Wheel price differences & import & taxes

[steve454]

On 5/22/2016 at 5:42 AM, esaj said:

Wow, that's pretty high... although I don't think you can just sum up the tax rates for a cumulative rate? That would make the highest tax rate here something like >80%... With maximum income tax(50%) with the mandatory fixed rate payments that everyone pays (pension 5.70% + unemployment insurance 1.15%) + church tax (if you belong to one, I don't know exactly how much it is these days, something like 1-2%), you already arrive at around 57.85-58.85%. If you now add the 24% VAT on top of that, you arrive at 81.85-82.85%. Let's say that would be somewhat plausible. But where that way of calculating breaks down is if you'd assume the person uses all his income to buy gas, which has around 75% tax rate in Finland. 57.25% + 75% = 132.85%. So nope, you can't just add them together, you need further analysis what is being done with the money, and calculate the tax rate against the gross income before taxes... 

My current total income tax is about 35%, I think I'm something like middle class or "barely" upper middle class...

I think the "more correct way" of calculating the "average cumulative tax rate" is something like:

-Calculate an assumption of what the income of a mythical "average person" or "average family unit" is and what they spend their money on
-Take the average income tax rate, calculate how much taxes is paid from the income 
-Calculate the amount of taxes paid for different products etc. with their tax rates
-Sum up the income + other taxes (as money)
-Calculate the total amount of taxes paid vs. income

So as a very simplified example, let's just assume an income of 100€ (to keep calculation simple, of course the median gross here is something like 3300€/month nowadays, I think). Say that of that 100€, the spending goes something like this:
-25% income tax rate with all the payments (actually, for the median I think it's more like over 30%)
-40€ on products and services with tax rate of 24%
-40€ on products and services with tax rate of 14% (something like food stuffs and books...)
-20€ into savings or something that has no tax
Income tax is now 25€. 24% of 40€ is 9.6€. 14% of 40€ is 5.6€. Total taxes paid 25€ + 9.6€ + 5.6€ = 40.2€.

The total cumulative tax rate is simply taxes paid is simply paid taxes / gross income. Since the gross income was 100€, and 40.2€ was paid as taxes, you arrive into 40.2€ / 100€ = 40.2%.

Of course, this is very much simplified, there are so many different taxes (properties, cars, gas, energy, income, different VATs, income from financial assets like interests, dividends, profit from selling shares etc. etc.) and the income tax varies between municipalities, so that the "real way" of calculating that become much more complex. Not to mention that then in the "other end" you also get some deductions from your taxes...

 

 

But just look at your country, it looks beautiful.  No wonder taxes are so high.  My country is ugly compared to a lot of other places.

[tjcooper]

steve454,

I just got the "flame" Nb E+ this weekend from forwardCA.  It was $449 + $37 taxes.  It shipped and was received in ONE DAY.  Live not far from warehouse.

I love it, but beware.  the FLAME is just a sticker over the black base.  It will scratch off very easily.  But for that price, I could not resist.  My next thing to do is get the battery schematics so that I can make my own "add in parallel" battery that is external to the EUC that I would carry in my backpack with a quick-disconnect DEANs connector.   I think it should not be hard to get to the 950 Watt-hour limit, but I do not know if the internal sensing hardware/software would "panic" if it saw that much battery power coming out of a single battery charge condition.  Does anyone have any experience with this?  In my RC airplanes and drones, the BEC could care less how big is the battery capacity.  But I don't know what the NB computer logic would think?  Anyone done this experiment?

   tjcooper

[HEC]

9 hours ago, tjcooper said:

My next thing to do is get the battery schematics so that I can make my own "add in parallel" battery that is external to the EUC that I would carry in my backpack with a quick-disconnect DEANs connector.

This is a bit more trickier than it might look at first. With your RC background you're well aware of the high peak currents device can pull of those batteries and the losses on the length of the cable (even with proper AWG / diameter) as well as on any additional plug on the way and how much they can heat up (not mentioning interferences). So adding about 2m of cable and some Dean or XT plugs might be a bit of trouble here. The other factor to consider is the security. What happens during the accident / unexpected step off or run away wheel? Will you get strangled or grazed / cut by the lead? Will the firmly attached battery rip through your backpack then flying around smashing bystanders on their heads? Will it tangle into your feet prohibiting you from saving yourself from faceplant? I'd say maximum caution should be taken if you're planning to do something like this.

[Hunka Hunka Burning Love]

You might try contacting SpeedyFeet UK to see how he did this:

I've seen other people mention having a backpack with cable to the EUC for extended power so it should work fine.  I would think as long as the control board sees the same voltage within spec it shouldn't care too much about how many parallel packs you have connected.

@HEC does have a very good point about the power cable tether being a possible hazard should the wheel get away from you.  A bad case might be if the wire rips out of the connection and short circuits you could have a bad situation on hand.  I wonder whether some sort of breakaway magnetic connector at the EUC might be useful.  But then if it disconnects and the loose cable or EUC port drops into a puddle of water...  I guess a diode protection circuit at the port would help, but what to do with the cable end?

[tjcooper]

sorry for long delay.  I used my RC silicon wires at 10 gauge (which for short bursts can do 100amps for my powered gliders), and a specialized Deans that has a tapered set of copper wipers.  Even with a "tug" at 90deg to insertion path, they come out with very little effort.  The extra pack is in a kevlar bag.  I have tried mounting to the "thru handle" on the top with velco and to my belt with break away strap.  Both work well but I prefer the mount to top handle.   I only have 8 inches of "Y" connector wire so the voltage drop at 30amps is less that 0.05 volts.

 

Thus far only a "fast low battery" has been the only problem seen.  I even used the "Y" cable to allow me to use an inductive loop and measure the current draw.....which has only been like 3-5 amps for just gently moving down the street on a single battery pack.

   tjcooper