EUC longevity

[Pingouin]

Hi,

I just wanted your thoughts on the longevity of EUC. How long in general do you think of keeping them ? (in time and distance) Do you think that "advance riding" like one foot, backwards and stunts may decrease the wheels longevity ?

Thanks

[Mono]

I expect that battery and tire are the components you will have to replace first, irrespectively of riding backwards or one footed. 

[Pingouin]

Well the batteries should last at least 2 years even while riding every day (that would be max 700 cycles), as for the tire I'm not sure about the longevity.

I'm more concern avout the motor axis, bearings, electronics if I tend to do more and more "advance riding" as I want to keep my EUC for trips, what do you think ?

[US69]

i would also suspect motor axxis and bearings to give up first....

batteries are long proofed standard industrial 18650.... known for long cycle live... if you dont do someting stupid with them...

tyre is a "use" thing...certainly at some point they need a change...

[Pingouin]

I wonder how your riding style affects the longevity of these

[Mono]

29 minutes ago, KingSong69 said:

i would also suspect motor axxis and bearings to give up first....

for any reasonably designed device bearings will, on average, sustain much longer than tires, as it is the case for bicycles, electric bicycles, motorcycles and cars. You need to wear down at least about five sets of tires before the gearings become an issue. What is your reason to believe this is not the case with EUCs?

[Pingouin]

It's true I never heard of a broken bearing on a bycicle (I did on a car, at 200+ thousands km). I don't know however how long does a tire lasts, on my bycicles, the oldest has about 10 000km and I didn't change them, but with a unicycle, I don't know.

For the motor axis, it's mainly the fact of riding one foot often that worries me, do you think it might harm it ?

[Mono]

On 6/18/2016 at 8:29 PM, Pingouin said:

For the motor axis, it's mainly the fact of riding one foot often that worries me, do you think it might harm it ?

No. Jumps are probably by far the heaviest strain on bearings and axis, and it is usually (not always) the bearings that give up, not the axis. If you do >10000 jumps from >20cm I would become indecisive as to whether you should be worried about bearings or axis.

[Mono]

17 minutes ago, Pingouin said:

I don't know however how long does a tire lasts, on my bycicles, the oldest has about 10 000km and I didn't change them, but with a unicycle, I don't know.

Right, I would say pretty similar, at least 5000km, but I wouldn't be surprised if it would make 10000km or more. Of course that can very much depend on the specific tire used. 

[Cloud]

14 minutes ago, Niko said:

No. Jumps are probably by far the heaviest strain on bearings and axis, and it is usually (not always) the bearings that give up, not the axis. If you do >10000 jumps from >20cm I would become indecisive as to whether you should be worried about bearings or axis.

I have first hand experience that shows me that one SHOULD worry about the strain put on the motor shaft, even though different brands may have different designs, shaft thicknesses and profiles.

i would think that riding one footed long enough and the double loading of the shaft can have an effect. Also of course jumps and continuous hitting of smaller obstacles, pot holes, uneven pavement, sidewalk concrete plates, etc. Dynamic load of jumping is a killer. Doesnt help if one is heavy either

Without going into much detail, i recommend that , especially if one is north of 85kg , one try to minimize placing dynamic loads on the shaft as well as riding one footed for  long periods of time. Riding one foot for a short time should not cause a problem as we normally put a double load on the shaft anyway during turns/ certain leans etc, so additional short time one foot riding will not make that much of a difference. Just minimize hits, pothole , any other momentary high dynamic loads and continuos smaller dynamic loads

[Mono]

1 hour ago, Cloud said:

I have first hand experience that shows me that one SHOULD worry about the strain put on the motor shaft, even though different brands may have different designs, shaft thicknesses and profiles.

More specifically?

[Cloud]

4 minutes ago, Niko said:

More specifically?

I dont want to post specifics so as not to skew people's opinion for or against particular brands, where brand may have nothing to do with the problem. While the eucs are just developing and the overall exprerience as to the longevity of certain parts is still limited, isolated incidents are still perceived as statistics and easily affect the reader's opinion, sometimes unfairly so.

But i am aware of an euc shaft braking under a rather heavy rider who is still within the weight capqcity specified by manufacturer. The rider has not done many curb jumps or any heavy hits. But aparently where the rider's weight is substantial, and a lot of miles ridden, one should be careful putting added loading on the shaft.

[Pingouin]

In general, the smaller the wheel size, the longer the lifetime (like with cars). I'm not so worried about the tire as it's easier to find than the shaft and bearings (and to replace)  

Cloud, I'm about 60kg (including stuff I usually carry with me), should I worry about one foot driving in your opinion ? (not going on bumbs btw)

If I may, what was the model of the unicycle who's shaft failed ?

[TremF]

As the EUC is like a mobility scooter (but much cooler and more fun) for me I can see me using them for as long as I am able to stand. As for the life of each EUC I'm not sure. For me they should hopefully last a long while because I don't do jumps, ride one footed and I'm not too heavy. 

As for how long I would think of keeping them that depends too.

Initially I thought the Ninebot One E+ was going to be enough for me. It was great for commuting and each day I could get to work the short 2.1 mile route then, if the weather was ok, I could come home the longer and more scenic 5.5 mile route then do the extra mile to pick my youngest daughter up from school. The Ninebot needed charging daily though unless I was taking the short route to and from work then I could get 2 days.

With the nice weather though I decided I needed something more. I have a spare battery for my Ninebot but the thought of having to carry a rucksack about to hold the battery and a tool in warm weather made me want to look for something else.

Enter Gotway... towards the end of last year I noticed little video's pop up showcasing their ACM and MSuper V3. Ideally I would have possibly like the MSuper V3 because some of the route I took today would have been easier with an 18" wheel but as the nicer, warmer weather has already started I could not wait another couple of months so opted for the ACM. Initially I was a little worried reading about overheating issues, unstable rides at higher speeds and the control board frying but they fixed all these issues very quickly and since I started looking at the ACM for buying it has had changes to the heatsink, components on the control board, wiring, casing and firmware. Luckily I seem to have got it when most issues have been ironed out. I say most because one serious issue I have found is the rubber pads on the pedals is already wearing and damaged after a couple of days use. They are aware and looking at fixes but it scare me that EUC companies can put their wheels out with so many issues.

Hopefully the ACM should last me a good while (once I get replacement grips for the pedals) because it is fast enough for me and the mileage is pretty good though I probably need to slow down a little to get more miles if needed. I've done about 25 miles today and it really slowed me down and beeped at me at 30%! It didn't title the pedals back though so i probably could have gone a little faster with the beeps.

 

My next upgrade will hopefully be when they can get batteries to definitely last more than 30 miles at a decent speed.

[Pingouin]

You're getting 25 miles & 30% at what average speed ? And with which "Wh" version ?

I'm curious because I'm getting 55km/34miles (real, with bycicle odometer), with 30% battery left at an average speed of 14.5km/h (9mph) in city with lots of accelerations with mine and the ACM was eventually next (along with KS18A)

 

[Mono]

18 minutes ago, Cloud said:

isolated incidents are still perceived as statistics and easily affect the reader's opinion

I don't understand the logic. Using the same line of argument, the incident should not be counted as a shaft failure, given you think it should not be counted as a brand failure.

[Cloud]

14 minutes ago, Niko said:

I don't understand the logic. Using the same line of argument, the incident should not be counted as a shaft failure, given you think it should not be counted as a brand failure.

It is a shaft failure. There are many factors that affect it. The rider's weight affects it, the long miles ridden affect it as any metal can accumulate at least some degree of fatigue, and of course given that it can happen that the shaft breaks, it has to be affected by additional loads , static or dynamic exerted on the shaft. While all of these are the function of the rider, can the rider be blamed? Probably not, because if the riders weight is within the parameters alowable by manufacturer and the riding in more or less normal in terms of no excessive hits or jumps, then it has to come back to the design of the shaft, its profile, thickness and material properties that are not sufficient to withstand the use.

however, one isolated incident is hardly the statistics, so if i start posting specifics and the particular brand, it will make an impression, in the eyes of many, that the brand cannot be trusted or that incidents like this are common, which they may not be. Other brands may have the same or even less reliable design with no similar accidents happening yet, as there is not enough statistics

 

[TremF]

19 minutes ago, Pingouin said:

You're getting 25 miles & 30% at what average speed ? And with which "Wh" version ?

I'm curious because I'm getting 55km/34miles (real, with bycicle odometer), with 30% battery left at an average speed of 14.5km/h (9mph) in city with lots of accelerations with mine and the ACM was eventually next (along with KS18A)

 

I have the 820Wh and have only had mine a couple of days. With a few charge/discharge cycles I might be able to get more out of it but today I did have some uneven ground and travelled upto 19 mph (gps speed). When I have more time I will do the same ride again but at more of a natural cruising speed and more gradual acceleration.

My Ninebot used to give me 11 miles at my usual pace but if I took it easy and kept the route fairly flat I was able to get to around 15 miles. (320Wh) 

[Cloud]

@TremF whats your weight?.  Thanks

[TremF]

Just now, Cloud said:

@TremF whats your weight?.  Thanks

I think I am around 90kg at the moment. I was 80kg but with my dad passing away last year and then Christmas I put some weight on. I am losing it again but, with visiting the gym, I am gaining more with muscle.

[Cloud]

3 minutes ago, TremF said:

I think I am around 90kg at the moment. I was 80kg but with my dad passing away last year and then Christmas I put some weight on. I am losing it again but, with visiting the gym, I am gaining more with muscle.

Your range results are very consistent with mine adjusted by the ratio of our weights. I am about 100kg.

i meed to get back on my weight loss program- i was doing great before going on vacation where i let myself go.

[Pingouin]

Cloud, for how long have you been riding your euc ? how many miles ? No failures ?

[Cloud]

14 minutes ago, Pingouin said:

Cloud, for how long have you been riding your euc ? how many miles ? No failures ?

I have 2 wheels, been riding since last september.  Combined kilometers, cant say exactly but guessing about 4000 

yes there are some failures, ive had many issues but i have to say that the riders weight is proportional to the probability or frequency of having issues. If i had to name one most annoying and frequent , this would be broken tubes in the tire.  I probably had to change it like 10 times or more. And its not punctures, but somehow the tube gets rubbed by something and eventually fails. I think that the weight may have something to do with it, they keep breaking on me, so ive reconciled myself with the inevitability.

there were many other incidents, as i like to experiment with my riding, so ive found quite a few weak points my wheel have. 

overall i am still happy, love my wheels, and cant live without them

[Pingouin]

What are the two wheels you own ?

As for the tire tubes, that's a lot !

[Shoe73]

6 hours ago, Cloud said:

And its not punctures, but somehow the tube gets rubbed by something and eventually fails. I think that the weight may have something to do with it, they keep breaking on me, so ive reconciled myself with the inevitability

Sounds like you don't have enough pressure in the tire, is that possible? I know it is more comfortable to ride with lower pressure but that used to happen to me on a mountain  bike when I didn't keep the rated pressure in the tube. It would slip a little against the tube and wear.

7 hours ago, Cloud said:

however, one isolated incident is hardly the statistics, so if i start posting specifics and the particular brand, it will make an impression, in the eyes of many, that the brand cannot be trusted or that incidents like this are common, which they may not be. Other brands may have the same or even less reliable design with no similar accidents happening yet, as there is not enough statistics

Trends are discovered through multiple people posting about the same issues on the same models.  If no one reported things for fear of tarnishing the reputation of the manufacturers we would never learn anything. Just be honest and if there is only one report of an issue then people can draw their own conclusions. Also if you report it and someone else has the same issue they will be more likely to chime in as well instead of thinking as you did, 'maybe it's just a one off'.