Master suspension modifications

[EUCzero]

On 12/13/2022 at 8:21 PM, sffish said:

How did you determine that the spacer was limiting shock travel rather than the suspension linkages? I've got some fox volume spacers I'm going to try in the stock shock. I want to put 2 spacers in there to make total spacer volume be 1.6 cubic inches, but I'm afraid it'll bind the shock up because they are too tall. Also they're going to be a lose fit, do you think this will be an issue? Thanks.

By testing and testing and measuring and than again.
In both a test rig and mounted on the Master.

But one very easy way to do it is by setting the pressure to zero, and see if it is possible to compress the system to the bottom. 
That is release pressure, put weight on the pedals, and see if the sliders can move all the way to the end. You might have to release pressure while putting weight on the wheel.

This might change the pressure in the negative chamber, so you will for a while have to use MORE pressure in the main chamber to compensate. This will slowly get back to normal by using the wheel. But be aware that this can happen if you compress the suspension all the way and then also releasing pressure in the main chamber.

My 23milli liter reducer is 19.1 mm thick. So stay below that and you should be safe.

 

[EUCzero]

2 hours ago, martman said:

Thx for the awesome volume spacer @EUCzero! I'm not a big jumper but the roads in Stockholm are like a trailride sometimes  A lot more progressive as expected, not sure how many psi I'm going for yet though. I cranked it up to 200 and tried it out jumping like a madman, worked like a charm!

That makes me SUPERhappy.
I am also getting more and more happy with it the more I ride with it. I ride with a little bit higher pressure, but NEVER higher than the pump gauge anymore. 
Thank you for testing. I think most others are awating others to test first

BUT..... do not use it with the NEW linkage begode now published. It will not work, and the shock will bottom out before the slider.

[martman]

20 minutes ago, EUCzero said:

That makes me SUPERhappy.
I am also getting more and more happy with it the more I ride with it. I ride with a little bit higher pressure, but NEVER higher than the pump gauge anymore. 
Thank you for testing. I think most others are awating others to test first

BUT..... do not use it with the NEW linkage begode now published. It will not work, and the shock will bottom out before the slider.

Ah ok cool! I figured I'll start out a bit lower and leave some space to work with. It's with the stock linkage.

[EUCzero]

SO even if I think a volume reducer is the cheap and very good solution to the suspension problem of the Master, I am very happy to see that there are so many happy testers of the EMA linkage. (or is it named something else?)

Anyway. Why am I happy with this? Because he sell them at a very reasonable price. Actually the production cost of the new Begode linkage is not much lower. Many places higher.  So @EMA  Thank you. I hope your linkage will have a huge success, and I really hope the carbon material will be just as good as the steel ones regarding long term use.
 

 

Edited February 10, 2023 by EUCzero

[EMA]

5 hours ago, EUCzero said:

SO even if I think a volume reducer is the cheap and very good solution to the suspension problem of the Master, I am very happy to see that there are so many happy testers of the EMA linkage. (or is it named something else?)

Anyway. Why am I happy with this? Because he sell them at a very reasonable price. Actually the production cost of the new Begode linkage is now much lower. Many places higher.  So @EMA  Thank you. I hope your linkage will have a huge success, and I really hope the carbon material will be just as good as the steel ones regarding long term use.
 

thank you man, some people already have a kit on the wheel and they really like it, others will receive it soon

the carbon fiber used is super high quality, something i use for a very long time so i'm not really concerned about it, anyway i'm searching for a service that will do it with steel so everyone will be happy (should be cheaper too) .

 

 

[Zalagator]

I know very little about suspension, but I'm looking to do the DNM upgrade on my Master Pro v2, and have a few questions:

1. As a 250lb (113kg) rider, would the 1500lbs spring be adequate? From what I've read, the 95mm x 1500lbs is the largest that is known to fit correct?

2. Is the main source for the DNM AliExpress (190mm version with 750lbs spring: Example Listing) and then replace the spring with a heavier one?

3. Is there an added benefit to installing just the newer Begode linkage, or both the new linkage along with the DNM? For reference, this is the linkage I'm talking about: https://eevees.com/products/master-master-pro-linkage-kit

Appreciate any guidance that anyone can provide.

Edited March 15, 2023 by Zalagator

[drader]

Zalagator, as a fellow 250lb guy, who recently went down this road - maybe I can help. I have a T4, so not sure the numbers are all exact. You are 250lb + the weight of the wheel without the motor/tire... let's say 60lb, so 310 total. Stock linkage has a motion ratio of 3.4 (on my T4) so that's 3.4 X 310 = 1054. This would sag 1" at rest. The shock stroke is only going to move 21-25mm. It's all pretty dumb, unless you are a light guy. I highly recommend an aftermarket linkage. If you go Kuba/Torque you can use an air shock and put far less air in it (motion ratio about 1.4), but unfortunately you can't use a coil shock. No room, not made for it. The Kuba and Rockshox Monarch feels GREAT. I'd say it is a necessity at your weight. If you want to do coil (and trust me, you do) then you will want the EMA arms. Not sure about his motion ratio, he wouldn't tell me, lol. Maybe 1.5-2.0 or so, but you'd be guessing about the spring. I made my own solution; testing now... it feels incredible. Need to revise some stuff to be able to sell them, and cutting this stuff is not cheap in the US, (plus I have a day job) so not sure I will ever sell them, but damn I am blown away by how good it feels. This from somebody who must have monotubes and/or Ohlins on every car.

[bpong]

guys,

if i may ask this question:  as of Apr 2023,  does the latest batch of the Master still have major issues with its stock suspension ?

im asking this question cause i see in euc forum alot of writing on the master and its suspension and all the various modifications, revisions, complaints etc,... this leads me to wonder if the latest batch of master eucs has addressed or made its suspension system less problematic.  im not a racer or high performance rider;  i plan to use the master for every day commuting and travelling and i do not do any trail riding (although i learned how to ride in an open field).  suffice it to say, i will not be taxing the suspension in any aggressive manner.

thanx in advance,... oh, and btw, with riding gear, i top up at around 170lbs.

bpong

[Aztek]

I have the original suspension, shock at 250 psi, about your weight geared.

No major issues. It bottoms out and clinks when jumping high places or after the last step when going down stairs. I've put a cushion on the metal plate above and it helps a bit. If I jump up in the last moment before the wheel drops at the ground (when at the very edge) the shock doesn't bottom.

Lastly, the guy who sold me the wheel, asked me if I want to order the updated metal holders/plates for the shock. I said yes and will test them.

So, several iterations down the road now, I think the batches of Master coming out are delivered with this problem solved. Somebody having later batch could say.

Edited April 20, 2023 by Aztek

[techyiam]

From Facebook pertaining to the Begode Master:

Quote

Luka Bryant

Top contributor

What are the new upgrades for the version 4

 

Quote

Kebye GotWay

Author

Top contributor

+2

 

Luka Bryant 

 

1 - linkage

2 - mainboard

3 - metal battery box

 

[EUC Custom Power-Pads]

If the damn customs would not strike then I would already have my very latest Master.

Unfortunately, only the batteries have arrived so far, but not yet the wheel. I hope in a few days I can tell you more.
The suspension is the first thing I will check.

[EUCzero]

I have the old Master but upgraded linkage. And they more or less fix the suspension problem on the Master yes.
But it is still only 70mm travel. So do not expect it to be as good as the best. 
But it now feels more progressive towards the end of the travel, and bottom outs not as normal and not as "violent" as before.

[sffish]

12 hours ago, EUCzero said:

I have the old Master but upgraded linkage. And they more or less fix the suspension problem on the Master yes.
But it is still only 70mm travel. So do not expect it to be as good as the best. 
But it now feels more progressive towards the end of the travel, and bottom outs not as normal and not as "violent" as before.

Are you still using a volume spacer in your shock? I found that my "old" linkage with a volume spacer would keep the Master from bottoming out except on big drops, but the way the suspension works isn't great. I have a new linkage but was wondering if I should run a smaller volume spacer on it or none at all.

[EUCzero]

2 hours ago, sffish said:

Are you still using a volume spacer in your shock? I found that my "old" linkage with a volume spacer would keep the Master from bottoming out except on big drops, but the way the suspension works isn't great. I have a new linkage but was wondering if I should run a smaller volume spacer on it or none at all.

No... Do not use my volume reducer with the new version linkage.
The volume reducer will restrict the full movement of the shock and it could get damaged.
You must change to a smaller one. (or none).

At the moment I am testing riding with the new linkage (begode) and a 1000LBS coil damper. Works OK, but I am not in love

[Rebelcloud]

Hi, I just purchased the DNM 38RC shock because my begode Master stock shock started leaking.

Unfortunately, the stock suspension arms don’t allow access to the air top up valve once installed. It’s slightly angled off to the side and not accessible at all.

Can anyone recommend upgraded suspension arms that will suit this type of shock?

[Rebelcloud]

Worth mentioning too, I run with the Grizzla bumpers, so preferably the linkage won’t be too long like the Kuba set

[Magman116]

I have run stock, and the Kuba linkages, and now run the EMA carbon fiber links from Emanuele Tomasello @EMA

I have 190 and 200mm linkages and they are so much better than anything else I have put on my Master.  I do most of my riding now off road on mountain bike trails with drops and jumps.  I do not bottom out at all.  Using the DNM 38RC shock at ~150 PSI, it gets close to bottoming out on the biggest jumps, but still have about 5mm of travel left. So, I am happy with the linkages.

I also have the DMN Burner coil shock with the 550lb spring and really like it, but need to get a spring aournd 450lbs or progressive spring to make to more comfortable on the road.

[Rebelcloud]

Hi there, looking to contact Emanuele regarding a potential purchase of some linkages for my master

[EUCzero]

3d prints: https://www.instagram.com/p/CvP67p6MZ4-/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

 

And very soon also the EMA Carbon linkage 

[Aztek]

On 4/23/2023 at 8:16 PM, EUCzero said:

But it now feels more progressive towards the end of the travel, and bottom outs not as normal and not as "violent" as before.

Hi, as usual, these things come with no instructions whatsoever.

What is the idea with the new linkage installation? They have several holes - how are these installed and what is the difference when using the different holes? Any idea/information somewhere?

[EUCzero]

The "soft" holes will use a shorter travel on the shock than the "hard" holes.

I have the hard setting. (well now I have EMA linkage)
On my instagram you will find many short videos where you can see how it should be mounted for "hard". And for "soft" you just move the bolts to the next holes on BOTH pieces. 
PS.... the yellow linkage is the one you should look for in my instagram. (not the red nor the black Carbon)

https://www.instagram.com/p/Cp-Qo9WMfmI/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

[Aztek]

10 hours ago, EUCzero said:

The "soft" holes will use a shorter travel on the shock than the "hard" holes.

I have the hard setting. (well now I have EMA linkage)
On my instagram you will find many short videos where you can see how it should be mounted for "hard". And for "soft" you just move the bolts to the next holes on BOTH pieces. 
PS.... the yellow linkage is the one you should look for in my instagram. (not the red nor the black Carbon)

https://www.instagram.com/p/Cp-Qo9WMfmI/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

Sorry, don't have Instagram and not intending to get.

Which are the bigger shock travel holes? The ones more peripheral, leaving longer linkage, I guess?

[Nick McCutcheon]

On 8/22/2023 at 12:35 PM, Aztek said:

Sorry, don't have Instagram and not intending to get.

Which are the bigger shock travel holes? The ones more peripheral, leaving longer linkage, I guess?

Here's the official image from Begode:

The "hard" setting is an improvement over the stock linkage, it's a bit more supportive at the same pressure. I'm not sure how soft would be an improvement over stock, maybe someone who uses these links in soft mode can chime in.

Also, thank you @EUCzero for this mod! Just installed it on my Master Pro (same links as the master) and it feels much more like proper suspension on the road at speed, still at 310psi. I haven't noticed any shock bottoming out issues.

[EUCzero]

PS... you don't need instagram to watch photos on instagram. A normal browser will open the link.

Edited September 1, 2023 by EUCzero

[EUCzero]

22 hours ago, Nick McCutcheon said:

Here's the official image from Begode:

The "hard" setting is an improvement over the stock linkage, it's a bit more supportive at the same pressure. I'm not sure how soft would be an improvement over stock, maybe someone who uses these links in soft mode can chime in.

Also, thank you @EUCzero for this mod! Just installed it on my Master Pro (same links as the master) and it feels much more like proper suspension on the road at speed, still at 310psi. I haven't noticed any shock bottoming out issues.

PS... My volume reducer mod, if that is the one you are referring too, must not be used together with the new Begode linkage as the bigger shock travel will make the shock bottom out IF you have my Volume reducer installed. The 3d printed EUCzerobottomout is really tweaked to the max to fit the old style linkage and the shock travel with that linkage.

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:5647308 to print yourself.

Edited September 1, 2023 by EUCzero