Ultimate EUC that can change the world.

[dongsoo]

Hi. My goal for writing this is to describe the EUC I really want in the hope EUC manufacturers make one.  I also believe this type of EUC can be used by people all over the globe to change the way we move, solve this planets problem of pollution and nuclear energy needs for cars.

 

Ok. In my opinion, the ideal euc is not that much different from inmotion v5f in both dimensions and weight.

The two feature that should be added to v5 is

1. Swappable battery.

Two 160wh swappable batteries will give 320wh of v5f, and it will let u take ur euc all over the world by plane.

2. Thicker, slip resistant tire.

Current v5f tire is too narrow. It easily slips by paint markings on the road. Also thicker tire will give more cushion for  better ride without suspension.

Ok. Many people probably has different specs for their ideal EUC so let me explain why this is ideal for universal common people' transportation.

1.  V5f's 15mph max speed is enough. What I am really saying is, of course, its good if u can make it go very fast,but its not really necessary. The problem with faster speed is if u wanna cruise faster, u need motorcycle level protections.  With EUC, even at over 10mph, if u r not skilled enough, u have to have full protection. Wearing pairs of palm, elbow, hip, knee protection everytime u go out is just too much hassle. I found out going at slow speed (5mph?) lets u just hop off when unexpected thing happen. I go at full speed (15mph) only when I am concentrating 100% on the road. With this way of cruising, I feel very safe wearing only a helmet and a palm protected glove.  But again, if u can make two 160wh battery 320wh euc that can go 50mph max speed, thats surely better. I am just saying, for practical purpose, 15mph is enough.

 

2.  Suspension is again good to have only if u can make it as compact and light Iike v5f.  I found with cushioned shoe, most road shocks doesnt really hurt ur knee bone. Thicker tire will help as well.

Ok. Let me elaborate more on the ideal size and weight.  U really need small size like v5f, because

1. it will let u store ur euc in locker when u go to a gym.

2. U can easily go aboard bus,train,cars. (and swappable battery even allows to go aboard air plane! )

3. U can go inside market, malls, etc and nobody thinks u r carrying a dangerous equipments with u. U can basically go everywhere!

4.  Light weight not only helps when u go up stairs, load EUC to car trunks. It also helps u when u explore verious terrain. I once raced  8000 dollar electric bicycle once on mountain trail. It was no match for my little v5f.  And when u really explore, there r places where its too steep and rocky where u just have to carry it. With light weight, it expands the place u can go.

Thank u for reading.

And please please make me a v5f like EUC with thicker tire and two swappable 160wh, total 320wh EUC, so I can explore this whole globe with it !

 

[mrelwood]

1 hour ago, dongsoo said:

In my opinion, the ideal euc is not that much different from inmotion v5f in both dimensions and weight.

That’s one kind of usage. I have to say though that it would be completely unsuitable for 95% of the riding that I do.

MCM5 V2 has a 14x2.5” tire. It handles much nicer than the narrow 2.125” ones. Though a 14x3” tire would be an interesting one to try, I hope we’ll see that in a wheel at some point.

[Hellkitten]

Yeah I hate to be “that” guy, but I have zero interest in this type of wheel. I was only seriously interested in eucs once they tipped into being a vehicle category. Maybe there are people that this would be great for and you’ll get your perfect wheel. It seems like the manufacturers are going in the opposite direction though. Not sure how you think electricity is generated, but a significant amount is derived from nuclear power, coal, petroleum……. Plus the battery components and electronic parts are all strip mined out of the earth and are not friendly as people seem to think. You may not see or smell the exhaust coming out of a pev, it just comes out the other end of the supply chain. 

Edited June 1, 2023 by Hellkitten

[techyiam]

I think what the O.P. is suggesting is more along the lines of walking replacement miles, or last mile device. 

Whereas, what the electric wheel manufacturers want is more along the lines of car replacement miles for on-road, and mtb/dirt bike replacement miles off-road.

There is a big disconnect here. 

[mrelwood]

20 minutes ago, techyiam said:

There is a big disconnect here. 

I don’t see it as disconnect, just a very different use case for an EUC. Neither of them being wrong, and both of them being catered by the manufacturers, more or less.

[techyiam]

14 minutes ago, mrelwood said:

I don’t see it as disconnect, just a very different use case for an EUC. Neither of them being wrong, and both of them being catered by the manufacturers, more or less.

 

4 hours ago, dongsoo said:

And please please make me a v5f like EUC with thicker tire and two swappable 160wh, total 320wh EUC, so I can explore this whole globe with it !

I don't think so.

I don't see swappable batteries coming soon to a V5F-like electric wheel. The tire part, he can do it himself.

Moreover, the O.P. wants 160Wh swappable battery packs. 

[alcatraz]

It's not a bad idea. An air travel wheel.

How would you be able to bring two 160Wh packs on a flight if the total max per passenger is around 160Wh?

"Change the world" is a bit much isn't it?

In China, I've seen tighter restrictions on bringing lithium onto public transport, and looser restrictions if the batteries are internal and non-removable. I don't know about the west but imagine if the limit is lower for removable batteries. Then what do you do?

[level9]

 

11 hours ago, dongsoo said:

The problem with faster speed is if u wanna cruise faster, u need motorcycle level protections.  With EUC, even at over 10mph, if u r not skilled enough, u have to have full protection. Wearing pairs of palm, elbow, hip, knee protection everytime u go out is just too much hassle. I found out going at slow speed (5mph?) lets u just hop off when unexpected thing happen.

Not true. Full protection should always be worn. You can break all kinds of things going 0mph if you happen to fall and fall in the wrong way.
It happens all the time. Falling is a top cause of unintentional injuries (and deaths) worldwide and that's without the benefit of standing on an EUC.
Low speeds are an illusion of safety. Unfortunately, EUCs will never be an ubiquitous transportation method. The e-scooter injury stats alone are sobering enough.

[Roadpower]

Every item in the world has countless variations...

[Mono]

I understand the sentiment. That's the type of EUC I have been using for 7+ years now. However

• AFAIK, most airlines won't take an EUC even without any battery
• Air travel and making air travel more convenient is not really compatible with "solving the planets pollution problem"
• I'd probably prefer a small wheel based on a 16x2.5" tire. For all my personal use cases (and in public transport) this is still sufficiently small, even in the somewhat large package of the V8. That is because I don't use locker rooms.
• Adding to the change wish list of the V5F, a headlight that deserves the name would be in the top ten too.

I am currently tempted to buy a 14" wheel and I thought that the KS-14D is a considerably nicer ride than the V5F. Am I mistaken?

[winterwheel]

I've owned both; V5F is passable, 14D is awesome

[Funky]

5 hours ago, level9 said:

Not true. Full protection should always be worn. You can break all kinds of things going 0mph if you happen to fall and fall in the wrong way.
It happens all the time. Falling is a top cause of unintentional injuries (and deaths) worldwide and that's without the benefit of standing on an EUC.
Low speeds are an illusion of safety. Unfortunately, EUCs will never be an ubiquitous transportation method. The e-scooter injury stats alone are sobering enough.

Tell that to my dad, as he uses zero gear at all. Has done 4000Km already without any injuries. (Have fallen also.)

Same for myself. I only gear up at "fun" rides, because i'm going at 2-3x speeds usually. At 1-3km rides i only wear wrist guards and go more or less at running speeds. Especially at winter you can't really ride fast - because of ice/snow, any moment wheel can slide. You simply run out of it. Ofc you need to go about those speeds - where you can run out of it.  

Simply don't fall. How hard is that? (Joking.)

3 hours ago, Mono said:

I am currently tempted to buy a 14" wheel and I thought that the KS-14D is a considerably nicer ride than the V5F. Am I mistaken?

1 hour ago, winterwheel said:

I've owned both; V5F is passable, 14D is awesome

KS16S having 16" tire is even better. Simply by the fact it has 2" bigger tire and still light enough.

I wouldn't want anything smaller than 16" even if i needed to travel 1km distance. Simply by fact that bigger tire - less bumpy ride.

Edited June 1, 2023 by Funky

[on one]

18 hours ago, dongsoo said:

The two feature that should be added to v5 is

1. Swappable battery.

Two 160wh swappable batteries will give 320wh of v5f, and it will let u take ur euc all over the world by plane.

2. Thicker, slip resistant tire.

 

I am inspired because of your enthusiasm. I hope Inmotion will make EUC rentals available worldwide for us because being able to tour on vacation on an EUC is an awesome way to explore. I would choose a package that involved having access to an EUC over one with a bicycle only.

[Mono]

9 hours ago, Funky said:

KS16S having 16" tire is even better. Simply by the fact it has 2" bigger tire and still light enough.

In reverse to the 14" situation, in my mind the V8F is preferably over the KS16S, but I have never ridden the latter.

9 hours ago, Funky said:

I wouldn't want anything smaller than 16" even if i needed to travel 1km distance. Simply by fact that bigger tire - less bumpy ride.

I'd suspect that a 14x2.5" tire would be no more bumpy than a 16x2.125" tire. Then, flexible legs and ankles are the secret to a smooth ride (I even start to enjoy riding over cobbles stones at walking speed) and I am becoming less convinced that 16" must be my minimum safety requirement.

Edited June 2, 2023 by Mono

[plentora]

What we need is a street legal EUCs to change the world (25km/h and "limited" to 1000W). Also water proofed. Nothing else.

I'm still running my 18XL with speed limiter set to 25km/h and I think it is just fine for bicycle-roads and for cities. I don't really need more speed at all, it is still 100% fun after almost 4000km of riding.

 

[mrelwood]

1 hour ago, plentora said:

25km/h and I think it is just fine for bicycle-roads and for cities.

For cities, I agree. But where I live we have a lot of long stretches of dead straight bicycle roads where mopeds are allowed and bicycles themselves almost always ride much faster than 25km/h. An EUC limited to 25km/h on those roads would be quite frustrating and unnecessary.

 But an EUC riders’ license, or just a moped license to make sure that EUC riders would know the basic traffic rules would make a lot of sense. Unfortunately that still wouldn’t solve the issue of all faster than 25km/h vehicles (fast e-bikes as well) having to be registered. There are no categories in our local traffic law that would even accept an EUC. Good luck having a new category made for a niche category like an EUC. I guess we’d have to see a lot more safe EUC-like vehicles (self-balancing or not) for that to happen.

[Rawnei]

The day we have batteries that are not a fire risk, airlines realize this and lifts restrictions for this type of batteries that's the day when we will have a lot more freedom to bring our wheels with us everywhere, easily detachable batteries doesn't solve this problem.

[winterwheel]

16 hours ago, Funky said:

Tell that to my dad, as he uses zero gear at all. Has done 4000Km already without any injuries. (Have fallen also.)

Six years going on seven of daily commuting, group rides, occasional off-road, no gear. A few scrapes along the way in the early days, didn't panic.

[winterwheel]

6 hours ago, plentora said:

What we need is a street legal EUCs to change the world (25km/h and "limited" to 1000W). Also water proofed. Nothing else.

I'm still running my 18XL with speed limiter set to 25km/h and I think it is just fine for bicycle-roads and for cities. I don't really need more speed at all, it is still 100% fun after almost 4000km of riding.

 

Bicycles go faster than 25. Some riders are heavier than others. Not all commutes have bike paths all the way from home to work.

[Funky]

18 hours ago, Mono said:

In reverse to the 14" situation, in my mind the V8F is preferably over the KS16S, but I have never ridden the latter.

I'd suspect that a 14x2.5" tire would be no more bumpy than a 16x2.125" tire. Then, flexible legs and ankles are the secret to a smooth ride (I even start to enjoy riding over cobbles stones at walking speed) and I am becoming less convinced that 16" must be my minimum safety requirement.

Each their own. I personally don't want anything smaller than 18x2.5". Or not smaller than 16x3" - as they are almost the same size. My perfect wheel would have 18x3" tire. Range around 50km, as i don't really need more range ever. And ~55km/h max speed. (Most of my rides are around 5km. Aside from fun rides when i do ~40km.)

Have tried my dads 16s and it was much more bumpy than my 18xl. Bigger tires simply roll over things better. You can't argue with that.  The only reason i went with bigger wheel, was because of tire size. (50km/h speed was welcomed bonus.) 

I knew what i want/need and bought it. Now i'm waiting when they will make something better in same weight.  

[Mono]

2 hours ago, winterwheel said:

Bicycles go faster than 25.

Racing cyclists for sure, casual cyclists go rarely faster than 25km/h, even those with diminishing electric assistance.

[Mono]

10 hours ago, plentora said:

What we need is a street legal EUCs to change the world (25km/h and "limited" to 1000W). Also water proofed. Nothing else.

Where would this limit to 1000W be required?

10 hours ago, plentora said:

I'm still running my 18XL with speed limiter set to 25km/h and I think it is just fine for bicycle-roads and for cities. I don't really need more speed at all, it is still 100% fun after almost 4000km of riding.

I can second this impression, it's still fun after +20K km too.

[Mono]

6 minutes ago, Funky said:

Have tried my dads 16s and it was much more bumpy than my 18xl. Bigger tires simply roll over things better. You can't argue with that.

True, but I could argue as to whether this was the main reason for your perception...

[on one]

I seriously disagree with the whole idea of limiting power and speed of our EUC's. The last thing I want is to take a test and get a license just to ride my wheel. If I ride recklessly and injure somebody then there are already plenty of laws on the books to prosecute me already. I am super careful of pedestrians when I ride my wheel. I always give pedestrians the right of way when I ride, in keeping with local ordinances.

Also, I find the idea of getting stuck with an inmotion V5 abhorrent. The Ninebot Z10 is already the ultimate EUC that changed the world.

Edited June 2, 2023 by earthtwin
more opinions

[mrelwood]

39 minutes ago, earthtwin said:

The last thing I want is to take a test and get a license just to ride my wheel. If I ride recklessly and injure somebody then there are already plenty of laws on the books to prosecute me already.

That’s not how the world works however. Take any product to market in the western world, and there are numerous laws and rules it must meet first. Take a vehicle on the road, and it has to be registered, checked and insured. And you need a driver’s license to operate it. Buy a gun, etc.

Prosecuting only after an incident isn’t a solution to make the society run smoothly. We needs laws and rules to limit our actions because individuals are usually not capable of taking everything in consideration themselves.

 That said, I don’t “want” a license test either. But that just might be required to get EUCs to fit in the society. And I’m ok with that, it would still easily be worth it.