LG M50LT: Why do EUC Co's keep using this sub-optimal Cell?

[Tasku]

Worshipping the high capacity is what consumers understand. It has been long road for most to understanding the limitations of the batterytech wheels come with. The companies making the wheels have little to none effect to battery-tech. My story, when I started I was like that: I had a number in mind that I knew I wanted to be able to move and I took 30% off from the estimate they gave for the range, and generally that played big part what device I selected.

Our devices battery work in rather optimal manner around 10-25 celcius range. Outside that range, problems arise. It is quite commonly very difficult to get across and explain the battery wizardry going on to average user. It could be slow process, possibly with lots of misunderstandings. 

One thing could be good is that winter wheels would have different battery, that would help. Could go good campaign for avoiding those battery fires. "Winter battery" might not be as light and have as much capacity but atleast safe to use. Obviously not everyone even has negative degrees during winter so, there be that. We should talk people having need for new battery below 0 degree celsius, or "below freezing point" so don't have to confuse fahrenheit users. That just leaves the problem with having the maintenance to swap em, sadly the services of maintenance is often something not everyone can, or should do. Putting 2 packs that are not equally charged seem to be one problem coming up often.

My hope lies in the future as new battery tech is coming. Where the old tech, was more designed to room temperature. This limitation has hold EV's and the general markets in general down fairbit. The industry has taken big leaps now that finally cars are in the game, in a big way. There be plenty of investors ready to put money on versatile and promising battery tech production lines.

Edited March 5, 2023 by Tasku

[0000]

Maybe its just me, but it seems the easier it has become over the years  to access information, the lower the expectations are about how informed the average person is, in general. Funny how that works eh? That anyone can look up freely available research, studies, or even peruse discussion boards for answers using the magical search engine linked device in all of our pockets at any time, and yet it seems the expecations of the average level of awareness has never been lower. Makes me wonder just how far this trend will continue with AI feeding people answers, requiring far less discernment in the knowledge discovery process...

Yeah, like you said, there definitely are some nuances to lithium ion battery care for long term battery safety and efficiency (the safe operating temperature range isn't nearly as restrictive as 10-25C), but for what they can deliver today in terms of PEV performance, I'm actually pretty damn satisfied as things stand today.

With my 3 different PEVs, I have all of the performance and range I could want, longevity will likely be quite good, and the weight of the packs are acceptable. Anything new in terms of battery improvement would have to be quite the leap forward to excite the dream of new possibilities from my POV.

I guess you could say its hard to tempt a man who has his needs met, but to your point, a safer battery chemistry that doesn't require basic knowledge of safe lithium ion battery charging and balancing nuances would be better for the market overall in lowering the possibility for accidents from negligence, defects, etc so def agreeing with you there.

[Tasku]

1 hour ago, Vanturion said:

(the safe operating temperature range isn't nearly as restrictive as 10-25C)

The general problem comes going below freezing as these lithium battery are not supposed to be charged in those conditions. Problem being, EUC the braking power is going to battery and that is charging. That is why I was trying to make the point of people being aware of this. 

And yes, there is still some cases like take your wheel out from warm and ride that 30mins and get it inside again - and you be fine. Being under amp draw they do produce some heat. Even 10 minutes pause and those battery are considerably colder. Some people leave devices outside and are unaware that you are not supposed to use em if they are left out. That kind of things will cause problems. You can storage the lithium battery in negative degrees but you should not use cold battery to charge, again euc will charge the battery when you brake, something you cannot avoid.

LiFePO4, if I remember did have bit better operating and charging temperature range but comes with bigger price.

---

The new  sodium-ion battery already has a car using em. They come from china so, maybe they make way to euc too. They handle cold conditions too. Way cheaper than lithiums, I think ~half the price per Kwh already as they launch. They can make em in existing factory line-ups with little changes. No risk of fire. Time will tell if they reliable too.

[RagingGrandpa]

On 5/19/2022 at 8:59 PM, houseofjob said:

Test Results 

This is a fantastic performing “energy” cell (high capacity, made for long run times at lower power levels)

LG M50LT one of the best performing 21700’s we can buy.

I recommend staying at 10A or lower to help improve performance (reduce voltage sag), extend cell life, and reduce the risk of the cell getting too warm.

EUC draws >40A from its pack only in short intervals, so everything seems acceptable here for 4p or larger packs. 
 

On 12/7/2022 at 7:24 PM, houseofjob said:

I don't see any vast difference between M50T vs M50LT

Just that we had a large number of 4p M50T EUC's burn; and haven't had an M50LT EUC cell fire reported yet.

My personal preference is Samsung, but M50LT has a good service record so far. I don't think we have a basis to condemn it.
 

Edited March 6, 2023 by RagingGrandpa

[yiewpeng]

anyone still have any euc with LG M50T until now?

[Rawnei]

23 hours ago, yiewpeng said:

anyone still have any euc with LG M50T until now?

Newly produced? No.

But most likely plenty of people own old ones with M50T cells in them.