MattJ Posted December 11, 2016 Author Share Posted December 11, 2016 Ok guys... some new ideas how to further improve things. Since my printer can now handle up to 240mm total height, there´s no more need to do the housings in two parts. So I designed this one-piece battery housing. At the same time, I did the following changes: - slightly wider battery space on the inside (now 45.5mm wide instead of 43.5) because some batteries were a very tight fit. - curved surface above the wheel -> possibility to reduce total height - additional openings for headlight/rearlight cables coming from the fenders through the handle part. - recessed long nuts in the battery housing (M8x35mm nuts). Screws can be used from two sides now. The pedal brackets can be tightened from below even with the top covers removed. The top covers are attached with screws from the top. So it is now possible to open just the top covers without the whole structure falling appart. Other parts still to be modified: The top covers will need to be slightly adjusted for the new inner width and for use of bolts instead of cap nuts. Top handle needs to be changed for the new side profile of the battery housings. Pedal brackets will also need to be modified slightly because the side housing is now open on the bottom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electric_vehicle_lover Posted December 11, 2016 Share Posted December 11, 2016 Someday we will need to only print 2 full parts like the original shells :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattJ Posted December 11, 2016 Author Share Posted December 11, 2016 24 minutes ago, electric_vehicle_lover said: Someday we will need to only print 2 full parts like the original shells :-) And print them in half an hour.... that would be nice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mougna Posted December 13, 2016 Share Posted December 13, 2016 What is the printing time of this piece ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattJ Posted December 13, 2016 Author Share Posted December 13, 2016 6 hours ago, Mougna said: What is the printing time of this piece ? I don´t know yet. Maybe around 20 hrs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattJ Posted December 24, 2016 Author Share Posted December 24, 2016 Ok, like I mentioned before, I´m working on a revised version, even though I´m still really quite happy with the current version of my EUC. Nevertheless, there are still some ideas on how I could further improve a few things, so here are some more details and pics of the new version I´m now working on: The main differences: - battery housings are printed in one piece - curved surface above the wheel, less wasted space. - hidden openings for head- and tail light cables from the fenders to the battery housings - M8 threaded rods to be replaced with bolts from two sides and a long nut inbetween. The battery housings are now attached to the pedal brackets with M8x150mm bolts instead of threaded rods and nuts. Top covers are attached with M8 bolts as well. Both go into the same 35mm long M8 nut inside the battery housing. So it will be possible to remove the top covers or pedal brackets without the whole structure coming apart. - More surface details, knurled surface on battery housing to make it less slippery when no cushions are added. - Pedal brackets modified to fit and support the single-piece battery housings, which are now open at the bottom. More to follow... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Óscar Ramos Melero Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 wich is best option for 2 2200 batterys and mainboard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Óscar Ramos Melero Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Its possible to put a battery in one side and another battery and controller in the other? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattJ Posted January 26, 2017 Author Share Posted January 26, 2017 On 18.1.2017 at 6:44 PM, Óscar Ramos Melero said: Its possible to put a battery in one side and another battery and controller in the other? You can put a 32 cell (16S2P) battery on one side and the controller on the other, but there probably won´t be enough space left for another battery next to the controller. The total inner width of the current version is 43.5mm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electric_vehicle_lover Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 @MattJ What is the build volume of your current printer? Did you thought already to print pedals arms and pedals? or any other DIY way to do them locally? I am interested to have custom made for a possible motor of 18 or 22'' - I want to have firmware for that motor and the I will need that parts that are not easy to buy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizardmech Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 On 2/16/2017 at 2:27 AM, electric_vehicle_lover said: @MattJ What is the build volume of your current printer? Did you thought already to print pedals arms and pedals? or any other DIY way to do them locally? I am interested to have custom made for a possible motor of 18 or 22'' - I want to have firmware for that motor and the I will need that parts that are not easy to buy... 3D print the parts then use carbon fiber as an outer shell. I almost finished the controller now, I have been testing it on a 2kw+ scooter to see how it performs under 100A+ loads. VESC 6 firmware should be out in maybe 2 or 3 weeks, after that all that is remaining is to fix a few hardware bugs and get someone to write the c code for balancing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electric_vehicle_lover Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 Send me a working board and I have some free time now that I can use to try make the balance code. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizardmech Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 42 minutes ago, electric_vehicle_lover said: Send me a working board and I have some free time now that I can use to try make the balance code. I have to finish a few things first, the sub board with the MCU doesn't have a gyro yet, I need to design and order those and some with VESC 6 pinout at the same time. STM32F407 discovery board is the easiest way, I usually flash VESC firmware directly onto them and plug a cheap mpu6050 breakout board into it. You probably need the stm32f4 board for it's programmer either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electric_vehicle_lover Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 I have a flasher/debugger for STM32 already, I don't want to buy and learn and install others. When you have the finished board, count with me to look at the firmware for balance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattJ Posted March 9, 2017 Author Share Posted March 9, 2017 On 15.2.2017 at 5:27 PM, electric_vehicle_lover said: @MattJ What is the build volume of your current printer? Did you thought already to print pedals arms and pedals? or any other DIY way to do them locally? I am interested to have custom made for a possible motor of 18 or 22'' - I want to have firmware for that motor and the I will need that parts that are not easy to buy... Sorry for my late reply - been busy with another extensive 3D printing project. My current build volume is 220x220x250, but I have ordered a larger build plate, which is on the way from China, after which my build volume will be 220x275x250 if hopefully everything goes well. I´ve been thinking about printing the pedal arms, but I don´t really trust them to be stable enough for long time use. I have no experience yet with printing carbon fiber, but I am currently experimenting with PETG, which seems to be much more stable than PLA but still reasonably easy to print. The only pedal parts that I´ve made are extensions for the regular pedals from Microworks. Their mechanical stability hasn´t been an issue, mostly because 90% of the weight is still carrried by the metal pedal underneath. Do you have a source for 16 or 18" motors and controllers? It seems that Microworks is not able to supply their 16" version, which would be great for a 3D printed shell. Maybe we could convince them to produce a batch of them if we find enough people willing to take one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electric_vehicle_lover Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 1 hour ago, MattJ said: Sorry for my late reply - been busy with another extensive 3D printing project. My current build volume is 220x220x250, but I have ordered a larger build plate, which is on the way from China, after which my build volume will be 220x275x250 if hopefully everything goes well. Ok and you now know that there are printers cheap like mine (500€) of 370*250. 1 hour ago, MattJ said: I´ve been thinking about printing the pedal arms, but I don´t really trust them to be stable enough for long time use. I have no experience yet with printing carbon fiber, but I am currently experimenting with PETG, which seems to be much more stable than PLA but still reasonably easy to print. The only pedal parts that I´ve made are extensions for the regular pedals from Microworks. Their mechanical stability hasn´t been an issue, mostly because 90% of the weight is still carrried by the metal pedal underneath. I wish we could have a DIY (3D printing or not) to make our custom the metal parts. 1 hour ago, MattJ said: Do you have a source for 16 or 18" motors and controllers? It seems that Microworks is not able to supply their 16" version, which would be great for a 3D printed shell. Maybe we could convince them to produce a batch of them if we find enough people willing to take one? I think we can source 16, 18, 22, etc motors from a few shops from china, direct drive. I have a friend that have a shop and workshop for electric scooters and bicycles and he have some used motors of 22 that seem would work for EUC application. The motor shaft is just the same that we are used to. If we get a way to get DIY metal parts, we already have the shell, the missing parts are motor, batteries and board. Motor and batteries we can also by from china or even EU. The board, well, we can also buy from china but we need to have our custom firmware -- I really have expectations that I will be able to make it!! I wish I could do it in next 6 months a alpha version and 1 year a working version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattJ Posted March 9, 2017 Author Share Posted March 9, 2017 55 minutes ago, electric_vehicle_lover said: I wish we could have a DIY (3D printing or not) to make our custom the metal parts. I think we can source 16, 18, 22, etc motors from a few shops from china, direct drive. I have a friend that have a shop and workshop for electric scooters and bicycles and he have some used motors of 22 that seem would work for EUC application. The motor shaft is just the same that we are used to. If we get a way to get DIY metal parts, we already have the shell, the missing parts are motor, batteries and board. Motor and batteries we can also by from china or even EU. The board, well, we can also buy from china but we need to have our custom firmware -- I really have expectations that I will be able to make it!! I wish I could do it in next 6 months a alpha version and 1 year a working version. Custom pedals would be great. The pedals from Microworks are ok, but there are few details that could be improved. They are a bit small for many European/western riders including myself, so a few cm extra would be a huge improvement. Also, I would like to have the pedals further apart, with no gap in the middle (like the flat pedals on many EUC´s models). Meaning that the fixed metal part would be L-shaped with the pedal hinge located on the outer end. That would leave more space inbetween for batteries and electronics and improve balance and riding ergonomics. Unfortunately I don´t have any tools or skills in metal working and no contacts to metal shops either. But I´d be happy to adjust my design for a new pedal structure if we can source one that doesn´t cost a fortune. Also, modifying the shell for larger wheels is not a big issue. Sourcing batteries is no big deal. I have been even thinking about using a separate BMS circuit, so we could further slim down the side housings, maybe even integrate the 18650 cells into the main structure, even though that would make the assembly process a bit more complicated and time consuming. Do you mean that some brushless bicycle hub motors could be used for building a EUC? Most of them probably use 36 or 48 volts so they would require different electronics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electric_vehicle_lover Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 2 minutes ago, MattJ said: Do you mean that some brushless bicycle hub motors could be used for building a EUC? Most of them probably use 36 or 48 volts so they would require different electronics? I think the motors can go higher voltage and so higher speed but them the current should be lower. I am not sure but I think the power need to be balance, higher voltage, less current. Well, I need to have the firmware so we can experiment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattJ Posted March 9, 2017 Author Share Posted March 9, 2017 2 minutes ago, electric_vehicle_lover said: I think the motors can go higher voltage and so higher speed but them the current should be lower. I am not sure but I think the power need to be balance, higher voltage, less current. Well, I need to have the firmware so we can experiment. Interesting..... I happen to have an unused 26" e-bike motor, but it´s only rated 350W@36Volts, probably not enough torque to maintain balance on a EUC. But there are plenty of hub motors available on aliexpress, most of them with much higher power ratings, so that might really be an interest topic to do some research on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electric_vehicle_lover Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 3 minutes ago, MattJ said: Interesting..... I happen to have an unused 26" e-bike motor, but it´s only rated 350W@36Volts, probably not enough torque to maintain balance on a EUC. But there are plenty of hub motors available on aliexpress, most of them with much higher power ratings, so that might really be an interest topic to do some research on. I did in the past a prototype for a controller and firmware for the basic 6 steps using hall sensors. The issue with most small motors are that they have gears (not direct drive) and the coast in on rotation direction so not working for EUC application. I used a 36V motor on my bicycle with a 48V battery and controller, because I were looking for higher speed. And it worked, I did many travels with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattJ Posted March 9, 2017 Author Share Posted March 9, 2017 4 minutes ago, electric_vehicle_lover said: I did in the past a prototype for a controller and firmware for the basic 6 steps using hall sensors. The issue with most small motors are that they have gears (not direct drive) and the coast in on rotation direction so not working for EUC application. I used a 36V motor on my bicycle with a 48V battery and controller, because I were looking for higher speed. And it worked, I did many travels with them. Looks great - I have also have a 24V/250W motor installed on my mountain bike, which I was planning to upgrade for a more powerful one. So I could possibly achieve the same by just increasing the voltage (hopefully without frying the motor)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andress Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Could you use something like this https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Flier-hot-selling-16S-200A-sensored-controller-motor-esc-for-rc-skateboard/1000001686572.html?ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_2_10065_10068_433_10136_10137_10138_10060_10062_10056_10055_10054_302_10059_10099_10103_10102_10096_10052_10053_10050_10107_10051_10106_10084_10083_10080_10082_10081_10110_10111_10112_10113_10114_10037_10078_10079_10077_10073_10070_10122_10123_10126_10124-10050,searchweb201603_3,afswitch_1,ppcSwitch_5,single_sort_0_price_asc&btsid=7fc78db4-805f-4291-a405-a9e623299ea3&algo_expid=0ea5d305-03c1-45fd-8f75-e1162e8f9006-0&algo_pvid=0ea5d305-03c1-45fd-8f75-e1162e8f9006 for the motor control? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattJ Posted March 9, 2017 Author Share Posted March 9, 2017 14 minutes ago, andress said: Could you use something like this https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Flier-hot-selling-16S-200A-sensored-controller-motor-esc-for-rc-skateboard/1000001686572.html?ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_2_10065_10068_433_10136_10137_10138_10060_10062_10056_10055_10054_302_10059_10099_10103_10102_10096_10052_10053_10050_10107_10051_10106_10084_10083_10080_10082_10081_10110_10111_10112_10113_10114_10037_10078_10079_10077_10073_10070_10122_10123_10126_10124-10050,searchweb201603_3,afswitch_1,ppcSwitch_5,single_sort_0_price_asc&btsid=7fc78db4-805f-4291-a405-a9e623299ea3&algo_expid=0ea5d305-03c1-45fd-8f75-e1162e8f9006-0&algo_pvid=0ea5d305-03c1-45fd-8f75-e1162e8f9006 for the motor control? For a bike? I think there are dedicated e-bike controllers for 60V. It won´t work for EUC´s because it needs to have a balancing function Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andress Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Coudnt you control this esc with arduino with gyro/accelerometer? Similar to how the commands are sent from remote control from e-skateboards which I think this esc is meant for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattJ Posted March 9, 2017 Author Share Posted March 9, 2017 4 minutes ago, andress said: Coudnt you control this esc with arduino with gyro/accelerometer? Similar to how the commands are sent from remote control from e-skateboards which I think this esc is meant for? My knowledge is too limited to answer that, maybe @electric_vehicle_lover has more info on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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