X8 distance in real world

[Johey]

New at this forum, as well to the EUC. My previous team mate had his X8 Carbon for a few months, realizing he wouldn't learn to ride it, so I bought it a year ago. Tried a couple of times, temporarily giving up. This summer I forced myself practising, and now I have ended up riding it to and from work for two days.

Now, here's my question. According to Google Maps, the distance is 5.6 km (3.5 miles). Leaving home when fully charged, the X8 warns for low battery just when I arrive at work. My weight is 100 kg (220 pounds) and the road to work is asfalt all the way, some ups and downs but nothing even close to extreme. I guess the specifications "18-23 km" claims perfect non-slanted frictionless surface and a 30 kg rider, but isn't <6 km a little beyond what's normal for the X8?

I would say the battery has been cycled less than 20 times. 10, more likely. Cannot say for sure how it was stored before I bought it, but at least it had two leds when he gave it to me and I had it stored charged to three leds in living room temperature for one year. Maybe I should measure the voltage. I only have the supplied basic charger with a red/green led telling if it's charged or not.

[OliverH]

On a moderate speed my experience is: Advertised Wh * 0.8 (usable Wh) * 0.08 = distance in km

170 Wh * 0.8 * 0.08 = 10.88 km

130 Wh * 0.8 * 0.08 = 8.32 km

This is a best case value if you don't want to limit yourself to walking speed to archive more km. Speeds above 12 km/h will eat some more km distance. Tire pressure is the basics for good distances.

[Johey]

I pumped the tire with a cheap bike hand pump without any pressure meter, just trying to feel the wheel was hard enough. No science here, really. Maybe I should take it to a gas station to measure it. How many kg (or bar) is recommended?

[OliverH]

6 minutes ago, Johey said:

I pumped the tire with a cheap bike hand pump without any pressure meter, just trying to feel the wheel was hard enough. No science here, really. Maybe I should take it to a gas station to measure it. How many kg (or bar) is recommended?

I've my EUCs on 3-3.5 bar/ 43-50 PSI. Have a look on the tire what's allowed and go to max pressure. As this cheap tubes/ valces leaks pressure over time check pressure regularly.

[Keith]

Looking at Jason's figures here: 

He is going a lot faster, but I don't think weighs anything near 100kg which really is about the upper limit for an Airwheel. Weight has a major impact on power consumption. So it is quite possible at cruise you are pulling something like 340W on a 170Wh battery that is 30 minutes of power with no reserve and the wheel probably reports low battery with 20-30% left. So if you were travelling at around 12kph then, yes you were lucky to get 6km. Cells do lose capacity with age aggravated if discharged regularly all the way to low battery or if stored badly. So that will also impact range.

if it has been stored and charged badly in the past some cells may be lower than others. The charge light goes green when charging current goes below 200-300mA on many chargers. If badly out of balance cells will still be out of balance at that point. Leave the wheel on charge for 1-2 hours after the charger goes green that will fully balance all the cells. That may improve the range a bit and help the batteries

Bottom line is anything less than 340Wh is not really worth owning if you are heavy, as the greater load on the batteries, even if only used for short distances will damage them quickly.

[alon av]

My EUC was airwheel Q1 170Wh.

when it was new I made a distance test near the beach ( flat , no ups or downs ), it did 11.5 km 12 kph avg'. I weight 72 Kg.

Check tire pressure first and then battery voltage, it should do more then 5 km 

try walking the uphills and see if it makes the difference  

[Johey]

Many good tips here, thanks! It sounds like my X8 and the battery is just fine then. I will make whatever optimizations I can. Perhaps my best shot would be losing a few kilos, but that's easier said than done... Especially when taking the wheel instead of walking. 

Given that the pre-scratched and fairly cheap X8 has been a great learning wheel (now severely scratched), what would you suggest for my next one? One with better capacity, obviously. Added bonus if I can buy it in a Swedish store. I'll ride my X8 yet another while, but I doubt it's my last wheel.

[OliverH]

1 hour ago, Johey said:

Many good tips here, thanks! It sounds like my X8 and the battery is just fine then. I will make whatever optimizations I can. Perhaps my best shot would be losing a few kilos, but that's easier said than done... Especially when taking the wheel instead of walking. 

Given that the pre-scratched and fairly cheap X8 has been a great learning wheel (now severely scratched), what would you suggest for my next one? One with better capacity, obviously. Added bonus if I can buy it in a Swedish store. I'll ride my X8 yet another while, but I doubt it's my last wheel.

It depends on so much requirements:

Do you like to make some nice trips? What distance you like to reach?
Any heavy slopes/ inclines in your area?
Sweden can have some nice urban roads => tire size/ comfort to ride a bumpy road
Do you like to comute partly by train/ bus? => weight/ trolley handle bar
Should it have built in light?
 

Ask 10 people and you'll get 10 different suggestions

I would say don't trust an EUC with less than 680 Wh and real in parallel battery (my MSuper will be upgraded with additional 207 Wh from 1Radwerkstatt soon)

 

[Johey]

Nothing can be easy, can it?

I'd like some nice trips, yes. The wheel should be comfortable. There might be slopes or inclines, but for my trip to work it's fairly plain. At least nothing my X8 can't handle at max speed (which is quite low).

I would use it for commuting, yes. The X8 is no problem to carry around. It could actually be up to twice the weight I think, as far it is comfortable to grip. Of course, lighter is better, but it's not the main issue.

Lights, blueteeth, speakers, glowing in the dark casings, cigarette lighter sockets etc are compromisable gimmicks. Riding comfort, distance, speed and overall quality are the main focal points. Regarding price, perhaps not a lot more than EUR 2000.

[esaj]

27 minutes ago, Johey said:

Nothing can be easy, can it?

I'd like some nice trips, yes. The wheel should be comfortable. There might be slopes or inclines, but for my trip to work it's fairly plain. At least nothing my X8 can't handle at max speed (which is quite low).

I would use it for commuting, yes. The X8 is no problem to carry around. It could actually be up to twice the weight I think, as far it is comfortable to grip. Of course, lighter is better, but it's not the main issue.

Lights, blueteeth, speakers, glowing in the dark casings, cigarette lighter sockets etc are compromisable gimmicks. Riding comfort, distance, speed and overall quality are the main focal points. Regarding price, perhaps not a lot more than EUR 2000.

At your budget, you can probably get (almost) any wheel, except maybe something like Solowheel Xtreme (which, in my opinion, is overpriced, and I haven't ever ridden one ) or maybe the very largest battery packs for KS / Gotway (>1000Wh) might go above that (or not, I don't actually know what they cost). For powerful and fast wheels, take a look for example at the King Song and Gotway 16" and 18" -models. InMotion's been all the rage lately, but it does have smaller batteries...

[Johey]

Thanks! I will be looking at the King Song and perhaps even Gotway (though I've seen some frightening posts about failing units). But I think I'll give it some time first. I'm still quite wobbly on my X8 and will likely give it some more good scratches.

Just read some about Swedish laws. Segway-like units are defined as bicycles, provided they are capped at 20 km/h and have lights and reflexes. Hoverboards and EUCs are not yet strictly defined in law. Though, I feel quite comfortable buying an EUC provided it matches the properties of the Segway. That means my unit should have lights (not strictly required as I can come up with a DIY solution) and it should be capped at 20 km/h. Otherwise it might be classified as a moped, meaning I it's not allowed riding on bike lanes. 20 km/h feels quite good of a limit too. I think the X8 is beeping at 12, and I'd like to go a little quicker than that but not much.

[OliverH]

32 minutes ago, Johey said:

Thanks! I will be looking at the King Song and perhaps even Gotway (though I've seen some frightening posts about failing units). But I think I'll give it some time first. I'm still quite wobbly on my X8 and will likely give it some more good scratches.

Just read some about Swedish laws. Segway-like units are defined as bicycles, provided they are capped at 20 km/h and have lights and reflexes. Hoverboards and EUCs are not yet strictly defined in law. Though, I feel quite comfortable buying an EUC provided it matches the properties of the Segway. That means my unit should have lights (not strictly required as I can come up with a DIY solution) and it should be capped at 20 km/h. Otherwise it might be classified as a moped, meaning I it's not allowed riding on bike lanes. 20 km/h feels quite good of a limit too. I think the X8 is beeping at 12, and I'd like to go a little quicker than that but not much.

Should be capped by 20 km/h means it's limited by the manufacturer? There's the problem all EUC with bigger batteries are going faster. They only can be limited by the user and unlocked also

[Johey]

Yeah well, that's alright I guess. If stopped by the police I will show them the current speed limit setting for them to take note. That would likely be enough proof in court, if taken that far.  

[OliverH]

7 minutes ago, Johey said:

Yeah well, that's alright I guess. If stopped by the police I will show them the current speed limit setting for them to take note. That would likely be enough proof in court, if taken that far.  

I need to come to Sweden

[Johey]

You'll never know, but I'd rather ride with the confidence that I can prove that it is not worse than a Segway (which is legally defined as a bike), than riding something I know is breaking the law.

[Johey]

Had a ride on the X8 today (as every day). Went a quite steep uphill with about or less than half battery power. It started to get tired and a second after that it gave up on me. Don't know the speed, but it was not at maximum, so perhaps 8-10 km/h. I didn't fall, but even at that low speed it was a close call. I have successfully ridden that road before, but this time it perhaps was a little lower on power. I walked the remaining part uphill and then continued my ride home.

What did I learn? First, the X8 is not strong enough for my weight. Second, keep using protection. Third, avoid hills until receiving the the KS16.

[cloudust]

On 8/9/2016 at 6:38 PM, Johey said:

You'll never know, but I'd rather ride with the confidence that I can prove that it is not worse than a Segway (which is legally defined as a bike), than riding something I know is breaking the law.

@Johey so EUC is not legal in Sweden or you mean the EUC riders need to follow certain local/country rules?

[Johey]

@clouddust When I posted what you quoted I hadn't read the law, so I was guessing. Now I know more. EUC is legally defined as a bike provided it is limited to 20 km/h.

[Johey]

When I ordered the KS16 (which has not yet arrived) I was overlooking the fact that the motor effect is the same, 800W, as on my X8. Does this mean the KS16 is not more powerful when for instance going uphill? And how can the KS16 ride in more than twice the speed of the X8 with the same motor power?

[esaj]

I suspect (but don't know for sure) that the 800W -figure for the X8 is the maximum power of the motor, whereas with KS16 it's the nominal (maximum for KS16 is something like 2500 or 3000W?).

[Johey]

Oh, cool! Hope you're right.