Inmotion V14 Adventure: a new trail wheel from Inmotion

[OldSolo]

2 hours ago, onkeldanuel said:

But not sorted out by begode....an 1300lb spring to mask the degressive linkage is unacceptable for some reasons in terms of suspension performance imo

Agreed, their approach seems poor at this point, like their approach to 'fixing' the bent shock mount.

[Punxatawneyjoe]

On 10/2/2023 at 9:13 PM, novazeus said:

any sidewall photos of the tire with it's rating?

According to Jason from Ewheels they are using the Carrystone J802. Same as the t4 and the extreme.

[Uras]

On 10/7/2023 at 2:43 AM, OldSolo said:

This relates to my question about outer diameter of wheels for offroad use.  Being VERY new to EUCs (first stumbled across a video online a few weeks ago and was instantly fascinated) I do not grasp all that is involved in offroad performance.  But the 29er MTB made quite a difference in rollover for me, and being tall w/ long legs, it fit better anyway.  In my youth, and even my current Husky, 21" front wheels were best offroad but NEVER onroad.  So why is this NOT the case for EUCs?  Is it simply weight?  Height?  Something else? 

Playing in my front yard with my A2, I am surprised at how even an uneven lawn (with a slope) makes riding a lot more tricky.  Granted I am VERY early on the learning curve, and the wheel isn't powerful, but larger diameter = lower angle of attack on surface irregularities.  So this impacts suspension design BUT ALSO decisions of wheel size.

torque is a biggy. I have a 16x and weigh about 80kg - I rode with a friend who is 70kg. I can climb steeper on my 16x than he can on his v13. He is the better rider by a long way. The difference in climbing torque is significant. Then of course greater manouverability, quicker and easier to accelerate, easier to handle weight difference. Bigger wheels tend to have higher center of gravity too, and more leverage on that higher weight - this comes into play during slow manouvering, especially on single mtb tracks. A good rider like my friend can make all this look just as easy as me on my 16x though. The roll over advantage of the larger wheel is significant, as you've said. I really notice this on small chattery stuff - the v13 just flies over it, I have to work the trail more and use my legs. I don't have suspension either though.

Edited October 9, 2023 by Uras

[daniel1234]

On 10/5/2023 at 9:25 PM, Paul g said:

“@MyEWheel

6 hours ago (edited)

Very good video! According to the information we had from InMotion. The first batch ( November ) will be with 50GB battery cells and only after that they will switch to 50S and the price of the wheel will increase. So we at MyEWheel will skip batch 1 and go directly for Batch 2.“

So many question in my head :
- Why would anybody manufacture batch one with different battery config than batch two ? (I had V1 master ... thanks I dont wanna be beta-tester again.)
- Where is real datasheet of INR21700-50GB / INR18650-50GB ? Why would you want untested / ungoogleble cell in your High-end EUC ?
- Will be V1 and V2  batteries compatible ?

- What is the point of secrecy since all competitor already released theirs product ? Why Inmotion don't talk to us directly, but through influencer(No a fan ... missing right word) like "Wheel good time" ?

 

I am happy that somebody making "light YouTube content" for others, but we are picking here 2k+ bucks device. People who make reviews of computer hardware takes theirs job more seriously with intention of helping people decide.  

[Rawnei]

7 minutes ago, daniel1234 said:

So many question in my head :
- Why would anybody manufacture batch one with different battery config than batch two ? (I had V1 master ... thanks I dont wanna be beta-tester again.)
- Where is real datasheet of INR21700-50GB / INR18650-50GB ? Why would you want untested / ungoogleble cell in your High-end EUC ?
- Will be V1 and V2  batteries compatible ?

- What is the point of secrecy since all competitor already released theirs product ? Why Inmotion don't talk to us directly, but through influencer(No a fan ... missing right word) like "Wheel good time" ?

 

I am happy that somebody making "light YouTube content" for others, but we are picking here 2k+ bucks device. People who make reviews of computer hardware takes theirs job more seriously with intention of helping people decide.  

Influencer in this case is just echoing what eWheels have communicated to their customer base.

eWheels have a history of collaborating/demanding different battery cells from manufacturers, this is eWheels specific and manufacturer (in this case Inmotion) just accommodates eWheels requirements for wheels shipped there, it's not a global change.

https://www.ewheels.com/product/inmotion-adventure-v14-2400wh-batter-4000w-motor-deposit/

What type of battery cells will be used in the Adventure battery pack?
The Samsung 50GB cells. We’re working with Inmotion on assessing using a high-powered cell, like the 50S, but this is not certain.

[Jason McNeil]

Still negotiating to get a mix of tires for first-run, stock J802 & the CST-1773 hybrid tire as the alternative. Here's some updated renders of the top black panel scheme, these panel kits are likely to be shipped out separately. 

 

 

Edited October 9, 2023 by Jason McNeil

[zaft]

is this the same rim as the v12ht?

[Unventor]

51 minutes ago, zaft said:

is this the same rim as the v12ht?

Nope new motor and magnets. Stronger alloy/ higher grade aluminum. 

[Uras]

17 hours ago, daniel1234 said:

Where is real datasheet of INR21700-50GB / INR18650-50GB ? Why would you want untested / ungoogleble cell in your High-end EUC

I use duckduckgo for searches - don't trust g00g1e

https://ancoo-battery.com/en/product/INR21700-50G.html

Just quickly though, 10amps for continuous discharge, up to 15amps for non continuous discharges (short bursts?)

Edited October 10, 2023 by Uras

[mtl]

13 hours ago, Jason McNeil said:

 

Looks great, Jason! Is that also the kickstand the wheel will be shipping with?

[daniel1234]

13 hours ago, Uras said:

I use duckduckgo for searches - don't trust g00g1e

https://ancoo-battery.com/en/product/INR21700-50G.html

Just quickly though, 10amps for continuous discharge, up to 15amps for non continuous discharges (short bursts?)

interesting https://www.master-instruments.com.au/file/67273/1/Samsung-INR21700-50G.pdf

50G doesn't seem to have a higher discharge rate than 50E - I am trying to find advantage... 

[mrelwood]

 

On 10/6/2023 at 4:23 PM, GPSchile said:

EUC cannot have an angle of attack on their suspension travel. The vector force compressing the forks on a dirt bike tend to go in the same direction as the forks. Awesome and I may be totally wrong but it seems to me that we cannot have this luxury on an EUC. It would displace back and forth our balance as the suspension is compressed and extended.

I think that with a proper and correct linkage (“trailing arm”?) system we could solve the angle of attack issue. Just the pivot point at the front of the axle and a linkage that makes the up-down movement at least somewhat linear. The axle would stay at the same place in relation to the pedals front to back, and the wheel’s balancing function would take care of the torsion forces as well as the possibly rotating axle due to the linkage design.

 But I don’t see the manufacturers going this far in design improvements just yet.

 

On 10/6/2023 at 10:25 PM, GPSchile said:

However, there are problems with just increasing the diameter of the wheel on a EUC.

Absolutely. It’s all about a reasonable balance. Since the requirements vary though, different wheel sizes will surely remain an option for the years to come. The 14” rim has seemed to be the holy grail of balance especially for larger/taller riders, faster street riding, and plowing through obstacles on off-road trails. Slower street, short riders, and more technical off-road seem to benefit from a 12” rim size, but beyond that in either direction seem to be a niche inside a niche. The recent beefy 3.0-12” models do disturb the balance a bit, but it’s still a 12” rim, and feels smaller and jerkyer than a 14”, for tall riders at least.

[zaft]

5 hours ago, daniel1234 said:

interesting https://www.master-instruments.com.au/file/67273/1/Samsung-INR21700-50G.pdf

50G doesn't seem to have a higher discharge rate than 50E - I am trying to find advantage... 

it’s slightly higher voltage overall at 10amps and has twice the cycle life, according to this post: https://www.thunderheartreviews.com/2021/12/samsung-21700-50G-48G-50E-test-comparison.html?m=1

[Uras]

9 hours ago, daniel1234 said:

50G doesn't seem to have a higher discharge rate than 50E - I am trying to find advantage... 

yeah, it's strange. The 50e from the official data sheet states 15amps non continuous discharge. The 50g from the original data sheet states 15amps continuous discharge @ temperatures -20 to 30C. The link to the data sheet I posted is the one I'd ignore because it doesn't look like the original type data sheet that you found.

Both appear to be 80% after 500 charging cycles

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0448/9583/0172/files/Samsung_50E_Specification_Datasheet.pdf

Oh, and charging time: G=4hrs, E=3hrs.

Also see recovery characteristics and cycle life - these specs aren't based on the same criteria; means no direct comparison.

Edited October 10, 2023 by Uras

[Uras]

9 hours ago, mrelwood said:

On 10/7/2023 at 6:25 AM, GPSchile said:

However, there are problems with just increasing the diameter of the wheel on a EUC.

Absolutely. It’s all about a reasonable balance. Since the requirements vary though, different wheel sizes will surely remain an option for the years to come. The 14” rim has seemed to be the holy grail of balance especially for larger/taller riders, faster street riding, and plowing through obstacles on off-road trails. Slower street, short riders, and more technical off-road seem to benefit from a 12” rim size, but beyond that in either direction seem to be a niche inside a niche. The recent beefy 3.0-12” models do disturb the balance a bit, but it’s still a 12” rim, and feels smaller and jerkyer than a 14”, for tall riders at least.

and torque to ground given the same motor etc

[Forwardnbak]

On 10/9/2023 at 9:55 PM, Jason McNeil said:

Still negotiating to get a mix of tires for first-run, stock J802 & the CST-1773 hybrid tire as the alternative. Here's some updated renders of the top black panel scheme, these panel kits are likely to be shipped out separately. 

 

 

i also saw a white render which looked nice. I saw orange one, black one and white. That was early on though. 

I like black. Looks good.

Shouldn't be long now. I was told quite soon today.

[Punxatawneyjoe]

11 hours ago, Forwardnbak said:

I like black. Looks good.

Me also, that's what i ordered...

[Forwardnbak]

43 minutes ago, Punxatawneyjoe said:

Me also, that's what i ordered...

Yea I think black looks the best then i'll dress it up with scratches.  

Getting excited now. 

[onewheelkoregro]

12 hours ago, Forwardnbak said:

Still negotiating to get a mix of tires for first-run, stock J802 & the CST-1773 hybrid tire as the alternative. Here's some updated renders of the top black panel scheme, these panel kits are likely to be shipped out separately. 

 

The CST-1776 kinda looks like the stock tire that came with my V12. I could be wrong but it looks remarkably similar

CST-1773 sorry

[Punxatawneyjoe]

38 minutes ago, Forwardnbak said:

Getting excited now. 

Me also, it should be a great wheel. I'm not worried about seeing some boobtubers review. After a few hiccups the v13 ended up being an amazing wheel. I know that any first batch issues arise then i have full confidence Jason will make everything right . Although the v13 works great off road also, i would like to keep it as a street only wheel and use the adventure as my off road wheel.

[Jason McNeil]

4 minutes ago, Punxatawneyjoe said:

any first batch issues arise then i have full confidence Jason will make everything right .

Haha, no pressure then . For the street tire, looking like the Chao Yang H626 (same as Patton), Inmotion didn't want to use the CST-1773, because it has a 'marked' rating of 115kg, for whatever that's worth—there's never had a case of burst tire, as far as I'm aware. The tire feedback from the Patton has been good.

 

 

 

Edited October 11, 2023 by Jason McNeil

[Robse]

19 minutes ago, Jason McNeil said:

Haha, no pressure then . For the street tire, looking like the Chao Yang H626 (same as Patton), Inmotion didn't want to use the CST-1773, because it has a 'marked' rating of 115kg, for whatever that's worth—there's never had a case of burst tire, as far as I'm aware. The tire feedback from the Patton has been good.

 

 

 

Just because there has never been an burst tire, would you jump out with a parachute marked "for people up to 80 kg" if you yourself weighed 95 ?

[stizl]

On 10/10/2023 at 9:55 AM, daniel1234 said:

50G doesn't seem to have a higher discharge rate than 50E - I am trying to find advantage... 

From what I recall, the 50G is the replacement for the 50E and is marginally better with endurance at EUC levels of discharge (for what that’s worth), particularly around the 15A rate and when more depleted.  It appears closer to the 50S than the 50E under these conditions:

Source:

https://www . taschenlampen-forum . de/threads/21700-comparison-constant-current-power-and-flashlights . 79436/

Also, differences in implementation and efficiency of the overall system by the manufacturers is critical here. Earlier in the summer, I tested the range limits and did a 6hr, 57mi ride of mixed street/off-road on my Patton with the 50E cells with an average moving speed of 16.4mph and with plenty of higher speed cruising. It was the only time I’ve used “low power mode”, but at “0%” battery I could still cruise at ~25mph and could climb 15-degree grades without issue, beeps, or tilt back. 

Hopefully INMOTION finds this level of efficiency in the V14.  From what I’ve seen so far, the Extreme isn’t there.  

If you’re not one of those riders that consistently rides at/near top speed, then 50E cells on a well-implemented 4P system will do just fine. In my case above, I had my speed limit set at 37mph and my tilt back at 80% PWM. 

Edited October 12, 2023 by stizl

[Forwardnbak]

2 hours ago, Punxatawneyjoe said:

Me also, it should be a great wheel. I'm not worried about seeing some boobtubers review. After a few hiccups the v13 ended up being an amazing wheel. I know that any first batch issues arise then i have full confidence Jason will make everything right . Although the v13 works great off road also, i would like to keep it as a street only wheel and use the adventure as my off road wheel.

who even watches boobtube anymore???

its all a bunch of boobs with 360's

TiK tokking is the future  

[Forwardnbak]

Ive been told I should get to play with one around the end of oct. 

Christmas early