Veteran Patton 16" 126v 2220wh

[Cyberwolf]

40 minutes ago, Al Alcatraz said:

It's a 3 phase switch.

I don't know from where they got it but I am very happy how they attached it to the headlight.

 

That's helpful for reference, thank you. 

Not seeing that particular one listed on US sites, but have been eyeballing this one listed below (which I'm thinking can be mounted using the original mounting points along with a pair of 'size down' brackets to account for the extra ~1/2" of width over the original):

Auxbeam 4in 92W LED Offroad Light with Side Shooter, Amber DRL LED Pod Super Bright Square Automotive Light Bar Combo Beam Pod Light Motorcycle Auxiliary Light for Jeep ATV Wrangler Ford Truck Pickup https://a.co/d/39w9DR1

Edited July 11, 2023 by Cyberwolf

[Al Alcatraz]

24 minutes ago, Cyberwolf said:

 

That's helpful for reference, thank you. 

Not seeing that particular one listed on US sites, but have been eyeballing this one listed below (which I'm thinking can be mounted using the original mounting points along with a pair of 'size down' brackets to account for the extra ~1/2" of width over the original):

Auxbeam 4in 92W LED Offroad Light with Side Shooter, Amber DRL LED Pod Super Bright Square Automotive Light Bar Combo Beam Pod Light Motorcycle Auxiliary Light for Jeep ATV Wrangler Ford Truck Pickup https://a.co/d/39w9DR1

I would be cautious connecting a 92W headlight to the Patton since the controller has been built with an 18W headlight in mind.

Ultimately, all these headlights are from China so you might find better options on aliexpress.

[Cyberwolf]

31 minutes ago, Al Alcatraz said:

I would be cautious connecting a 92W headlight to the Patton since the controller has been built with an 18W headlight in mind.

That's a good point, thank you.

Edited July 11, 2023 by Cyberwolf

[unicycle bunny]

On 7/9/2023 at 5:00 PM, Al Alcatraz said:

The main light consumes 20 watts.

 

are you sure it's 20w not 30w? looking at this link: https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256805275428894.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.1.113f2ca5xpdblx&algo_pvid=c338fb19-2f6b-4210-9a49-58a9fb6fd1ac&algo_exp_id=c338fb19-2f6b-4210-9a49-58a9fb6fd1ac-0&pdp_npi=3%40dis!USD!24.15!11.35!!!173.77!!%40212279b716891079525312510d07af!12000033177794877!sea!US!2485266657&curPageLogUid=CaTLDQcKljR6

[Critzlez]

Does anyone have issues with the rubber charge port not staying on? Mine keep popping off.

[Hellkitten]

1 hour ago, Critzlez said:

Does anyone have issues with the rubber charge port not staying on? Mine keep popping off.

Yeah my buddies keeps popping off too. I don’t know why they changed the design from the Sherman S, mine stays closed. 

 

 

[wstuart]

Does anyone here have a Sherman S and a Patton?  Im wondering how they compare and if there is value in owning both wheels.  I am supremely happy with my Sherman S for all my on and offroad needs.  Im just wondering if the extra torque and manueverability of the Patton makes it make sense for having for tighter offroad trails and shorter trips?

[Hellkitten]

28 minutes ago, wstuart said:

Does anyone here have a Sherman S and a Patton?  Im wondering how they compare and if there is value in owning both wheels.  I am supremely happy with my Sherman S for all my on and offroad needs.  Im just wondering if the extra torque and manueverability of the Patton makes it make sense for having for tighter offroad trails and shorter trips?

My friend has both. I have an SS. He let me ride the Patton for about 45 minutes last night. I did some laps on a track, some street riding and light paths. They are very different wheels to ride and you more or less nailed it. I’d absolutely take the Sherman S for cruising, range and speed. The Patton is a bit squirrelly higher speeds. At least it would take some time to get used to. It doesn’t feel as planted, but more maneuverable and with the more powerful acceleration and braking makes for a fun ride. Even though it weighs close to the same weight as the SS, it doesn’t feel heavy while riding. I could definitely see these complimenting each other.
It could be a great marketing move for a company to co-design two or thee wheels that fit together in a perfect stable for avid customers. This kinda feels like leperkim may have intended for that. 🤷🏻‍♂️

I would love a 16 inch high torque wheel to go with my Sherman. I want to see how the Extreme turns out and figure things out then. 

[Critzlez]

2 hours ago, wstuart said:

Does anyone here have a Sherman S and a Patton?  Im wondering how they compare and if there is value in owning both wheels.  I am supremely happy with my Sherman S for all my on and offroad needs.  Im just wondering if the extra torque and manueverability of the Patton makes it make sense for having for tighter offroad trails and shorter trips?

I'd say the Patton is better for city riding where you want tight maneuvers and accelerations from stops, while the sherman S focuses on top speed cruising and range just like the person above me said. If you want more portability, acceleration, and a wheel that's more nimble, go for the patton. If you want more range and speed and you don't care about weight/size, go for the sherman. The patton itself is $1k cheaper so that might be main reason to get one too.

[Rawnei]

2 hours ago, wstuart said:

Does anyone here have a Sherman S and a Patton?  Im wondering how they compare and if there is value in owning both wheels.  I am supremely happy with my Sherman S for all my on and offroad needs.  Im just wondering if the extra torque and manueverability of the Patton makes it make sense for having for tighter offroad trails and shorter trips?

I have a Sherman S and I have a Patton incoming soon, I have also ridden my friends Patton, the value for me is Patton being the smaller wheel with even more torque that I can do crazy stuff on like extreme climbs and very technical off-roading, mind you I can do a lot on the Sherman S already but the idea of a 12" rim wheel with crazy torque is attractive to me the way I like to play around.

IMO unless you like to push yourself and your wheel and do a lot of extreme riding then Sherman S is already more than sufficient.

[OliG]

11 hours ago, Critzlez said:

Does anyone have issues with the rubber charge port not staying on? Mine keep popping off.

Yes, mine too, each time after I charged the wheel I have the issue.  The rubber is a little deformed after the charge.   After repositioning it several times, it eventually stays in place... until the next charge.

[dycus]

On 6/27/2023 at 6:48 AM, stizl said:

 

I received my wheel yesterday, the 66lb spring version with the knobby. These wheels really have a quality feel, even compared to my V12!

For measuring and setting the static sag, since the Patton’s shock sliders are not exposed, you cannot use a zip tie or O-ring around the inner slider like is often done on motorcycle or bicycle forks or shocks.  A quick and crude sag measurement set up I came up with simply used a cable tie (as a pointer), some masking tape, and a sharpie. It only took about five minutes to set up. I first taped the cable tie horizontally to the front fender, then marked and taped a mini ruler onto the front of the battery box as shown in the photos below.  Next time I'll probably make a similar setup with a bit more precision, but this was fast and more than sufficient to get in the ballpark within a few mm. 

At 175 pounds, my static sag at the out-of-box setting (with zero preload) was about 25mm, or 31% (25mm/80mm), which is a bit much for most applications.  I then added about three lines (grooves in the preload adjusters) of preload in order to get 20 mm of sag, or 25%.  With the range of adjustment of the preload adjusters, it looks like a 175lb (geared) rider on the 66lb springs would be able to set between ~15% and ~30% of static sag, which is about the perfect range to have, as luck would have it for me, ha.

After first bouncing on the wheel in my garage, I also found the baseline rebound and compression settings to be a bit underdamped.  For my first ride I added four clicks of compression and two clicks of rebound, and I found this to be a good place to start.  After a 6 mile ride I backed the compression back off two clicks which seem to be a sweet spot for me for keeping the plush ride and maintaining a well damped feel.  After some heavier trail riding later today, I'll reevaluate. 

Regarding the available spring rates, it seems to me that spring rate selection should be based almost purely on achieving ideal static sag.   The force difference between 58lb and 66lb springs is only about 14%, which will have little affect on absorbing big hits/drops.  If you look at existing available mountain bike and motorcycle fork and shock springs, the typical range available has the heaviest spring option being 150% to 200% of the lightest available spring.

If you (sag) compress too much of your suspension travel just by standing on the wheel, then obviously you won’t have that travel left to absorb speed bumps, potholes, etc. 30% sag is about the most you'll see recommended for any street/moto shock application.  When doing drops to flat however, your suspension will extend fully before you land (unless you have your rebound damping set too high) and therefore the damping is doing most of the work keeping you from bottoming out, not the incrementally stronger spring. 

Regarding pads, I had ordered the pads originally designed for the Patton on AliExpress for $99.  Both the fit and the quality is great,.  The Velcro is pre-cut for the bolt holes and the adhesive on the back of the Velcro is quite thick and grippy. The Velcro itself also isn’t overly strong, so it’s easy to adjust the pads without ripping off the Velcro.  From initial impressions these pads are well shaped and seem to have just the right amount of adjustment on the acceleration pad to accommodate a range of thicknesses  of kneepads or even none at all (if you’re one of those people).  I would recommend these pads for most any larger wheel, especially for the price and short lead times.

Great post!

I'm wanting to get a Patton and trying to decide which suspension to go for, based on my geared weight (~140lb).
One would think they'd be able to just calculate their sag based on their weight, the known weight of the Patton, and the suspension spring rate. However, this gives wildly inaccurate numbers!

For your example, you said your 175lbs + the Patton's ~67lbs sprung weight (guessing the motor is ~10kg based on ecodrift's measured 13kg Sherman-S motor) and 66lb/in springs resulted in 25mm sag with no preload. But if you actually calculate it:
175lb + 67lb = 242lb
242lb / (66lb/in * 2) = 1.83in (46.6mm), 86% more than you actually measured!

Where is the discrepancy? Are the coils actually higher spring rate than advertised? Your measurements suggest the springs are actually 119lb/in each!

Additionally, your weight is right at the threshold where Leaperkim suggests you should get the 58/62lb suspension, yet with the 66lb you're actually in the right sag range of 15-30%.

Seems like I should be going for the 62lb suspension despite Leaperkim's recommendations. Assuming a similar 1.8x spring rate factor, the 62lb springs may be more like 112lb/in, which would give me ~12-24mm sag (15-30%).

Edited July 13, 2023 by dycus

[wstuart]

20 hours ago, Hellkitten said:

My friend has both. I have an SS. He let me ride the Patton for about 45 minutes last night. I did some laps on a track, some street riding and light paths. They are very different wheels to ride and you more or less nailed it. I’d absolutely take the Sherman S for cruising, range and speed. The Patton is a bit squirrelly higher speeds. At least it would take some time to get used to. It doesn’t feel as planted, but more maneuverable and with the more powerful acceleration and braking makes for a fun ride. Even though it weighs close to the same weight as the SS, it doesn’t feel heavy while riding. I could definitely see these complimenting each other.
It could be a great marketing move for a company to co-design two or thee wheels that fit together in a perfect stable for avid customers. This kinda feels like leperkim may have intended for that. 🤷🏻‍♂️

I would love a 16 inch high torque wheel to go with my Sherman. I want to see how the Extreme turns out and figure things out then. 

Yup Im waiting to see how the extreme pans out.  I would never buy a first batch begode wheel, but if the Extreme is still popular after a few batches I would consider it.  

[Rollin-on-1]

The bosses on the Patton's cover are a weak point.  I think the blue battery cables apply some upward pressure.  Several of mine are broken.  I had opened it up and I was very careful putting it back together.  I turned the screws in a star pattern and only a little at a time.  I did not tighten them.  I held the t-handle allen key lightly with 2 finger tips and stopped when I felt it take tension.  

A couple of days after putting it together, I noticed a small gap.  I reseated the top to close the gap and turned any screws that felt like they didn't have tension, still very careful not to over tighten.  I heard something rattle when I sat it back on the kickstand.  I noticed another gap.  At that point, I took all the screws out and took the top off.  The bases of several bosses fell out onto the floor.  7 out of 8 were broken.  

No crashes and I really don't think I over tightened them. The bosses seem weak.  Anyone else experience this? Hopefully this issue isn't wide spread.  

Be cautious putting the top back on everyone.

[carlitos]

7 hours ago, Rollin-on-1 said:

The bosses on the Patton's cover are a weak point.  I think the blue battery cables apply some upward pressure.  Several of mine are broken.  I had opened it up and I was very careful putting it back together.  I turned the screws in a star pattern and only a little at a time.  I did not tighten them.  I held the t-handle allen key lightly with 2 finger tips and stopped when I felt it take tension.  

A couple of days after putting it together, I noticed a small gap.  I reseated the top to close the gap and turned any screws that felt like they didn't have tension, still very careful not to over tighten.  I heard something rattle when I sat it back on the kickstand.  I noticed another gap.  At that point, I took all the screws out and took the top off.  The bases of several bosses fell out onto the floor.  7 out of 8 were broken.  

No crashes and I really don't think I over tightened them. The bosses seem weak.  Anyone else experience this? Hopefully this issue isn't wide spread.  

Be cautious putting the top back on everyone.

Could you explain (or better, post a pic) for those of us whose English isn't our first language, what are the bosses on the wheel?

[Rollin-on-1]

2 hours ago, carlitos said:

Could you explain (or better, post a pic) for those of us whose English isn't our first language, what are the bosses on the wheel?

Bosses are the plastic tunnels in the top cover where the screws go.  The bottoms of those tunnels broke and there is nothing to secure the top cover.  For now, I have it held in place with painter's tape.

Edited July 14, 2023 by Rollin-on-1

[jimjam.nyc]

3 minutes ago, Rollin-on-1 said:

Bosses are the plastic tunnels in the top cover where the screws go.  The bottoms of those tunnels broke and there is nothing to secure the top cover.  For now, I have it held in place with painter's tape.

This is good to know. I have taken mine off more than once and seems ok. Hopefully they can get you a replacement quickly.

 

[techyiam]

Here is a photo showing the bottom of the top cover of the Patton. The screws come through those holes. The plastic around some the holes of his top cover are broken.

Edited July 14, 2023 by techyiam

[Rollin-on-1]

3 hours ago, carlitos said:

Could you explain (or better, post a pic) for those of us whose English isn't our first language, what are the bosses on the wheel?

They are very brittle and have lots of cracks running through them.  Prior to taking it apart, I had sat on it for about 10 min during a mid-ride rest stop.  I wonder if that stressed it and I just didn't notice?

[The Brahan Seer]

21 minutes ago, Rollin-on-1 said:

I had sat on it for about 10 min during a mid-ride rest stop.

This is disappointing news. Have you done much seated riding since getting the wheel?

[Rollin-on-1]

4 minutes ago, The Brahan Seer said:

This is disappointing news. Have you done much seated riding since getting the wheel?

I don't ride seated.  I only sat on it stationary a few times and I put my kids on it and rolled them around in the basement for a few minutes. I am about 180lb with gear and my kids weight less than 50lbs.  It doesn't seem like either of these things should be a problem.  

[jimjam.nyc]

30 minutes ago, Rollin-on-1 said:

I don't ride seated.  I only sat on it stationary a few times and I put my kids on it and rolled them around in the basement for a few minutes. I am about 180lb with gear and my kids weight less than 50lbs.  It doesn't seem like either of these things should be a problem.  

I ride seated quite a bit. I am on the lighter side though. I just pulled my cover off, and all seems OK.

This is the first I have heard of this issue. Let's hope if it's a wider spread thing it gets taken care of.

[bpong]

rollin-on, i believe veteran should be replacing your top cover;  its a new wheel man !  wouldnt this be covered by the warranty ?

[meepmeepmayer]

They increased the price of the Patton here in Europe! Used to be 3199, now it's 3299 at the same dealers. Not cool Maybe demand is high? Or they just did it because they could.

[Rawnei]

2 hours ago, Rollin-on-1 said:

They are very brittle and have lots of cracks running through them.  Prior to taking it apart, I had sat on it for about 10 min during a mid-ride rest stop.  I wonder if that stressed it and I just didn't notice?

One thing that comes to mind is loctite, did you take off the cover yourself at some point prior and used loctite when re-assembling? Loctite and plastic don't mix well it makes plastic brittle.