Inmotion V13 Speculation

[Taras]

On 1/14/2023 at 11:27 PM, soulson said:

I didn't manage to catch how the inverter's power electronics will be cooled

It's ok. Trust me ) You can also read text version and look to additional pictures.
 

 

On 1/14/2023 at 11:27 PM, soulson said:

we see a sticker on the inverter showing a rated voltage of 108VDC

nominal voltage is 108V. 3.6V by elements multiply on 30. 126V is a charging voltage or maximal voltage.
 

 

On 1/14/2023 at 11:27 PM, soulson said:

why two of the inverter phase terminals have bushings

It's a current meters. In any time curren go via 2 phase. And 2 sensors is enough to get current at any moment.

[Rawnei]

39 minutes ago, Kingsong Russia said:

I've done text/photo version of V13 teardow. Welcome:
https://ecodrift-ru.translate.goog/2023/01/17/inmotion-v13-challenger-razbiraem/?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=ru&_x_tr_pto=wapp

Thanks 🙏

Build quality looks great, they set the bar here, very professional.

Now they just need the same concept but at least 10kg lighter (preferably even more so) and I'm in, 2200Wh version maybe? But perhaps need to save weight in more places for that.

[Taras]

18 minutes ago, Rawnei said:

but at least 10kg lighter

maybe 20kg lighter  V13 is too heavy for me.. 

[Paul A]

12 hours ago, UPONIT said:

In Dawn's V13 Conclusions video, she said that the V13 she and Marty have been testing is now going to Chooch. So I guess that kerfuffle was all a misunderstanding.

 

Chooch's comments from his latest video of Jan 16, 2023.

 

MOST RELIABLE ELECTRIC UNICYCLES: (iNMOTION V12 HT, O.G VETERAN SHERMAN, Msuper Pro HT)

www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTw6k-LZQBM

 

 

[Paul g]

39 minutes ago, Rawnei said:

Thanks 🙏

Build quality looks great, they set the bar here, very professional.

Now they just need the same concept but at least 10kg lighter (preferably even more so) and I'm in, 2200Wh version maybe? But perhaps need to save weight in more places for that.

 

21 minutes ago, Kingsong Russia said:

maybe 20kg lighter  V13 is too heavy for me.. 

One thing InMotion didn’t got right with V13 is the 22’ wheel, IMO. I would’ve loved a 20’ wheel for more agility at speed and lighter weight. The V13 is not a cruiser, it doesn’t have the battery for that, so all that extra weight of the wheel it makes no sense. I also would’ve liked for them to make a V12 16’ with suspension or make it 18’ without suspension, so I think they didn’t got it right here either. They should be more in touch with the community otherwise they will keep doing stuff that makes no sense, or they’re already outdated.

[techyiam]

16 hours ago, HEC said:

Would you mind to elaborate a bit more about that?

Not at all.

When a rider leans forward, this person would generate a torque about the axle, and as you have pointed out, this torque is equal to the distance between CG of rider and the axle, multiple by the rider's weight (assuming no pads are used). I call this torque the actuation torque. The wheel's self-balancing mechanism would then exert a counter torque.

But the thrust generated at the contact patch by this counter torque is dependent also on the tire radius, other than the torque itself.

And hence, to accelerate at the same rate on a larger wheel, the rider needs to exert a greater actuation torque, ie. lean more.

Edited January 17, 2023 by techyiam

[Nostris]

7 hours ago, UPONIT said:

The "signs of wear" were just the anodization (NOT PAINT) being worn off. Anodization layer is like 0.003" thick. More like "wear in" not damage.

Also, the shocks on the V13 are about twice as large as the V11.

Two cents: Don't use pads until you can ride in a straight line at least. You probably won't know how you will end up liking them adjusted, and they will interfere with you bailing off of your very expensive new EUC. Catch your foot, fall instead of step off.

When you do get to the magical point where you can balance, those pads are GREAT.

Also, wrap that puppy up in a lot of foam so you don't feel like you have to save the wheel when you fall. Save yourself, not the wheel was the best advice I was given. So far, no wounds from EUC riding...

Edit: Another two cents: Since InMotion was clever enough to make a removable suspension, I suggest you remove it while learning. Lower COG will make it MUCH easier to learn. On my V11, I just took the air out of it to lower it all the way down. All the springiness was just effin with me when I was trying to learn. YMMV.

Good luck!

I agree about the rails. The v13's are much much beefier also...

I’ll be very interested to hear how that goes. I was wondering when we would have someone who wants a 50kg V13 as a starter wheel 🙄😏

[SquallLHeart]

12 hours ago, WILSONEUC said:

Who is the V13 for? 

For those who want to commute year round without too many weather concerns.

5 hours ago, Paul g said:

One thing InMotion didn’t got right with V13 is the 22’ wheel, IMO. I would’ve loved a 20’ wheel for more agility at speed and lighter weight. The V13 is not a cruiser, it doesn’t have the battery for that, so all that extra weight of the wheel it makes no sense. I also would’ve liked for them to make a V12 16’ with suspension or make it 18’ without suspension, so I think they didn’t got it right here either. They should be more in touch with the community otherwise they will keep doing stuff that makes no sense, or they’re already outdated.

They overbuilt the Challenger on purpose. It has the battery to cruise for a decent range. Best as described above.. as a commuter wheel.

InMotion is in touch with the community and even put out a survey (did you even see it?) to get input for a future wheel. As such, they are already working on the next one. Smaller suspension wheel is already in the plans..

[Supakatt]

I've owned motorcycles that weigh 7 times more than me, so I don't see what the big deal is with a wheel that weighs 16kg less. If you "think" you can ride a heavier, higher wheel, but have no experience, you will learn, & find out for sure!

[Supakatt]

42 minutes ago, SquallLHeart said:

 

InMotion is in touch with the community and even put out a survey (did you even see it?) to get input for a future wheel. As such, they are already working on the next one. Smaller suspension wheel is already in the plans..

It's strange how these companies come up with these wheels, manufacturers learning what the community wants is an amazing concept that all these companies should consider.

Edited January 17, 2023 by Supakatt

[Cerbera]

1 hour ago, Supakatt said:

I've owned motorcycles that weigh 7 times more than me, so I don't see what the big deal is with a wheel that weighs 16kg less. If you "think" you can ride a heavier, higher wheel, but have no experience, you will learn, & find out for sure!

True, but you also haven't held up those motorcycles with one leg in an extended standing pose, as it is inevitable when you first try and free-mount / dismount EUCs ! Later of course we realise that if we keep the weight of the machine more directly under our centreline, then there is no need for extended poses, and we learn to keep it tucked in nice and tight where its weight is easy to manage, and once you have 'mastered' that, no pun intended, then relative weight of EUC to rider becomes much less of an issue..

I had 7000 hours XP on smaller wheels, and was expecting to be jumping right on my Master and to be carrying on largely as I was, but hell no - I found myself in a steep re-learning curve, and my confidence in my own ability to ride it well had to be seriously, if temporarily, reigned back while I got used to the huge weight of it, and controlling that with the one leg, not to mention upping the game of all the muscles that control low speed steering until they were more up to the task.

Now, the V13 I understand is even heavier, but apparently has nicer weight distribution than the Master and its variations (which are very top-heavy), so perhaps its weight is easier to manage for new riders ? Also there is a lot of truth in what Superkatt says about starting out jumping in the deep end with a big heavy wheel - if that is your only experience, you will either deal with it, or you won't !  It'll still be fun trying... but if you want the easy way in, I still reckon smaller wheels first are gonna get more rewarding results, faster, and possibly encourage more people to stay with it.

I could quite see a situation where someone got on one of these big wheels, having never done it before, and REALLY doesn't like the sensation, which might put them off it for life, in a way that a smaller, gentler introduction might not have done.

Edited January 17, 2023 by Cerbera

[techyiam]

7 minutes ago, Cerbera said:

Now, the V13 I understand is even heavier, but apparently has nicer weight distribution than the Master and its variations (which are very top-heavy), so perhaps its weight is easier to manage for new riders ? Also there is a lot of truth in what Superkatt says about starting out jumping in the deep end with a big heavy wheel - if that is your only experience, you will either deal with it, or you won't !  It'll still be fun trying...

That was what I was expecting too before I bought my Abrams, because of my experience when I jumped from a T3 to a V12, and even got on an Abrams then.

When I finally jumped from my V12 to my own Abrams, free mount was not an issue at all. I could easily control the wheel with only one foot on it. Sure, there was a learning curve to ride it, but my legs and balance had already developed to a higher level, and made dealing with it painless. 

Surprisingly, Sherman-S, V13, and Master Pro, did not feel unwieldy at all. Only, the Master Pro with its significantly higher pedal height took a little more to get use to. I thought the Abrams felt more top heavy, but the very high pedal height on the Master Pro did feel like something different. 

My legs were easily strong enough to balance these big wheels. 

When I first started, I found it challenging just to balance a T3 with one leg.

Your body will adapt. If you don't have to lift it, the weight may not be that apparent.

After you have about a year of riding experience on your Master, I doubt you will have any problems riding any of the big wheels. Sure, there is an adjustment period, but it is not a big deal.

Personally, I would not learn to ride an electric wheel on a big wheel. T3 was good, but a V12 would be max for me.

My point here is that after a rider has acquired enough skills and experience, he or she can get a wheel that has a suspension, more performance, and range, and not have to worry so much about the weight (assuming no lifting is required).

[Paul g]

1 hour ago, SquallLHeart said:

For those who want to commute year round without too many weather concerns.

They overbuilt the Challenger on purpose. It has the battery to cruise for a decent range. Best as described above.. as a commuter wheel.

InMotion is in touch with the community and even put out a survey (did you even see it?) to get input for a future wheel. As such, they are already working on the next one. Smaller suspension wheel is already in the plans..

     I’m not that good at guessing people’s mind, but I doubt V12 and V13 will have great selling success. I doubt V12 is outselling the T4 and V13 is outselling the Begode’s 3600 or 4800Wh wheels. S20/22 had a lot a sells from those who want to do off-road and jumps. A lot of Masters for those who love speed. That aside, I don’t claim this wheel has no market- for you and several others might be exactly what is needed, and that is absolutely  OK. I am worried about InMotion, as it is one of the producers that value quality. What will we end up with, Begode? I don’t want to buy that crap.
 

    The survey was about a future wheel, not about the V12 and V13, but it is a good start 🙂

[UPONIT]

8 hours ago, Paul A said:

 

Chooch's comments from his latest video of Jan 16, 2023.

 

MOST RELIABLE ELECTRIC UNICYCLES: (iNMOTION V12 HT, O.G VETERAN SHERMAN, Msuper Pro HT)

www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTw6k-LZQBM

 

 

Whoops.

3 hours ago, Nostris said:

I’ll be very interested to hear how that goes. I was wondering when we would have someone who wants a 50kg V13 as a starter wheel 🙄😏

It will probably be harder for him than a smaller wheel, yes. But then everything else will seem easier. I'd be more worried that my expensive wheel will get banged up.

I learned to balance on astroturf even though it was terrible for learning and everyone said not to. Probably added a week. But my number one goal was: No injuries. Then when I went to asphalt: magically easier.

I wish him luck and I'm jealous he's going to have the V13 already.

7 hours ago, Paul g said:

 

One thing InMotion didn’t got right with V13 is the 22’ wheel, IMO. I would’ve loved a 20’ wheel for more agility at speed and lighter weight. The V13 is not a cruiser, it doesn’t have the battery for that, so all that extra weight of the wheel it makes no sense. I also would’ve liked for them to make a V12 16’ with suspension or make it 18’ without suspension, so I think they didn’t got it right here either. They should be more in touch with the community otherwise they will keep doing stuff that makes no sense, or they’re already outdated.

Here are the top ten selling wheels at EEVEEs

s22
shermax
V11
V12HS
V12ht
Master
V8F
Sherman-S preorder
S18
V10f

Here are the Top ten at Alienrides (They don't carry the V11 or LK wheels)

Master
Mten4 preorder
Nikola (sale)
T4
EXN
V12
S22
EB Commander (sale)
Master Pro
V13 preorder

So it seems like Inmotion is doing okay?
 

[Paul g]

17 minutes ago, UPONIT said:

Whoops.

It will probably be harder for him than a smaller wheel, yes. But then everything else will seem easier. I'd be more worried that my expensive wheel will get banged up.

I learned to balance on astroturf even though it was terrible for learning and everyone said not to. Probably added a week. But my number one goal was: No injuries. Then when I went to asphalt: magically easier.

I wish him luck and I'm jealous he's going to have the V13 already.

Here are the top ten selling wheels at EEVEEs

s22
shermax
V11
V12HS
V12ht
Master
V8F
Sherman-S preorder
S18
V10f

Here are the Top ten at Alienrides (They don't carry the V11 or LK wheels)

Master
Mten4 preorder
Nikola (sale)
T4
EXN
V12
S22
EB Commander (sale)
Master Pro
V13 preorder

So it seems like Inmotion is doing okay?
 

In the US there are a lot more sales that Canada, maybe several times more, so I don’t know if it makes big difference.  EU seems to get wheels from producers a lot later then US, so I guess the number of sells must be lower as well.

Canada needs water resistance, quality 🌧️ , in California is not a necessity 🌞 

Thank you so much!👍.  It would be nice if we would have more info from EU, UK about top sellings, but here they’re very secretive 😭😭😭

[Rawnei]

9 hours ago, Paul A said:

 

Funny, he's always the victim, fact is a lot of people reacted and where negatively vocal about the Dawn video and she also gave a cool headed response acknowledging it and owning the fact. I never saw Chooch acknowledge any critique.

[techyiam]

10 minutes ago, Paul g said:

UK about top sellings,

V11. V10F, V12 are top sellers at e-rides.

E-rides Top Sellers

 

[Paul g]

1 hour ago, techyiam said:

V11. V10F, V12 are top sellers at e-rides.

E-rides Top Sellers

 

According to that:  

SherMax

V11

 S20/22

S18

V10F

V12

16X

MCM5 🤣🤣

I don’t know what to make of that. These must be all the wheels they’ve ever sold 😂

The Master is at the end of the list 🤣

[Uras]

Dawn mentioned all the electronic hobbling of the wheel. Coming from a motorcycle background I hated that stuff. Brake switch, sidestand switch, clutch switch, neutral switch etc. Each and everyone of these switches eventually fails and it takes some investigating to find out what the problem is. I would spend a few hours on each new bike to neutralize that bs. I don't think you can with the v13 - it's in the firmware etc. I will avoid it with distaste. It looked problematic for those dudes riding it.

Edited January 17, 2023 by Uras

[techyiam]

6 minutes ago, Paul g said:

don’t know what to make of that.

Sherman Max sold well, as did the S22. For the latter, despite all the issues.

(1l Intermediate sized wheels are selling well on both sides of the Atlantic.

(2) It seems in the US, there is a sizable demand for wheels that are fast, and with range. 

(3) Given what we have witnessed with the S22, despite all the issues, if a manufacturer doesn't respond and keeps quiet, people will continue to buy in large numbers. And after a very lengthy delay, the model with the fixes will be called the Pro version. It doesn't matter on which side of the Atlantic, people will buy.

[dangasaur]

I have a tracking number for a V13 from ewheels.  FedEx says it arrives this Saturday.

[Paul g]

37 minutes ago, techyiam said:

(3) Given what we have witnessed with the S22, despite all the issues, if a manufacturer doesn't respond and keeps quiet, people will continue to buy in large numbers. And after a very lengthy delay, the model with the fixes will be called the Pro version. It doesn't matter on which side of the Atlantic, people will buy.

    S22 had great success because it is undoubtably the best suspension out there. I rode that thing and one could do a 1 meter drop no problem. You can ride it trough city potholes and speed bumps and not give a damn. I know a lot of people do trails on it and is great. Hmm, I don’t really think is because KS kept quiet, IMO people simply found solutions around the issues KS was incapable of doing right. The shops even repaired their motors, which is ridiculous 😂. I heard the torque improved trough FW compared to the first batches, so I see it as a good wheel (if all issues solved) but I still have a faith issue with it- what if it cuts out when I brake or ride a steep hill? I wouldn’t buy one right now.

[techyiam]

19 minutes ago, Paul g said:

S22 had great success because it is undoubtably the best suspension out there. I rode that thing and one could do a 1 meter drop no problem. You can ride it trough city potholes and speed bumps and not give a damn. I know a lot of people do trails on it and is great. Hmm, I don’t really think is because KS kept quiet, IMO people simply found solutions around the issues KS was incapable of doing right. The shops even repaired their motors, which is ridiculous 😂. I heard the torque improved trough FW compared to the first batches, so I see it as a good wheel (if all issues solved) but I still have a faith issue with it- what if it cuts out when I brake or ride a steep hill? I wouldn’t buy one right now.

That's just it. It may be a tough little bugger off road when it is sorted, but it is being sold as a new wheel, and not as a kit. I guess there must enough electric wheel riders out there who are capable of working on their own wheels, and don't mind doing all the fixes.

[Punxatawneyjoe]

49 minutes ago, dangasaur said:

I have a tracking number for a V13 from ewheels.  FedEx says it arrives this Saturday.

Congratz, how long ago did you pre-order if you don't mind me asking? Also any mention of the seat/stand being included as some have?

[dangasaur]

1 hour ago, Punxatawneyjoe said:

Congratz, how long ago did you pre-order if you don't mind me asking? Also any mention of the seat/stand being included as some have?

I can't remember exactly when I switched my Master pre-order to the V13 but it was sometime in the fall. 

ewheels says: "The seats/stands are being flown in once Inmotion gets back from their holiday in a couple weeks, probably the first week of next month."