2 month old V12 HT died - broken shoulder

[The Brahan Seer]

7 hours ago, 2disbetter said:

Breaking a bone really has a way of tempering you. 

I hear you, I'm six weeks into a broken collarbone. 20Mph slight incline. Stealth over lean as in I gently accelerated up a slight incline at 66% Battery. One I had done hundreds of times before-but I was close to the limit without realising it. So my fault and not the wheels.

It felt like what I imagine having a sledge hammer swung into the shoulder is like. I really don't want to experience that again. It was the classic transfer of energy through the hands->arm-> shoulder which I mentioned in a previous post on this thread beforehand.

I have range of motion back but still very weak raising above head and ligament pains. Not been on wheel yet.

[UPONIT]

20 hours ago, The Brahan Seer said:

I hear you, I'm six weeks into a broken collarbone. 20Mph slight incline. Stealth over lean as in I gently accelerated up a slight incline at 66% Battery. One I had done hundreds of times before-but I was close to the limit without realising it. So my fault and not the wheels.

It felt like what I imagine having a sledge hammer swung into the shoulder is like. I really don't want to experience that again. It was the classic transfer of energy through the hands->arm-> shoulder which I mentioned in a previous post on this thread beforehand.

I have range of motion back but still very weak raising above head and ligament pains. Not been on wheel yet.

I hope you heal quickly.

[alcatraz]

I dislocated my shoulder in a fall at 30km/h. It's 97% ok now. It reminds me to not keep upping the speeds or ride near a wheel's limits.

It was hard for me to blame the wheel because I had done over 10.000km on that wheel. You can get used to riding the max speed tiltback, until one day you can't. 😥

[2disbetter]

I think it really has to do with the way you fall. If you have shoulder padding on and a plate it can help to distribute the forces encountered in a crash, but ultimately, your best bet is to try to roll while tucking your head in. Not the easiest of things to remember. 

[UPONIT]

3 hours ago, 2disbetter said:

I think it really has to do with the way you fall. If you have shoulder padding on and a plate it can help to distribute the forces encountered in a crash, but ultimately, your best bet is to try to roll while tucking your head in. Not the easiest of things to remember. 

Also, not possible to perform in some falls, unfortunately.

I know this is just theorizing (until the day some sports medicine type researcher actually studies the mechanics of EUC falls), but I didn't land ON my shoulder for either my L humerus fx, or R shoulder Bankart fx.

In both, I landed in a twisting manner onto hand/forearm and the shoulder absorbed the impact traveling up the arm. I don't see any way to pad or protect from this type of injury.

I guess it comes down to: learn what you can from the accident, get good enough at riding an EUC to never lose balance under normal circumstances, don't ride the beeps ever, don't showboat or challenge traffic, etc., and don't get complacent.

[The Brahan Seer]

1 hour ago, UPONIT said:

I don't see any way to pad or protect from this type of injury.

I tend to agree. What I am doing to help absorb impact through the hands is to incorporate some thin level 2 back armour. This is into my wristguard or gloves (and maybe forearms). If I do come down again although I will certainly try to roll or mitigate the forces (bending arms) I will still need to impact with the ground using hands/arms even if briefly.

I have been watching high speed motorcycle crashes, and watching Parkour//skateboard and martial art falling techniques. 

I'm still not sure if I will be quick enough to react or able to with the forces acting on me in a cut out, other types of incidents maybe.

In my crash although I broke my collarbone i also landed hard on my right knee, plus my right wrist/arm/elbow certainly felt some impact forces to cause weakness and pain afterward just not breaks. It is still not quite right today.  I also slide on my back a bit.

[2disbetter]

I finally ordered the Leat 5.5 body protector and some Leatt dual pivot knee and shin guards. I am annoyed with how much I have to do to just ride around the block, but I think this is will always serve as a reminder that this is no toy and the consequences of foolishness are serious. 

 

 

[alcatraz]

As unhelpful as it may sound, get your calcium and drop a few pounds. And anything that helps increase bone density.

Yeah I'm also annoyed with how some injuries aren't avoided by wearing gear. Keep your speed down is probably the safest way to avoid it, but we can't always do it. Discipline.

[Nostris]

On 3/16/2023 at 6:27 PM, 2disbetter said:

I plan on fully removing the kickstand. I have a bias against them now... 

I just mentioned on another post that the guy who makes the Nylonove Pedals and kinetic Pads also makes a V12 kickstand bracket that completely stops the stand coming into contact with the tyre. It works well and is inexpensive.  Check it out on his site …hulaj.market. 

[UPONIT]

On 6/26/2023 at 3:38 AM, The Brahan Seer said:

I'm still not sure if I will be quick enough to react or able to with the forces acting on me in a cut out, other types of incidents maybe.

This is the heart of the matter. It happens so quickly. I hate thinking about it. I've fallen a few times with no injury/catching myself/landing on side. But then you get some weird twisting unusual fall you have no time to react to and BAM. CRUNCH. 

I wish my learning environment translated to real life. When I was learning, I did on AstroTurf, even though it is so friction-y that it took me much longer. But I never got even a tiny scratch. So cushiony. I was doing rolls like a stuntman somehow and ending up on my feet.

Then I have my V12HT low speed weird back flop and I'm Mr. Glass. GRRRRRRR.

On 6/26/2023 at 4:51 AM, alcatraz said:

As unhelpful as it may sound, get your calcium and drop a few pounds. And anything that helps increase bone density.

Yeah I'm also annoyed with how some injuries aren't avoided by wearing gear. Keep your speed down is probably the safest way to avoid it, but we can't always do it. Discipline.

Your first statement is interesting. Calcium and good diet helps, but bone density decrease is an unavoidable part of aging (for now?). As is muscle loss, which is what I think would help more than anything: building up as much muscle as possible to help hold those bones together and cushion falls. I'd rather have any amount of bruising and road rash than broken humeruses and collar bones. Well almost any amount.

Also, do super skinny people get broken bones more because they have no muscles or cushion? Or does the F=MV² equation save their low-M butts?

Your second statement also interesting. I am like a little old lady on a sunday drive every day, as I speed around at a whopping 15-18 mph max, creeping down hills and dismounting to walk across busy intersections. Sigh... EUCs are the only thing that makes 57 years seem old to me. Meanwhile, the speed warning beeps on my wheels are still virgins...

BUT, my one big EUC crash happened at about 12 mph. And it has been theorized in several threads that some of the worst/weirdest falls happen at low speed because of the evil eye from bikers or something.  I just wish they'd invent entire-body airbags that would deploy reliably in a fall. Yeah I can think of 100 ways it wouldn't work. But they said the same thing about flying cars and just look at

15 hours ago, Nostris said:

I just mentioned on another post that the guy who makes the Nylonove Pedals and kinetic Pads also makes a V12 kickstand bracket that completely stops the stand coming into contact with the tyre. It works well and is inexpensive.  Check it out on his site …hulaj.market. 

I turned a 1" radius disk about a half inch thick out of delrin into a stop/washer for one of the attachment bolts on one of the brackets and it does the trick.

Edited June 29, 2023 by UPONIT
"am like a" vs. "am a"

[2disbetter]

I think you hit the nail on the head. Muscles are the best natural padding you can have, and it does protect the bone. Furthermore, strength training causes growth hormone to be produced and growth hormone doesn't target just muscles, it goes after everything. So basically, do strength training, the benefits are amazing. 

I lifted weights for 8 years and then have not done so for 7. I am lifting again. 

I feel like if you ride an EUC, it is not a matter of will you have a crash, but when. Luck favors the prepared. 

Edited July 4, 2023 by 2disbetter

[2disbetter]

Rode the V13 into work today. I did not go faster than 50 kph. I have to go a different way home. I'm hoping my legs don't have problem. Turns out that just riding around the house doesn't really help condition your legs to go for longer trips. I'll get there though. 

 

[Nostris]

On 3/15/2023 at 8:00 PM, 2disbetter said:

Thanks, I would really like to know if anyone can say if the pads really are helpful in the event of a crash. The idea that my shoulder didn't have to be broken really is getting to me. Hahahaha. 

BTW, I am beginning to suspect that my issue actually had to do with my kickstand coming undine, and getting in the path of the wheel. I don't understand how that could have happened though. The kickstand was perfectly functional. ..

Sorry to hear about your fall. I’ve heard before of the kickstand falling down and blocking a knobby tyre. For what it’s worth, the guys at kinetic pads and pedals ..hulja.market …make an accessory for the V12 that stops the kickstand coming in contact with the tyre. Take a look on their site. hulja.market   It works well and is cheap. 👍

[Circuitmage]

@2disbetter I read through this thread. Thank you for posting.

Very good information on the kickstand issue. Something to look out for.
I've had sticks get caught in my wheel and lock it up at very low speed, so no injuries.

Get well!

[mhpr262]

On 6/29/2023 at 10:55 AM, UPONIT said:

I just wish they'd invent entire-body airbags that would deploy reliably in a fall.

I saw a video of something just like that (for torso and head, no leg protection though) only yesterday. It had been developed for old people and persons suffering from suddden fits of fainting and similar stuff.

 

Edit: here, found it:

 

Edited August 29, 2023 by mhpr262