Musicacbx Posted June 27, 2018 Share Posted June 27, 2018 I am looking to get a wheel but prices in the UK seem very high I found a deal for £270 delivered from banggood for a Ninebot C+ https://www.gearbest.com/scooters-and-wheels/pp_1699240.html?wid=1433363 Anyone recommend anything for a similar price or if I should save up more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 8 hours ago, Musicacbx said: Anyone recommend anything for a similar price or if I should save up more? Answer: No - unless you can find a VERY good 2nd hand deal - and Yes! The C+ is now a very old design. Welcome to the forum please have a read of other very similar posts that we get as we always start by asking the same questions that you haven’t answered I.e. how much do you weigh (absolutely critical) and where/how do you intend to ride it I.e. what is the wheel for? How hilly is it where you are? A typical similar post this week is here for example: Buy cheap, buy twice is a well known phrase. If you are not sure and don’t want to commit the cash and you are not heavy a NB C+ will make a training wheel OK but look at this thread for an example of how quickly the user “grew out of one”: Finally, these are not mature products and problems occur. If you are tech savvy and can save enough money that you can consider the saving worth the risk and you don’t mind waiting then fine go for an import (have you checked if any duty might be payable?) but take a look at this thread - a known firmware problem, a dealer who knew nothing so lied and a buyer stuck with a dangerous wheel: A dealer like Speedyfeet https://www.speedyfeet.co.uk/ has a good reputation and puts a lot back with excellent videos and reviews, so has a very good relationship with the manufacturers, including Ninebot. I’ve not seen anyone give him any sort of negative feedback so he should be happy to help if you have problems. There is another U.K. dealer who claims he is the U.K. “exclusive” dealer for Ninebot, he apparently has an exclusive deal with some shipping company so draw your own conclusions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriull Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 8 hours ago, Musicacbx said: I am looking to get a wheel but prices in the UK seem very high I found a deal for £270 delivered from banggood for a Ninebot C+ https://www.gearbest.com/scooters-and-wheels/pp_1699240.html?wid=1433363 Anyone recommend anything for a similar price or if I should save up more? +1 for save up more. I'd recommend no wheel under something ~680Wh except for kids or riders driving very relaxed and primarily enjoying the scenery; But as Keith said: 12 minutes ago, Keith said: Welcome to the forum please have a read of other very similar posts that we get as we always start by asking the same questions that you haven’t answered I.e. how much do you weigh (absolutely critical) and where/how do you intend to ride it I.e. what is the wheel for? How hilly is it where you are? you'll find much information in all of the "newcommer" topics! ... and as you see there, you'll get quite any information once you reveal a bit about your goals... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicacbx Posted June 28, 2018 Author Share Posted June 28, 2018 Thanks for the advice guys. I can see me getting one and not using it like most things I buy so I am reluctant to spend 600-1000 on one and it end up like my bike,scooter, racing drone, you name it I've probably had one. The speed limit shouldn't be an issue for my intended use (playing Pokemon Go which has a speed limit in the game where if you go too fast it stops spawning pokemon). I am 86kg or 190 pounds which every you prefer to work with. I am pretty tech savy with opening up devices for replacing parts or repairing, only really shy away from soldering. I had a look at speedyfeet and a few other UK Sellers from the thread below but the cheapest ones I can find are almost double the price. Some of the threads are recommending entry wheels starting at triple the price I just can't justify that increase at my current interest level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriull Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 29 minutes ago, Musicacbx said: The speed limit shouldn't be an issue for my intended use (playing Pokemon Go which has a speed limit in the game where if you go too fast it stops spawning pokemon) It's not only the speed limit but the danger of overleans (faceplants). And the range. With 29 minutes ago, Musicacbx said: 86kg or 190 pounds you'll never reach the advertised range. And if there are some hills at your route quite nothing is left from this advertised 22km ... And one does not really want to drive with low batteries ( lessened top speed, less power and more risk to overlean)... The C+ has just 220Wh - that are 15 li ion cells in series. Absolutely not recommandable for riding with 86 kg... ;( Just if you try it and then not use it it'll be ok Also for relaxed riding at least the 2 cells in series as the E+ has should be the minimum... 29 minutes ago, Musicacbx said: I had a look at speedyfeet and a few other UK Sellers from the thread below but the cheapest ones I can find are almost double the price. As they have at least double the battery inside, are new(er) wheels and you'll have (real) warranty and support... 29 minutes ago, Musicacbx said: Some of the threads are recommending entry wheels starting at triple the price I just can't justify that increase at my current interest level. As the C+ is an old design with very low battery capacity and low power but a solid wheel you can try it out and sell it again if you don't use it or like something stronger... Be prepared that such offers could be dead on arrival (li ion batteries dead, because they were stored too long without charge) - but I'd assume that gearbest has a good customer protection for such cases? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 10 hours ago, Musicacbx said: I am looking to get a wheel but prices in the UK seem very high I found a deal for £270 delivered from banggood for a Ninebot C+ https://www.gearbest.com/scooters-and-wheels/pp_1699240.html?wid=1433363 Anyone recommend anything for a similar price or if I should save up more? Sounds like me in the beginning. "I want an euc" "Oh cool, budget of around 500 euros should do the trick apparently" *does some research* Ends up paying double for an Inmotion V8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 you can always sell it if you don't like it ,i was the same i didn't want to spend £1000 on an euc i bought the kingsong ks16s now i want another for longer range it's motor is strong trust me when you learn to ride it you'll be amazed how little power a cheaper one has and battery dies quicker ,you can knock so many miles up just doing nothing , if you buy the cheaper one you'll end up wanting to upgrade soon enough which may cost you more in the long run , we are only here to advise but it's your choice after all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicacbx Posted June 28, 2018 Author Share Posted June 28, 2018 Alright guys thanks a lot for the quick responses. Not exactly what I wanted to hear but sage advice. As no one seems to recommend it I think I will just keep lurking. Give me some time to save up some more. Looks like we are close to new models being released by top brands so older models might sell off for cheaper. Could someone tell me what type of £££ price I should expect to pay so I can look at for wheels at around that price bracket. 51 minutes ago, stephen said: i didn't want to spend £1000 on an euc i bought the kingsong ks16s Is this not over a £1000? https://www.speedyfeet.co.uk/collections/electric-unicycle/products/kingsong-ks-16s Wish it was easier to make decisions quadruple the price really does put me off without trying one first. You have a good point the model is over 3 years old and gearbest is hit and miss often not worth the hassle as chinese shipping. 1 hour ago, Chriull said: Be prepared that such offers could be dead on arrival (li ion batteries dead, because they were stored too long without charge) - but I'd assume that gearbest has a good customer protection for such cases? Could you explain this bit? Read some horror stories of wheels throwing riders off violently. 1 hour ago, Chriull said: It's not only the speed limit but the danger of overleans (faceplants) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriull Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 24 minutes ago, Musicacbx said: Alright guys thanks a lot for the quick responses. Not exactly what I wanted to hear but sage advice. As no one seems to recommend it I think I will just keep lurking. Give me some time to save up some more. Looks like we are close to new models being released by top brands so older models might sell off for cheaper. Could someone tell me what type of £££ price I should expect to pay so I can look at for wheels at around that price bracket. Is this not over a £1000? https://www.speedyfeet.co.uk/collections/electric-unicycle/products/kingsong-ks-16s Wish it was easier to make decisions quadruple the price really does put me off without trying one first. 24 minutes ago, Musicacbx said: You have a good point the model is over 3 years old and gearbest is hit and miss often not worth the hassle as chinese shipping. I think with ?ninebot S1 or S2 there was same big sale in the US via amazon ? where there were some reports of dead batteries - no prob to get the money back but still some hassle. As there is a second gen ninebot one e+ the c+ is maybe also still in production? Or they just sell it with new batteries? So i have no direct experience with that - just a small hint of a "maybe" hassle... 24 minutes ago, Musicacbx said: Could you explain this bit? Read some horror stories of wheels throwing riders off violently. EUCs work by accelerating or decelerating so they stay always below your center of gravity (cog). So if you lean forward and shift your cog in front of the wheel it measures that the pedal tilts forward and accelerates until the pedal is straight again (and so the wheel is below your cog). That's more or less the "self balancing" how the EUCs work. Unfortionately each engine has only limited power - with a car or a motorcycle thats not too much of a problem. As max power is reached one just does not accelerate anymore and rolls on. With an EUC that's a severe problem - if one stays leaning forward and by this forces the EUC to accelerate to keep you in balance one also reaches sometimes the point when the engine cannot accelerate anymore. Since one is leaning forward and the EUC cannot accelerate (balance one) anymore that means one will fall... Same is true if one drives from a flat piece up to an incline - on the flat piece the EUC motor had enough power to balance one and drive on, but for the incline the motor would need more power that's just not available -> one falls again if one does not accordingly reduce speed before the incline. This "incline" can also be some bump one is driving over... Unfortionately one does not have an acoustic feedback - with a car or motorcycle one hears once the motor is "stressed". E-motors are much more silent and it's almost impossible to hear the "stress" (at least for me). If one is very experienced one can feel a little bit the wheel getting "weaker" by the pedals getting softer and evade such situations. Theoretically sometimes - but i would not count on that. Also every electric motor generates a voltage once it turns - the higher the speed the higher the generated voltage gets. So once this generated voltage equals the battery voltage the e-motor cannot generate any power anymore. The more a battery is discharged, the lower the voltage gets -> the wheel can only reach lower speeds. Every battery also has an internal resistance, so the more current is flowing (burden from the motor producing output power) the lower the battery voltage gets. And empty batteries have an higher internal resistance... So one point for safety is to put more batteries in parallel - that lessens the internal resistance and by this the voltage sags under load. The C+ just have one cell "in parallel" - and the cells have some nominal current of around 10A. With the 55V nominal voltage thats 550W they can deliver nominaly. They still deliver some more peak power but that's not really much reserve for driving. A more technical look at these points you can find under: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 Your best bet is waiting for a used wheel opportunity, sometimes crazy good offers appear in an instant (Facebook, used wheel forum here). If you're lucky then... Or you take the plunge and go for broke literally and spend the 1000+. Unfortunately, the best wheel for money ratio is right near the top end (current indisputable winner would be the Gotway ACM2 1300Wh from Speedy Feet). That's how the market works - a lot of fixed costs due to motor etc being always needed, and currently it is battery tech that is is limiting how powerful wheels can be. So battery size is essentially where cost and power differences are, so small battery wheels are both disproportionally more expensive and weak compared to the higher end models. Also, nobody ever complained about getting a too-good wheel or too much battery. Nobody. (Of course if you wanted a super light wheel for frequent carrying, that would be the exception). A "cheap" (not that cheap) wheel is a toy you might quickly grow out of, a "real" wheel is a totally different thing, it's a highly useful machine. And if you really don't like electric unicycling, you can always sell again. You'll eat the initial depreciation, but the market is growing and new interested people (like you) are always looking for a cheaper entry due to the aforementioned market skew towards expensive wheels. So selling a used wheel, especially one of the latest and greatest models that hasn't been used too much, doesn't seem to be a problem at all. I'd say, for now your plan to wait and read more and think is a good one. Tell us how you imagine you would use your wheel, and we can help find some models that work for you. If you really just plan to use it for Pokemon Go, one of the smallest/"cheapest" models (Ninebot One E+ or S2, older Gotway MCM, Inmotion V5F) will be easily enough, but you're halfway missing the point (fun) of electric unicycles then. But tbh, I think anything under 500£ (and that is already NOT cheap) is but a waste of money, unless you buy a noname Chinese deathtrap, ride sloooooooowly for a week (barely over walking speed), and then throw it in a corner and forget it ever existed. Speedyfeet orders by price and this is a good overview: https://www.speedyfeet.co.uk/collections/electric-unicycle This is a U.S. seller, but nice overview of what good brand models are available, too: http://www.ewheels.com/shop/ (prices are better there, don't get your hopes up too much for EU) I'd say: V5F, or go for a "real" wheel that is good for much more than Pokemon Go. 3 hours ago, ir_fuel said: Sounds like me in the beginning. "I want an euc" "Oh cool, budget of around 500 euros should do the trick apparently" *does some research* Ends up paying double for an Inmotion V8 And you didn't stop at the V8, right? Was the same for me: *Sees EUCs, desperately wants EUC* "How much can these things cost, 500€?" "Oh, looks more like 1000... I should stay under 1000, more is crazy." ... *Buys wheel for 1650€ (ACM 1300Wh)* *Later, regrets a bit not getting the 2000€ bigger battery version, despite the disproportional extra price for a mere 300Wh* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ir_fuel Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 1 hour ago, meepmeepmayer said: Also, nobody ever complained about getting a too-good wheel or too much battery. Nobody. (Of course if you wanted a super light wheel for frequent carrying, that would be the exception). A "cheap" (not that cheap) wheel is a toy you might quickly grow out of, a "real" wheel is a totally different thing, it's a highly useful machine. I have a 14" generic here. I bought it to learn (and now my daughter is learning on it). It took me exactly 2 weeks to grow out of it and never use it again for transportation. 1 hour ago, meepmeepmayer said: And if you really don't like electric unicycling, you can always sell again. You'll eat the initial depreciation, but the market is growing and new interested people (like you) are always looking for a cheaper entry due to the aforementioned market skew towards expensive wheels. So selling a used wheel, especially one of the latest and greatest models that hasn't been used too much, doesn't seem to be a problem at all. Good point. If you buy a decent wheel the market is always there. My V8 was sold very quickly for a correct price. 1 hour ago, meepmeepmayer said: And you didn't stop at the V8, right? Ehm .... I just wanted to spend 500 euro for something portable to quickly get around the paddock. I ended up buying a V8, Mten3, selling the V8, buying a Rockwheel GT16 and a Z10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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