Anthraksi Posted August 1 Share Posted August 1 2 hours ago, Rawnei said: Not at all concerned, my guess is that he/someone changed tire and did not torque the clamp bolts to spec. Surprising that so many EUC enthusiasts don't have proper tools, torque adapter is not that expensive. He mentioned doing the same test on multiple lynxes. They all swapped their tyres and didnt properly torque the bolts? That said I'm not sure if it's as big of an issue as he makes it out to be. Whatever your wheel is, go grab it by the tire and try flexing it in both directions. There will be some movement. But again, it shouldn't be rubbing on the motor cover. On the video they showed only one side so might be due to bad alignment, but judging by the way it looks it probably is aligned at least somewhat properly. Hard to say and I don't feel like looking at individual frames of the video to confirm it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted August 1 Share Posted August 1 59 minutes ago, Anthraksi said: He mentioned doing the same test on multiple lynxes. They all swapped their tyres and didnt properly torque the bolts? Most likely, yes. People who torque their bolts don't have this play. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omuretsu Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 (edited) Just checked with my own Lynx which is still on the original stock tire. Very solid, no play. Edit: Bracing it the way he did in the video, I am able to get a VERY small amount of movement, but nowhere near what is in the video. Edited August 2 by omuretsu 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t0me Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 (edited) IMO, as suspension loosens up or the wheel ages (mileage) it should start to show that flex because it looks like its the play in the stanchions or bearings that can cause that flex. Or sure, yeah if the motor mount bolts are not tight, or at least the bolts from stanchion to motor. The attachment from the shock body to the battery packs are solid and are attached from flat plane to flat plane and with 8 HT screws each side, and the top section should be solid with 4 bolts a side at the top of the battery packs attaching them to the controller body/heatsink (is that magnesium alloy?) There's little to no movement happening there. That lower end though... not so solid. That clamp that holds the stanchion to the motor is not good grade aluminium. Mate stripped his without a whole lot of force (I was there, I did them up, tested for tightness by feel, got him to check to see he was happy and he stripped one. He was happy with the others without further testing ;-)). Combine that with the fact the stanchions have to be able to move, and can move independently of each other... That's where the flex is happening I think. I did buy a digital torque tester but haven't played with it yet, needed to get a 3/8 to hex adapter. I have the figures noted somewhere. I will recheck mine in a few hundred km's. Without a stanchion that's not round or otherwise prevented from being able to rotate within the body of the shock, you'll get that movement eventually I think regardless of tightness of the stanchion clamp bolts. That lower clamp is a bit of a weak point too I think. Add any movement in the bearings and I think that explains that flex/movement described in that video. My wheel with only a bit more than 2000km's on it, almost no side to side flex between the wheel and pedals/batteries. Edited August 2 by t0me 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daniel1234 Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 (edited) 14 hours ago, Standard4130 said: Any of you guys concerned about this? I know it startled me a bit…. I checked mine and it does flex but not as much as the one in this video…. My lynx started to "flex" after 1500+ km. It got little better after retightening screw and tyre change. But it is still noticeable. It is kinda pissing me off that community is trying to ignore it. I dont like brand fanboys, i don't care with brand they are on. Yeah go blame ppl for doing tyre change incorrectly. Do you really think that people who pay money to race dont know how to change tyre, and only you know how Rawnei? Shock clamp and motor bracked need to be from different material than magnesium or aluminum. I am waiting for more people experience that problem. Obviously if you are not riding hard or not doing stairs daily- you will not see it right away. I don't have elevator in my flat so my wheel jumping daily . Edited August 2 by daniel1234 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 (edited) 6 hours ago, t0me said: IMO, as suspension loosens up or the wheel ages (mileage) it should start to show that flex because it looks like its the play in the stanchions or bearings that can cause that flex. Or sure, yeah if the motor mount bolts are not tight, or at least the bolts from stanchion to motor. The attachment from the shock body to the battery packs are solid and are attached from flat plane to flat plane and with 8 HT screws each side, and the top section should be solid with 4 bolts a side at the top of the battery packs attaching them to the controller body/heatsink (is that magnesium alloy?) There's little to no movement happening there. That lower end though... not so solid. That clamp that holds the stanchion to the motor is not good grade aluminium. Mate stripped his without a whole lot of force (I was there, I did them up, tested for tightness by feel, got him to check to see he was happy and he stripped one. He was happy with the others without further testing ;-)). Combine that with the fact the stanchions have to be able to move, and can move independently of each other... That's where the flex is happening I think. I did buy a digital torque tester but haven't played with it yet, needed to get a 3/8 to hex adapter. I have the figures noted somewhere. I will recheck mine in a few hundred km's. Without a stanchion that's not round or otherwise prevented from being able to rotate within the body of the shock, you'll get that movement eventually I think regardless of tightness of the stanchion clamp bolts. That lower clamp is a bit of a weak point too I think. Add any movement in the bearings and I think that explains that flex/movement described in that video. My wheel with only a bit more than 2000km's on it, almost no side to side flex between the wheel and pedals/batteries. The stanchions really ain't prone to become flexible, it's two solid tubes with 2 bushings inside. I have almost 4000km of hard riding on my Lynx now no flex (and I swapped tire very early). This is 100% caused by improper re-assembly during maintenance. Edited August 2 by Rawnei Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 (edited) 3 minutes ago, daniel1234 said: My lynx started to "flex" after 1500+ km. It got little better after retightening screw and tyre change. But it is still noticeable. It is kinda pissing me off that community is trying to ignore it. I dont like brand fanboys, i don't care with brand they are on. Yeah go blame ppl for doing tyre change incorrectly. Do you really thing that people who pay money to race dont know how to change tyre, and only you know how Rawnei? Shock clamp and motor bracked need to be from different material than magnesium or aluminum. I am waiting for more people experience that problem. Obviously if you are not riding hard or not doing stairs daily- you will not see it right away. I don't have elevator in my flat so my wheel jumping daily . Watch videos, prominent youtubers use ikea tools when doing maintenance on their wheels, then they complain when things come apart. I would wager that MOST people don't torque things to spec. We have a whole bunch of local Lynx, Patton and Sherman S riders not a single one of them has this problem. If it was a design problem wouldn't everyone have it? Edited August 2 by Rawnei Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 4 minutes ago, daniel1234 said: It is kinda pissing me off that community is trying to ignore it. I dont like brand fanboys, i don't care with brand they are on. Yeah go blame ppl for doing tyre change incorrectly. Do you really thing that people who pay money to race dont know how to change tyre, and only you know how Rawnei? You know what makes me tired? People who can't take responsibility for their actions and they blame their wheels, it doesn't matter if it's something coming loose, overleaning and what not, it's always the wheel, never the person who did the thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daniel1234 Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 (edited) If you make picture about world around you from youtube videos, that is dangerous. Just because you don't not experience problem, it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I am sorry seems there is no point of arguing with you(we tried that in past). Of course I can find in my city 8+ lynxes and majority of them are fine with bigger mileage since they are used for food delivery. Maybe what you call hard riding is not as hard as you think. Edited August 2 by daniel1234 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 (edited) 12 minutes ago, daniel1234 said: If you make picture about world around you from youtube videos, that is dangerous. Just because you don't not experience problem, it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I am sorry seems there is no point of arguing with you(we tried that in past). Of course I can find in my city 8+ lynxes and majority of them are fine with bigger mileage since they are used for food delivery. Maybe what you call hard riding is not as hard as you think. That is funny, I don't see you using any real arguments here other than that I am wrong and then you complain that there is no point in arguing with me, so how about using some logic instead? If it's a design flaw, why does so many people not have this problem? How come we see people who did a tire change being the main complainers, where are the people riding the stock tire who have this problem? Where are the brand new Lynx from factory with this problem? Edited August 2 by Rawnei Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
techyiam Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 (edited) 1 hour ago, daniel1234 said: Shock clamp and motor bracked need to be from different material than magnesium or aluminum. I am waiting for more people experience that problem. Can you pinpoint more precisely as to which parts are doing most of the flexing? Edited August 2 by techyiam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onkeldanuel Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 (edited) I checked and mine doesnt flex , only a baaaarely minimum Edited August 2 by onkeldanuel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 10 hours ago, omuretsu said: Just checked with my own Lynx which is still on the original stock tire. Very solid, no play. Edit: Bracing it the way he did in the video, I am able to get a VERY small amount of movement, but nowhere near what is in the video. 1 minute ago, onkeldanuel said: I checked and mine doesnt flex , only a baaaarly minimum You guys are pissing daniel off by ignoring this problem. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onkeldanuel Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Rawnei said: You guys are pissing daniel off by ignoring this problem. There is something loose for sure, if its the clamps, Base or one of the shocks itself i dont know, in some cases all together how that looks to me from the Video.... That kind of flex is on mine, when i disassemble one whole side from the wheel at tirechange lol Its absolutely obvious, that he/they did something wrong at reassembling or the base is broken Imo (of course) Edited August 2 by onkeldanuel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawnei Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 Just now, onkeldanuel said: There is something loose for sure, if its the clamps, Base or one of the shocks itself i dont know, in some cases all together how that looks to me from the Video.... That kind of flex is on mine, when i disassemple one whole side from the wheel at tirechange lol Its absolutely obvious, that he/they did something wrong at reassembling or the base is broken Yes because when one side is loose it's just a tube in a clamp that can be rotated, once it's clamped on both sides it's solid, now imagine if the screws are not torqued properly then everything will be loose. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onkeldanuel Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 1 minute ago, Rawnei said: Yes because when one side is loose it's just a tube in a clamp that can be rotated, once it's clamped on both sides it's solid, now imagine if the screws are not torqued properly then everything will be loose. Its almost impossible to me to get this flex if everything is torqued correctly and nothing is broken on the base, because i dont even can imagine, how this kind of flex should technically be possible otherwise 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skampster Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 (edited) Checked mine, 1000km’s on the clock, barely 1mm of movement. No issues at all while riding (I don’t jump or do stairs)stock tyre also. Edited August 2 by Skampster 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Brahan Seer Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 Sounds like this might be just a symptom of a (bad?) batch of wheels that have poorer tolerances. Easy way to find out is for everyone with the issues to try torquing at different amounts and seeing if it makes a difference. Or if you ask nicely maybe @Rawnei can try and emulate your issues by under torquing his wheel and seeing if he has the same problem. It would be good to know the mileage when this becomes an issue or not and whether its spontaneous, over time or as suggested only after taking the suspension out. Could there be a difference which way the parts are put back together physically (eg can the clamps be mounted any side/way up or down)? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daniel1234 Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 1 hour ago, techyiam said: Can you pinpoint more precisely as to which parts are doing most of the flexing? There are two sources I noticed during disassembly. - My shock seals are probably wearing off, some play is coming from there. - Clamp what hold shock doesn't fit perfectly. You can tighten it but it doesn't hold as well anymore. I think I bent it via hammering while constantly pushing the wheel up/downstairs. When I took one side down - it was noticeable that the wheel was loose on the suspension leg, in more than one direction (yes it should rotate one axis since it missing other leg but, but mine has play even elsewhere). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t0me Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 Seals have to have some clearance or they wouldn't work, that could be some of the movement. That U clamp on the stanchions is not high grade metal, it could stretch and the threads it screws into being weak could easily get damaged. Especially if not torqued exactly to specifications. Clearly there's more than one possibility to blame here. On motorbikes, fork flex causes wobbles. Its a known thing. At the pointy end of performance, the tolerances are much lower. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UniVehje Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 Just checked mine. I have never opened the wheel and have ridden about 1500 km. No flex, completely rigid. Sounds like I have to invest in torque wrench. Is the correct torque mentioned somewhere? If we have to find some flaw on LeaperKim, this kind of critical torque should be clearly marked. People do change tires often and most will not have knowledge or tools for proper torque. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Rawnei Posted August 2 Popular Post Share Posted August 2 6 minutes ago, UniVehje said: Just checked mine. I have never opened the wheel and have ridden about 1500 km. No flex, completely rigid. Sounds like I have to invest in torque wrench. Is the correct torque mentioned somewhere? If we have to find some flaw on LeaperKim, this kind of critical torque should be clearly marked. People do change tires often and most will not have knowledge or tools for proper torque. It's a good idea to torque slightly below spec so you don't overtorque, I usually aim for 0.5Nm below, I've migrated to using a digital torque adapter (pretty cheap on AliExpress, very accurate, no need to periodically calibrate, do recommend), here you go: Lynx: Motor Screws M6x20 15Nm Lynx: Clamp Screws M5x14mm 8Nm Lynx: Battery to Suspension Screws M6x12mm 11Nm Lynx: Top Screws to Controller Box M5x?? 8Nm 3 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
techyiam Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 2 hours ago, daniel1234 said: When I took one side down - it was noticeable that the wheel was loose on the suspension leg, in more than one direction (yes it should rotate one axis since it missing other leg but, but mine has play even elsewhere). You mean the bushings inside the hydraulic strut that the stanchion slide in has excessive wear? 2 hours ago, daniel1234 said: Clamp what hold shock doesn't fit perfectly. You can tighten it but it doesn't hold as well anymore. I think I bent it via hammering while constantly pushing the wheel up/downstairs. Is the play coming from the wearing down of the clamp itself, or the stanchion too? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skampster Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 If your oil seals had enough play in them to make the wheel flex more, you wouldn’t have any oil left in them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skampster Posted August 2 Share Posted August 2 (edited) 8 hours ago, Rawnei said: It's a good idea to torque slightly below spec so you don't overtorque, I usually aim for 0.5Nm below, I've migrated to using a digital torque adapter (pretty cheap on AliExpress, very accurate, no need to periodically calibrate, do recommend), here you go: Lynx: Motor Screws M6x20 15Nm Lynx: Clamp Screws M5x14mm 8Nm Lynx: Battery to Suspension Screws M6x12mm 11Nm Lynx: Top Screws to Controller Box M5x?? 8Nm The problem here is this, who correct with their torque values, you or him? This is the problem …………… edit, I don’t know why the video isn’t inserted https://youtu.be/KAp_q05uBWs?si=cKTXBJzF1NjFiTqA Edited August 2 by Skampster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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