ir_fuel Posted July 31, 2019 Author Share Posted July 31, 2019 3 minutes ago, Mike Sacristan said: Where did the MCM5 fail you in regards to off-roading? In my eyes it's not an off-road wheel. Low clearance between the bottom part of the shell and the road. A shape which does not allow you to use your legs at all (it's an egg) and a bigger wheel will move better over obstacles. Of course it's a very good mountain climber and for light offroading it will be perfect (the kind of off road you could do with a normal bicycle), because of the heaps of torque and the nimbleness. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted July 31, 2019 Author Share Posted July 31, 2019 6 minutes ago, Mike Sacristan said: I have done a bit of off-roading with a V10 and it was veeeeeery good. Easier to manage on hills as well as I can't create the proper leverage to manipulate the MSX in some scenarios and have to bail. That was something I wondered as well. With gear I will be about 7kg heavier than you, but I am no big/heavy guy and it seems you need to "man handle" the MSX quite a bit. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Sacristan Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 4 minutes ago, ir_fuel said: That was something I wondered as well. With gear I will be about 7kg heavier than you, but I am no big/heavy guy and it seems you need to "man handle" the MSX quite a bit. Yes indeed! I'm 163cm. So not a tall guy. I do exercise religiously and that involves weightlifting and calisthenics. I never skip leg day because they are the foundation of my EUC riding. 7 minutes ago, ir_fuel said: In my eyes it's not an off-road wheel. Low clearance between the bottom part of the shell and the road. A shape which does not allow you to use your legs at all (it's an egg) and a bigger wheel will move better over obstacles. Of course it's a very good mountain climber and for light offroading it will be perfect (the kind of off road you could do with a normal bicycle), because of the heaps of torque and the nimbleness. Alright makes sense and that's pretty much what I though. It must be great on BMX tracks though? Or maybe not because of the side to side floppiness. I tried MSX, Nikola and V10F on a steep incline which was an entry ramp to a BMX track. The V10F went up without any effort. The Nikola went up with some effort. The MSX went up with more effort. The test was then repeated with two other riders weighing 85kg and 90kg. Same results. Where is your power now MSX? Whats good is all your power if it cannot be applied? Also I think most MSX have a firmware issue that cause the pedals to dip for every bump you hit. This is especially pronounced in the soft mode. So if you were to ride a path where a tractor has ridden through mud and the mud has then hardened... the MSX will dip for every bump and not be able to recover in time. Eventually you will end up at an extreme angle with your feet trying to slip off the pedals. Frozen horse path 15 minutes in: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted July 31, 2019 Author Share Posted July 31, 2019 15 minutes ago, Mike Sacristan said: It must be great on BMX tracks though? Or maybe not because of the side to side floppiness. I think so. The floppiness is something you get used to. Core stability baby 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RagingGrandpa Posted August 5, 2019 Share Posted August 5, 2019 On 7/31/2019 at 8:26 AM, ir_fuel said: In my eyes [MCM5] is not an off-road wheel. Low clearance between the bottom part of the shell and the road. A shape which does not allow you to use your legs at all (it's an egg) and a bigger wheel will move better over obstacles. Of course it's a very good mountain climber and for light offroading it will be perfect (the kind of off road you could do with a normal bicycle), because of the heaps of torque and the nimbleness. Opinions please: So what about MTB (non-motorized mountain biking) trails? MTen3 vs MCM5 vs MSX? (Narrow, twisty, steep, roots, ruts, and lowspeed <20mph.) My MTen3 has the grunt and the maneuverability for slow MTB, but the low pedal height means it gets tripped by rocks/roots/ruts too often. Obstacles with a step height greater than 3" require a jump or dismount. More frontal exposure of the tire would help (eg: larger tire diameter projecting further ahead of the rider's feet). Lowspeed maneuverability is critical to avoid single obstacles that are spotted at the last moment... big EUC's sound bad for this slow twisty MTB. Can't hold a camera in the most challenging spots, but some obstacles visible above... and yes I ride connectors-rearward, when plowing thru debris on trails. Thx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted August 5, 2019 Author Share Posted August 5, 2019 6 minutes ago, RagingGrandpa said: So what about MTB (non-motorized mountain biking) trails? MTen3 vs MCM5 vs MSX? MSX. Low speed stability really isn't an issue. I use my KS16X off road now and it does all that perfectly. A bigger wheel also tackles obstacles better. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted August 5, 2019 Share Posted August 5, 2019 The MSX is the MTB trail king both for the wide tire, high pedals, and the steep pedal angle allowing you to grab and control the wheel like no other. The MCM5 pedals are pretty low if you look at them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Sacristan Posted August 5, 2019 Share Posted August 5, 2019 Just prepare for it to crack all over the place if you don't pad it up. The Nikola riders that I went riding with did very well off road on rocks and roots. And even though one of the riders bailed and dropped his wheel a few times all he got was a few scuff marks. I've droppen my wheel at slow speed and if it lands on a stone you are in trouble. The MSX tends to want to crack around the screws. Also change the tyre. The standard tyre isn't all that great for off roading as it's more of a semi slick. I do fine with it though at low PSI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RagingGrandpa Posted August 5, 2019 Share Posted August 5, 2019 5 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said: The MSX is the MTB trail king both for the wide tire, high pedals, and the steep pedal angle allowing you to grab and control the wheel like no other. The MCM5 pedals are pretty low if you look at them.https://youtu.be/bcXCcviPsnk Ah. Those are my local riders Time to go with the flow I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cuu Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 Chooch tech says he likes the s18 over the msx for technical trails over the msx. Any thoughts on these 2 comparisons? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RagingGrandpa Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 @colton loves to ride, period S18 main drawbacks for rugged singletrack use are: Easier to overlean / overpower the wheel than C30 MSuper's. (And MSP C38 is even more capable!) Difficult to fit big power pads to its non-uniform shell shape. (A problem that's solvable with effort.) Poor and/or unproven mechanical durability. The safety-critical flex cable is uncharted territory for EUC's. The S18 sliding stanchion dust caps constantly pop out. Vulnerable moving parts are exposed in many areas. Can't fit an AT tire into the fender. Your local terrain may favor one more than the other. If it's lumpy grass ~20mph, choose S18. You said roots rocks and ruts- clear choice for MSuper IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrelwood Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 4 hours ago, RagingGrandpa said: Roots like that were an interesting challenge to me with the MSX, but they are a pure joyride with the V11 with suitable shock pressures! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cuu Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 Haven't really gotten a consensus so far. In regards to technical trails. Mrelwood , you seem to do a bit of off roading and have an idea on the different tires. What are your thoughts for the best wheel of the 3? S18, v11, msx? Also, do you know if the v11 can take knobbies? Like the kenda k262? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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