Pushing 60 and against my families wishes - I just ordered my first EUC!

[Funky]

1 hour ago, techyiam said:

It's early yet for you. Once a rider has a year or more of riding time, the acclimating time for new wheels drops considerably.

However, it may be possible to speed things up.

What I found to be helpful is to practice riding slowly forwards and backwards, from point A to point B. Start out about 5' a part and settle at about 10'.

To start, you go as fast as you need to in order to stay balanced. Once you are comfortable with that speed, you reduce the speed by a little bit, and continue the drill.

I go from pole A to pole B. It can be wall to wall. or whatever.

I practice this drill at least once a day.

In about a few weeks to more than month, or sooner, you will see that you can progressively ride slower. If you can ride at about 5 km/h, that is a good milestone. Continue until you can ride at about 3 km/h. Once you can ride this slow, you will be able to come to a stop sign, look for traffic without getting off, then get off if there is traffic, or continue if traffic is clear.

Huh?

Isn't it all about keeping balance? You literally can stop in place for 3 seconds and start going again at stop signs. (Or in my case stop at crossing, look both ways, then ride over the street.) Even when you are stepping off the wheel, you don't do that while in motion do you? You start stepping off when wheel stops. Or start stepping off while ridding one legged for 1-2 seconds before stepping off. (Ride one legged while in stopping motion, then the leg that is already off the pedal for 2 seconds step on ground.) Stop and step off same time.

Even riding at walking speeds, it's all about balance. But idk, i never had an issue riding at walking speeds, even behind old grannies.. (You know how slowly they walk.) Maybe it's because i'm riding a lighter wheel, but does the wheel weight play big role while ridding? 

I think it's more about the balance.. In which case simply trying to step on wheel with both feet on pedals and try balancing in place would be more meaningful. Then again before i learned to ride - i was already free-mounting, standing in place balancing the wheel, before loosing said balance and stepping off. (I wasn't leaning forwards enough to start to ride.) Maybe that's why balancing at lower speeds are easier for me? Still i did that only for 4 days, before i learned to lean.. Doubt it plaid big role in learning.

Edited December 28, 2023 by Funky

[Bigkidneys]

1 hour ago, techyiam said:

It's early yet for you. Once a rider has a year or more of riding time, the acclimating time for new wheels drops considerably.

However, it may be possible to speed things up.

What I found to be helpful is to practice riding slowly forwards and backwards, from point A to point B. Start out about 5' a part and settle at about 10'.

To start, you go as fast as you need to in order to stay balanced. Once you are comfortable with that speed, you reduce the speed by a little bit, and continue the drill.

I go from pole A to pole B. It can be wall to wall. or whatever.

I practice this drill at least once a day.

In about a few weeks to more than month, or sooner, you will see that you can progressively ride slower. If you can ride at about 5 km/h, that is a good milestone. Continue until you can ride at about 3 km/h. Once you can ride this slow, you will be able to come to a stop sign, look for traffic without getting off, then get off if there is traffic, or continue if traffic is clear.

I think I went the opposite route of what you are supposed to learn first. I didn’t start really working on mounting and dismounting until after I learned to ride. I cheated by holding onto my truck. I have no issues mounting anymore. It’s the dismount with the heavier wheel and just getting used to the pads. 

[techyiam]

48 minutes ago, Bigkidneys said:

I didn’t start really working on mounting and dismounting until after I learned to ride.

Me too. I didn't focus on freemount until much later.

49 minutes ago, Bigkidneys said:

It’s the dismount with the heavier wheel and just getting used to the pads. 

Interesting. I never had any problems dismounting on any wheels, even my Abrams when I first got it. Then I suspect you will get use to it very rapidly. The key is to keep the wheel vertical.

Getting used to pads is just a normal thing. Just ride. Eventually you will figure out how to get them to work, and develop a preference. Also, it may help to watch videos of others and see how they ride and how they have positioned their pads. I usually try out the factory pads if the wheel come with them, and then play with them first.

[techyiam]

1 hour ago, Funky said:

In which case simply trying to step on wheel with both feet on pedals and try balancing in place would be more meaningful.

You may be gifted. I believe most people won't be able to improve much with this approach.

It is analogous to learning to do a track stand on a bicycle. It is a very slow process for most people to just come to a red light or stop sign, or just be on a standstill and attempt to do a track stand. There are way faster approaches to learning to do a track stand.

[Punxatawneyjoe]

53 minutes ago, Bigkidneys said:

It’s the dismount with the heavier wheel and just getting used to the pads

I feel like a mistake some people make is to set the pads up so you are "locked" into them and cant really move around. I find that the pads are there to assist in acceleration and braking and get in the way of moving your weight around the wheel if you are locked into them. I find it much easier to spread them out so if you lean forward you are into them and if you lean back you can catch the back ones for braking. Like this.

[OldFartRides]

My patented “Power Nubs” never caught on.

[Cerbera]

8 hours ago, Punxatawneyjoe said:

I feel like a mistake some people make is to set the pads up so you are "locked" into them and cant really move around.

I'm quite locked into mine, but don't consider that a mistake. Not so tightly locked in that my boots can't get out in the event of a crash, but tight enough so that my left leg is constantly in contact with my front pad, and my right leg is constantly in contact with the right brake pad. I find this provides a lot of feedback, control and twist prevention when riding on surfaces that produce that sort of thing and the slightly asymmetrical stance provides a degree of stability I am getting less of if I have more widely spaced pads. Not that I am necessarily recommending that approach to anyone else - foot and pad placement is a highly individual thing, and everyone should do what works best for them...

Edited December 28, 2023 by Cerbera

[Funky]

9 hours ago, techyiam said:

You may be gifted. I believe most people won't be able to improve much with this approach.

It is analogous to learning to do a track stand on a bicycle. It is a very slow process for most people to just come to a red light or stop sign, or just be on a standstill and attempt to do a track stand. There are way faster approaches to learning to do a track stand.

Doubt i'm that gifted.. I just first learned free mount the thing - which took me 4 days, each day 20 mins stepping on/off the wheel all the time.. Balancing in place.. 4rth day i had enough and did superman lean (very crazy lean forwards) and that got me going. Riding gave me zero problems as i have said before. My biggest issue was  trying to free mount the thing, before ridding even once. If i knew i need to lean forwards that much, i would have been riding in first 10 mins.

Doh i did ALL my learning on grass/dirt roads.. (In case if wheel falls - no scrapes/damage.) That for sure made my learning stage faster. As when i went on asphalt for the first time. I was shocked how easy it was to ride. No bumps, no nothing.. 

If you wanna learn to ride much faster - go Off-Roading.  Even ridding over short grass field - that field have enough bumps and what not, to make you learn faster.

Edited December 28, 2023 by Funky

[Bigkidneys]

3 hours ago, Cerbera said:

I'm quite locked into mine, but don't consider that a mistake. Not so tightly locked in that my boots can't get out in the event of a crash, but tight enough so that my left leg is constantly in contact with my front pad, and my right leg is constantly in contact with the right brake pad. I find this provides a lot of feedback, control and twist prevention when riding on surfaces that produce that sort of thing and the slightly asymmetrical stance provides a degree of stability I am getting less of if I have more widely spaced pads. Not that I am necessarily recommending that approach to anyone else - foot and pad placement is a highly individual thing, and everyone should do what works best for them...

I have a somewhat asymmetrical stance as well.  My right foot is ore forward on the pedal then my left.  Like you mentioned, I find that it does help with having more control when riding.  I also have my toes pointed out around 15*.  I have been playing with my stance and feet positioning on the pedals as they are much larger than my Honeycomb V11 ones.  I think I may have been too far forward on them which was helping cause my dancing around all squirrelly like a meth head lol.

[Bigkidneys]

2 hours ago, Funky said:

Doubt i'm that gifted.. I just first learned free mount the thing - which took me 4 days, each day 20 mins stepping on/off the wheel all the time.. Balancing in place.. 4rth day i had enough and did superman lean (very crazy lean forwards) and that got me going. Riding gave me zero problems as i have said before. My biggest issue was  trying to free mount the thing, before ridding even once. If i knew i need to lean forwards that much, i would have been riding in first 10 mins.

Doh i did ALL my learning on grass/dirt roads.. (In case if wheel falls - no scrapes/damage.) That for sure made my learning stage faster. As when i went on asphalt for the first time. I was shocked how easy it was to ride. No bumps, no nothing.. 

If you wanna learn to ride much faster - go Off-Roading.  Even ridding over short grass field - that field have enough bumps and what not, to make you learn faster.

I definitely plan on doing that at some point once I feel more confident.  I have the improved jump pads from Hulaj market coming and would like to feel more comfortable where we can do both types of riding.

[rcgldr]

On 12/27/2023 at 3:11 PM, techyiam said:

riding slowly

How difficult this is depends on the tire width. A Solowheel with a 2 inch wide tire is difficult to ride slow while a Z10 with a 4 inch wide tire is easy to ride slow. Video of a beginner having difficulties and a wobbly ride on a narrow tire EUC until he switched to a Z10, and was able to ride essentially standing still on the Z10 at 3 to 4 mph:

 

Edited December 31, 2023 by rcgldr

[techyiam]

1 hour ago, rcgldr said:

How difficult this is depends on the tire width. A Solowheel with a 2 inch wide tire is difficult to ride slow while a Z10 with a 4 inch wide tire is easy to ride slow. Video of a beginner having difficulties and a wobbly ride on a narrow tire EUC until he switched to a Z10, and was able to ride essentially standing still on the Z10 at 3 to 4 mph:

I think there are a number of factors, among width is one of them.

It may be so happen the Z10 has many of the right factors to make it easier to balance at slow speed than the Solowheel.

Apparently, Bob Yan say the V11 is a wheel good to learning on.

On the Z10, not only is the tire wider, the tire profile is also flatter. Additionally, if the tire is under inflated, this may help also. I have never ridden a Z10 though.

Having said that, I bet it would be massively harder to learn on an Abrams even though the tire is wider than the Solowheel, and has much more moment of inertia.

 

[KiwiMark]

4 hours ago, techyiam said:

Having said that, I bet it would be massively harder to learn on an Abrams even though the tire is wider than the Solowheel, and has much more moment of inertia.

 

I learned on a Begode RS, not the easiest, but not the hardest either. My Sherman S would be tough to learn on with the the heaviness of the wheel as well as having pretty high pedals. When I first went out somewhere to try to ride my RS on the day it arrived, it was really tough. My first move was to hold on to a fence and stand on the pedals, then I just got it to roll forward and back while holding the fence. I think that this helped a lot, because when I tried to free-mount the wheel, it was important to put some weight forward so that it would keep moving. I found that after 2-3 hours of riding it wasn't too hard to ride, but it was after a few hundred kilometres of riding that I was finally starting to feel comfortable. There is definitely a difference being an experienced rider compared to being a newbie - riding my Sherman S wasn't too hard because I had over 1,600km (over 1,000 miles) of riding experience when I started riding it.

It is interesting watching people learn to ride, but it is important to remember that learning will only be the first few hours of use and then there will be hundreds of hours having fun riding.

I'm now getting back into riding after a pause of a few weeks to recover from a broken hand. I just have to be careful when lifting my Sherman S to not put any strain on my hand in a funny direction (lifting straight up seems OK). I wouldn't recommend breaking a hand at 56 years old (or any age for that matter), it turns out that we use our hands for a LOT of tasks.

[Crab]

Or a leg, I did both and the leg is much worse.

[Jkay]

Broken left leg…..uggg.  In August I had a minor motorcycle event which broke my left tib/fibula.  Not wanting to end the year on a low note, I rode my V12 yesterday.  I thought I would have a problem getting on, but I geared up, rolled it out and had a great ride around my older track around our neighborhood.  At 70 I was afraid that my riding days were nearly gone but…..it’s not!  Very happy way to start 2024!  

[rcgldr]

On 12/30/2023 at 7:15 PM, techyiam said:

On the Z10, not only is the tire wider, the tire profile is also flatter.

I forgot to mention that. A low profile tire will have more tilt to camber response than a high profile tire. Depending on tire pressure, the contact patch will also be wider.

[Bigkidneys]

I am new to EUCs and learned on my V11.  Besides the higher pedal height, I was very comfortable on it after 20 miles of riding.  The combo of weight, tire size and width really helped me.  I have a Patton as well and the weight and short height is taking some getting used to as well as the knobby tire.  Bought my wife an A2 and she was riding comfortably in 20 minutes.  It's perfect for her height and weight as she is 98lbs and 5ft.

[Mono]

On 12/28/2023 at 1:17 AM, Funky said:

try balancing in place would be more meaningful.

It's practically not possible to balance in place without idling.

[Cerbera]

1 hour ago, Mono said:

It's practically not possible to balance in place without idling.

Some people would suggest otherwise (see the end of this vid where he starts holding more stationary) but you need to put quite a lot of hours into being able to do this before you can meaningfully deploy it in everyday riding. There was one video I saw (but can't find now of course) of some French dude on a Master managing to hold it stationary, straight and balanced for about 30 seconds at a time (quite a lot of 'arms' going on though) so it must be possible, but I haven't put the hours in and I'd guess only a few do...

[Mono]

8 hours ago, Cerbera said:

Some people would suggest otherwise

I am sure they do, but they would be wrong for all practical intents and purposes. The linked vid is evidence of this too, as the wheel is never stationary for more than about half a second, the longest I can see at around 4:21 twice for at most 1/2 second, correct me if I am wrong and point me to where you can see it. Remaining stationary should be possible in theory, but only very few artists can balance on a stiff rope (tightrope) reliably without a balancing aid, that is, only the most talented humans can do it somewhat reliably after years and years of training, while the stationary forward-backward balance is much easier on the rope, because there is the full length of the foot to make adjustments without moving. A slack rope is much easier to balance, because it is not stationary. A tightrope is not exactly comparable to a tire that can be slanted, but then, I have watched tons of vids with zero evidence that any rider I have ever seen can do it. I'd be delighted to see an example! Yet, a single example wouldn't change the fact that almost all riders don't come even close to be able to keep the wheel stationary for seconds and not just once by luck. Thinking about it, because the stationary forward-backward balance on a wheel is much more difficult than on a tightrope, I think it is almost impossible to learn this even for the most talented human (whereas a robot may be able to do it). It would be easy to prove me wrong by a single counterexample . One can minimize the necessary movements such that it may look stationary to someone not looking carefully, which becomes much easier (but by no means easy) if twisting counts as remaining stationary because the point of ground contact remains the same. I can do that too for at least a couple of seconds on the appropriate terrain.

Edited January 3 by Mono

[Oldunime]

I’m new EUC riding as well but I found using crutches for balance for the first while really helped me to get some sense of balance.