Johey Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 As EUC is a quite new concept with growing popularity, lots of things are happening. New models constantly pop up. I myself is really new to the "scene", trying to get the picture of the situation. Since I joined here a few days ago, I have been aware of the fact that my Airwheel X8 is of a previous generation. Today they are faster with better battery capacity, bluetooth, lights, trolley handles, speakers and whatnot. To be honest, I've been quite hooked on the ride, and now I'm wondering if it's time to upgrade or to wait for what's around the corner... Whatever it might be. That's what this thread is all about. What is really around the corner? Facts or assumptions are equally appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmethvin Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 This is just like computers were 20 years ago, every few months there is a great new thing that makes you wish you had it. Whereas today, the MacBook Pro that Apple is selling basically hasn't changed in 4 years. Any EUC you buy today will be looking obsolete in 6 months because of some new model or featue! In the past few months there have been really nice new models from Gotway, KingSong, and Inmotion. If you like riding you just have to buy something and be happy riding it for a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johey Posted August 11, 2016 Author Share Posted August 11, 2016 Yeah, well if you bought a brand new high end 386 you could skip the 486 and wait for the pentium. I really hope to ride my new thing a few years before upgrading again. The used X8 I bought was great to learn on. Would hurt to scratch a EUR 1000-2000 ride as bad as I've scratched the X8. What I want is a little more speed and a far better range. Both are solved with the models of today, but especially the distance is really down to the more the merrier. If you think there will be a 100 km ride in half a year, I'd wait. In contrast, if the near future is about new colors and louder speakers, I have no reason to hold my breath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason McNeil Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 1 hour ago, dmethvin said: Any EUC you buy today will be looking obsolete in 6 months because of some new model or featue! In the past few months there have been really nice new models from Gotway, KingSong, and Inmotion. True, but the fundamentals like power/weight are somewhat constrained by the properties of materials: conductivity of copper, magnetic flux saturation of iron, energy/power density of batteries. Manufacturers will likely make inroads with better control-board cooling, using higher voltages offers the possibility of higher RPMs with higher efficiency. The objective of every Wheel maker should be to create a product where the risk of cut-outs becomes an infinitesimally improbable event. There's still a lot to be done of the App front: every Wheel ought to be required to have an integrated black-box on the board, more sophisticated battery metering, improved way of monitoring current power level as a % of potential output based on battery level/aging properties, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricGhost Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 17 minutes ago, Jason McNeil said: The objective of every Wheel maker should be to create a product where the risk of cut-outs becomes an infinitesimally improbable event. My 1st priority in buying, then range and at last speed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johey Posted August 11, 2016 Author Share Posted August 11, 2016 Only for them who value their lives. No, that's a very valid point. If a car cuts out, it stops. If a EUC cuts out, you fall. It simply must not happen. Can we tell if this is one of the greatest priorities from the manufacturers for the upcoming models, or is the speed and range more important? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmethvin Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 2 hours ago, Johey said: If you think there will be a 100 km ride in half a year, I'd wait. In contrast, if the near future is about new colors and louder speakers, I have no reason to hold my breath. It takes a lot of heavy batteries to ride 100km on a charge--that would be at least 5 hours of riding--so I'm not sure that would be something to wish for. The big question is whether you can ride a wheel for 3 or 4 years with just some basic maintenance like tires and tubes. These things are so new that we don't have a lot of long-term reliability or wear data for them. My wheel has just passed 1 year and 2000km recently, it seems to be doing fine. I really want an Inmotion V5F+ but am going to wait a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HEC Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 6 hours ago, EricGhost said: My 1st priority in buying, then range and at last speed Good then I have a wheel for you which can go over 100 km on 840Wh battery pack! But you can go only 7 km/h Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve454 Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 9 hours ago, dmethvin said: In the past few months there have been really nice new models from Gotway, KingSong, and Inmotion. If you like riding you just have to buy something and be happy riding it for a year. Yes, it seems like we have just turned the corner and it is way too early to look for the next corner. Any of the ones @dmethvin mentioned would probably be good to buy and keep for a long time. My Ninebot is definitely a good wheel, but the design is two years old. The Inmotion V5F+ looks very interesting, so does the new Gotway and Kingsong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johey Posted August 12, 2016 Author Share Posted August 12, 2016 Yeah, let's hope the corner is far away, cause now I've ordered the KS16. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve454 Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 18 hours ago, Jason McNeil said: There's still a lot to be done of the App front: every Wheel ought to be required to have an integrated black-box on the board, more sophisticated battery metering, improved way of monitoring current power level as a % of potential output based on battery level/aging properties, etc. I agree, and hope that future App updates will begin to include these things. About once a month I get a message that a new version of the App is available on my Ninebot and I always install it, but cannot see any changes. I wonder if these updates are changing anything or just sending feedback to Ninebot? I know the new S2 has diagnostics in the App, why can't that work on the NB1? Is it because the motherboard of the older Ninebot does not have that built in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricGhost Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 12 hours ago, HEC said: Good then I have a wheel for you which can go over 100 km on 840Wh battery pack! But you can go only 7 km/h Infinetesimily cut off probabilty? Range too much 50km with batteries down to 25% more than enough! Speed too slow min 25kmh I'll wait you next version, to beat my KS16 you need to reduce cut off probabilty I tried to ride the longest but after 20km stand up I needed a rest and a beer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David S Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 I agree with Jason that the only real major improvements i could see happening are on the software side. My KS16 has way more range that I have used so far, i haven't even got it under 50% yet. I never intend on wearing any pads while riding and i feel the 19mph top speed is about as fast as i feel comfortable going unless i knew there was an almost impossible chance of power cutting off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mindvirus Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 In my mind - the biggest thing is safety. My first/only wheel is an Airwheel X8, and while it was a lot of fun, as someone else on the forums noted "it tries to kill you sometimes". Fortunately it's pretty slow. So I'd like to be convinced that these wheels aren't going to shut off randomly and so on. I realize this is an old wheel and things have changed a lot since then, but I'm still nervous my wheel could cut out at any point. I would also like to see some innovation in terms of weight - at 12kg+ (26lbs) they are still quite heavy to haul around, especially if part of the commute is carrying the wheel. The Solowheel Orbit (which didn't ever get released as far as I can tell) was supposed to be 6kg (13lbs) which would have been a huge deal, even at sacrificed range. This would be great for commuters. A minor thing that I'd like to see is some accessories like a charging stand, for nicer aesthetics at home. Also - would be cool to have a mount for a GoPro built in. Easy enough to DIY though. I would also really like to see some open firmware, so that the community could contribute to making a better EUC. I feel like people here have very deep understanding of what makes for a good unicycle, and could really contribute in this front. I do agree though that software is going to be the key in the future - these wheels seem to be pretty much good enough at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxLinux Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 On 8/11/2016 at 11:46 AM, EricGhost said: My 1st priority in buying, then range and at last speed Instead of no cutouts, range, speed, my list is: No cutouts, hill climbing, range. I'd much rather have a slow wheel that doesn't stall on hills vs. a fast wheel that I have to carry up hills. I like Gotway's concept in the past of having a high torque version and a high speed version. That idea seems to be gone. So assuming there is only one version of a given wheel, I would always select a wheel known for high torque. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxLinux Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 On 8/11/2016 at 11:29 AM, Jason McNeil said: There's still a lot to be done of the App front IPS has a decent app, but I wish the hardness of the ride would be more selectable. IPS gives me a choice of "sport" (hard) or "comfort" (soft) mode. Definitely sport is harder than comfort, but these are IPS's definition of what sport should feel like and what comfort should feel like. I wish it had an incremental range from 1-10 or even 1-5 to select the hardness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizardmech Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 Here's a 2000W power inverter designed with the newest stuff. EUC inverters only have to deal with about 300W continuous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricGhost Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 2 hours ago, MaxLinux said: Instead of no cutouts, range, speed, my list is: No cutouts, hill climbing, range. I'd much rather have a slow wheel that doesn't stall on hills vs. a fast wheel that I have to carry up hills. I like Gotway's concept in the past of having a high torque version and a high speed version. That idea seems to be gone. So assuming there is only one version of a given wheel, I would always select a wheel known for high torque. You're right no cut out, torque, range, speed but min 20-25 kmh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lef38 Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 4 hours ago, mindvirus said: The Solowheel Orbit (which didn't ever get released as far as I can tell) was supposed to be 6kg (13lbs) which would have been a huge deal, even at sacrificed range. This would be great for commuters. The Orbit wasn't a wheel, only a strange concept: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mindvirus Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 That's the Orbit Wheel - the Solowheel Orbit is: https://www.engadget.com/2014/06/21/solowheel-spirit-cruise-xtreme-orbit-hovertrax/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxLinux Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 That's an interesting article from back in 2014. Since then Solowheel seems to have ceased to be a serious wheel company, barely existing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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