Still no news... Must. Continue. Must. Be. Strong. For. The. Kids... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DS Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 16 minutes ago, Niko said: You must be kidding Kidding for what? What you say here: 17 minutes ago, Niko said: I haven't even once (unintentionally) found a pothole deep enough to through me off a 14" is the same what I say here: 1 hour ago, DS said: but for the city...you are supposed to ride basically flat pavement Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OliverH Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 4 hours ago, Sonopanic said: i live in germany and i think, there is no Official KS Base yet. The france prices from the official base there are higher than from a shop in germany. So i fight with me to buy from oversea. My choice is the KS16, there is a nice preorder price from the factory. Ask at http://www.electro-sport.de and http://www.scooterhelden.de. They get the KS from an official source with service included. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OliverH Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 2 hours ago, Sonopanic said: Is 14" not too small for the city ? A 14" should be perfect for the city. Small to take it on train/ bus, strong (in case of KS). I know people riding them on our tours (around 30 km). A 14" is very agile. A 16" and specially the 18" are more comfortable to ride on this tours and they've an advantage driving through bumps and over stony tracks. Some 16" and 18" EUs have bigger pedals which is also very comfortable (Firewheel/ MSuper). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 4 hours ago, DS said: Kidding for what? that in a city we are supposed to ride basically flat pavement. Quote What you say here: is the same what I say here: Not really. You say that in a city we are supposed to ride basically flat pavement. I say that in a city like Paris there are lots of curbs and potholes and also some heavy cobblestone (and other obstacles) you will ride over, where the majority of the potholes can be passed with a 14" wheel without falling. You might live in a place where this is not the case, i.e. a different world. To illustrate my point: I am almost certain that I would not use an 8" wheel in Paris, exactly because I don't ride over flat pavement all the time. Probably I would not even use a 10" wheel, and I am not even sure at all for a 12" wheel. As said above, everything else being equal (besides size), I would prefer 16" over 14" still for the very same reason. I don't like the extra weight which usually comes with 16" though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DS Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 OK, I got your point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DS Posted February 10, 2016 Share Posted February 10, 2016 4 hours ago, DS said: 14" could be small for off road which I do not intend to do, but for the city...you are supposed to ride basically flat pavement "Supposed to ride basically flat road" is in comparison of riding off road mentioned in the first part of my sentence. I didn't mean that in the cities the pavements are all flat, just that you can find more flat places to ride...anyway, we might have been lost in translation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeprisFin Posted February 12, 2016 Author Share Posted February 12, 2016 UPS came and brought my Ks just few hours ago. I just barely tried it but already I know that there will be quite a lot of training to do before I ride it to work. Two things bother me. One being that there is no cover for the USB port. All the dirt snow and water in the world can go there without protection. Other thing is that the plastic in the device is not like new there are some dirt and scratches. In the package there was no plastic protecting it. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted February 14, 2016 Share Posted February 14, 2016 On 12 February 2016 at 4:12 PM, NeprisFin said: UPS came and brought my Ks just few hours ago. I just barely tried it but already I know that there will be quite a lot of training to do before I ride it to work. Two things bother me. One being that there is no cover for the USB port. All the dirt snow and water in the world can go there without protection. Other thing is that the plastic in the device is not like new there are some dirt and scratches. In the package there was no plastic protecting it. Any thoughts? Mine came with a little plastic cover over the USB port which disappeared the first time I rode it - so you are not missing much! I, and I suspect most others, put tape over it to waterproof it. I keep meaning to look for, or make myself, a better fitting cover so I can actually use it ; just haven't got around to it yet! Of greater concern, from a waterproofing point of view, are the speaker grills and on/off button. Mine is the earlier model so I don't know if the waterproofing is better now - it is supposed to be? I have ridden through quite a few muddy puddles and, later, took it apart to investigate how to change a tyre. No dirt or mud had got into the battery or electronics compartments although there is a hole on my model in both sides of the battery compartment that the motor leads enter through (on one side) so you wouldn't want to go through a deep puddle. It is nowhere near anywhere the wheel throws mud. I think that rain falling on the top is a greater issue and fixable with an upturned plastic shopping bag over the top of the wheel:-) Certainly waterproofing, if you live anywhere like London (as I do and currently have a garden that looks like a rice field!) could do with being a lot better than it is on many wheels. I can't comment on the condition it arrived in, I picked mine up directly from @Jason McNeil and carried it home so I didn't need the packaging. I would not expect it to arrive scratched, however you are going to scratch it a more than a bit whilst learning so I wouldn't be too worried about it. You should fit protective bumper strips around anywhere it looks like might hit the ground to stop it getting too bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeprisFin Posted February 15, 2016 Author Share Posted February 15, 2016 Today was my first trip outside (I have been training inside my house). The temperature was nearly ideal for this. One degree below zero so the streets were frozen and not wet. I rode for 2km in 15minutes and fell twice. Every time I let uncertainty slip in to my head bad times will follow. First fall was head first so I made kind a like baseball jump and landed hands first. Luckily I was wearing good thick gloves. Second time I runned my fall off so I didnt lose my balance although I was off the EUC. I even got the device beeping so my speed must have been around 20km/h(?) Down hills are the worst, but overall this is so much fun. Because of my schedule at work I'm able to do my first trip to work on friday... Therefore I have still three whole days to practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeprisFin Posted February 15, 2016 Author Share Posted February 15, 2016 Oh oh oh! I have a video of both of my falls. Wanna see? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeprisFin Posted February 16, 2016 Author Share Posted February 16, 2016 The falls are definitely the salt in this I was able to remake my schedule so I drove to work today.14.36km in 1h 13mins 22secs average speed was 11,7km/h which is pretty good as I had to stop quite a few times. At first it was really hard to drive straight as the roads were so filled with ice and snow. I fell three times. My favourite was when I was going around 15km/h and my left pedal hit a frozen snow ball. I flew like a rag. It was awesome. My legs (thighs) hurt like I would have had a leg day at the gym. This really could be THE most fun way of keeping in shape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egbert Posted February 16, 2016 Share Posted February 16, 2016 I like your point of view, seams to be the view of ' thaiboxing ' and I would enjoy watching your 'vids of fall'. On my side I once fell trying to find out the maximum speed of my Gotway MSuper18, ignoring the alarm and now knowing the meaning of "PowerCutOff". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeprisFin Posted March 17, 2016 Author Share Posted March 17, 2016 Unfortunately the videos of me falling are rather boring because they were filmed using helmet camera. I haven't been in the forums for some time. While I've been gone I have learned how to ride and I don't fall anymore that often. Every now and then ice does still some tricks. Here is a video from today from my way to work. The trip took 43min 08sec, distance was 14km 320m and the average speed was 19,9km/h. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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