rcgldr Posted December 29, 2023 Share Posted December 29, 2023 (edited) I'd like to buy a Kingsong 18L V2 (spiked pedals and updated upper pads), but I'm in the USA and none of the NA vendors have them. One vendor had an old 18L that they received in Feb 2022, which means it was probably built sometime in 2021 and the batteries are probably not in good shape. Some of the NA dealers are out of stock on both 18L and 18XL. The few that have them are also probably old models, as I've asked for build date codes, and they claim they don't know. Even if I was willing to pay, EU dealers can't ship to USA, and it seems I can't special order one from a NA dealer even if I'm willing to wait 1 or 2 months for it to be shipped. Edited December 29, 2023 by rcgldr 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted December 29, 2023 Share Posted December 29, 2023 (edited) Sadly it's one of the sad truths. When people want a lighter wheel, (which nowadays are only older wheels..) we don't really have an option to choose from. You get what you get.. Still it surprises me that not a single store in NA has one? Even my local small shop has the updated models of Kingsong 18XL, 16X, 16S in stock. Then again in my area the big wheels don't sell at all. Also why batteries would not be in good shape? If wheel was regularly checked and kept around 50% charge state - it should be fine.. Some shops may even give you updated pads/pedals, if you ask. You don't know when the "cells" themselves where made.. From that viewpoint any wheel battery pack could be in not so good shape. Edited December 29, 2023 by Funky 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcgldr Posted December 30, 2023 Author Share Posted December 30, 2023 4 hours ago, Funky said: Also why batteries would not be in good shape? If wheel was regularly checked I don't know if they ever checked the 18L or even if they ever opened the box. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hellkitten Posted December 30, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted December 30, 2023 For what it’s worth. I have a KS18L that I stored for a year. I put the batteries at 60% last December. I pulled it out the other day and it hadn’t dropped at all. I plugged it in and it fully charged back to full and I’ve been riding it. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidB Posted December 30, 2023 Share Posted December 30, 2023 The cell manufacturers put this data in their data sheets. The degradation is quite high. Just because the box hasn't been opened and the wheel hasn't been riden doesn't imply the batteries are still good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidB Posted December 30, 2023 Share Posted December 30, 2023 16 hours ago, Funky said: You don't know when the "cells" themselves where made.. Remember there was a shortage of 18650 and 2170s back then. They wouldn't be sitting in warehouses. I can't imagine they would be much older than the manufacture date of the wheel. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidB Posted December 30, 2023 Share Posted December 30, 2023 17 hours ago, rcgldr said: Even if I was willing to pay, EU dealers can't ship to USA, and it seems I can't special order one from a NA dealer even if I'm willing to wait 1 or 2 months for it to be shipped. I think the Australian store E-riderz has the new 18xl. I don't know if they would ship to the USA. The Aussie dollar was only worth about 63 cents US last month but has appreciated to 68, so not quite the bargain. I noticed not long ago they were selling 18xls for A$2299 (but that may have been old stock). The spike pedal 18xl is now on their website for $2999 (US$2039). Shipping may be prohibitive, but Aussie shipping prices usually are much less than US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldFartRides Posted December 30, 2023 Share Posted December 30, 2023 All the NOS wheels are on Fleabay, but not cheap enough to make it worth the risk. I’d probably drop $300. on a z10 just to ride that famed wheel till it died. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcgldr Posted December 30, 2023 Author Share Posted December 30, 2023 22 hours ago, Funky said: Also why batteries would not be in good shape? If wheel was regularly checked and kept around 50% charge state - it should be fine. It's a bike shop. I sent them an email and the replied that they've never opened the box. From other vendors I found that 18L battery pack is $960 ($480 per side). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcgldr Posted January 4 Author Share Posted January 4 AUS (Australia) dealers also carry the 18L V2. So it seems only NA dealers don't carry it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcgldr Posted January 12 Author Share Posted January 12 On 12/29/2023 at 1:34 PM, Funky said: lighter wheel How much does your 18XL weigh? KingSong shows 18XL at 25.4 kg = 56 lbs, and 18L at 21.6 kg = 47.6 lbs. I wondering if their listed weight for the 18XL is high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 (edited) 10 minutes ago, rcgldr said: How much does your 18XL weigh? KingSong shows 18XL at 25.4 kg = 56 lbs, and 18L at 21.6 kg = 47.6 lbs. I wondering if their listed weight for the 18XL is high. Mine is 26.5kg now - i got aftermarket heavier pedals and M/C tire. It was ~25.5kg. 18L is ~22kg round it up. 1 battery pack for 18xl weights around ~3.65kg. 18xl has 1554Wh. 18l has 1000Wh? So it should be around ~2.4kg lighter. Edited January 12 by Funky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcgldr Posted July 1 Author Share Posted July 1 (edited) I ended up buying an 18XL V2 (spiked pedals, power pad protrusions on upper pads) from EUCO and received it on April 25, 2024. I don't know if any other USA dealers have it yet (some still have old stock). Weight is 53 lbs. https://rcgldr.net/euc/18xlv2front.jpg https://rcgldr.net/euc/18xlv2side.jpg https://rcgldr.net/euc/18xlv2top.jpg Edited July 3 by rcgldr 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxLinux Posted July 26 Share Posted July 26 On 12/29/2023 at 9:38 PM, Hellkitten said: For what it’s worth. I have a KS18L that I stored for a year. I put the batteries at 60% last December. I pulled it out the other day and it hadn’t dropped at all. I plugged it in and it fully charged back to full and I’ve been riding it. My KS18XL was unused for about a year. The battery level was 67% when I checked it a few days ago. I fully charged it and it seems to be fine. The level has been dropping a few percent after each (short) ride. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circuitmage Posted September 12 Share Posted September 12 9 months ago I took a job that required me to drive into work, and I stopped riding for the most part. I did one recharge on my 18L about 4 months into it, but it was not below 25% when I did that...I think it was around 40%. I just got back on my 18L, and both the battery and tire were in excellent shape. Man, I love my 18L. Just took a job near the train station again, so probably will be riding to work again. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asphalt Posted Monday at 03:01 PM Share Posted Monday at 03:01 PM Would love to see Kingsong release a KS-18L Pro: 20S4P Samsung 50S = 1500Wh ~50lbs Update the firmware, add a few more mosfets, and you could probably get 55km/h in a relatively light, ergonomic package. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted Monday at 05:09 PM Share Posted Monday at 05:09 PM (edited) 2 hours ago, Asphalt said: Would love to see Kingsong release a KS-18L Pro: 20S4P Samsung 50S = 1500Wh ~50lbs Update the firmware, add a few more mosfets, and you could probably get 55km/h in a relatively light, ergonomic package. It's called 18XL. Jokes aside - yeah something awesome in 45lbs mark would be just sweet. Even with 1000Wh battery. Also we don't really need 4P system on these smaller/weaker wheels. Even 2P system has enough power to get wheel going over 50km/h. (Falcon has 2P system and it goes 50km/h and people have said it has more power, just that it's board is keeping it away from it's real protentional. Board is to weak..) FYI 18XL is 3P (2 packs connected in parallel, each pack being 20S3P - making it 40S3P) setup right now - with older/weaker cells, not 50S.. So yeah using 50S in 2P is enough. Edited Monday at 05:14 PM by Funky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradox Posted Monday at 06:17 PM Share Posted Monday at 06:17 PM 1 hour ago, Funky said: making it 40S3P 40s3p would make it 168v Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted Monday at 07:24 PM Share Posted Monday at 07:24 PM (edited) 1 hour ago, Paradox said: 40s3p would make it 168v Or is it still 20S3P? If we use 2 (20S3P) packs in parallel? I thought P stays the same but we double the cells.. Didn't something double by being in parallel? 6P? Edited Monday at 07:25 PM by Funky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asphalt Posted Monday at 08:41 PM Share Posted Monday at 08:41 PM The 18XL is 20S6P The 18L is 20S4P They both used Samsung 35E 18650 cells, which weigh 50g and are rated for 8A discharge with 3500mAh capacity. 120 x 50g = 6kg 80 x 50g = 4kg 120 x 3500mAh x 3.7V = 1554Wh 80 x 3500mAh x 3.7V = 1036Wh ========= A Pro version could be updated to use Samsung 50S cells, which weigh 72g and are rated for 35A discharge with 5000mAh capacity. 120 x 72g = 8.64kg 80 x 72g = 5.76kg 120 x 5000mAh x 3.7V = 2220Wh 80 x 5000mAh x 3.7V = 1480Wh Given the larger dimensions of the 21700 cells, it might be tough to squeeze in 120 cells. However, 80 x 21700 cells should fit in the same place as 120 x 18650 cells. The additional discharge rate would enable more power output, so zippier firmware could be used. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asphalt Posted Monday at 08:54 PM Share Posted Monday at 08:54 PM If Kingsong were to re-develop the 18L/XL control board, they could make a lighter, faster 100V version with a few more mosfets (base it off of the S19 Pro control board). 18XS Pro - 24S2P 48 x 72g = 3.456kg 48 x 5000mAh x 3.7 = 888Wh Weight = 46lbs ======== In addition to chasing the performance leaders, Kingsong might find more success in going after the niche that they once dominated - ergonomic, lightweight wheels without suspension. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted Tuesday at 12:24 PM Share Posted Tuesday at 12:24 PM 15 hours ago, Asphalt said: If Kingsong were to re-develop the 18L/XL control board, they could make a lighter, faster 100V version with a few more mosfets (base it off of the S19 Pro control board). 18XS Pro - 24S2P 48 x 72g = 3.456kg 48 x 5000mAh x 3.7 = 888Wh Weight = 46lbs ======== In addition to chasing the performance leaders, Kingsong might find more success in going after the niche that they once dominated - ergonomic, lightweight wheels without suspension. That's the dream right there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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