AtlasP Posted July 24, 2021 Share Posted July 24, 2021 (edited) It was my understanding that Amazon removed all EUCs back when they made the requirement that all hoverboards must be UL2272 certified (which of course no EUC by any of the currently active manufacturers is). Not sure when exactly it happened, but it appears InMotion now has a dedicated Amazon shop where they are selling the V5F, V8F, and V11. (The V12 is also detailed on the shop page/presumably coming but doesn't seem to have an actual dedicated Amazon page yet.) https://amazon.com/stores/page/0EC48C57-E5C5-4AE1-B864-47A52BDBD6C7 Takeaways/thoughts: Given the range of issues exhibited by all EUC manufacturers, I can't imagine buying such a device directly from the manufacturer through Amazon versus from a trusted western distributor like ewheels, for the support and support turnaround time alone. That said, of all manufacturers to begin approaching being ready for Amazon, it is no surprise that InMotion would be first/leading the way. In the end I think EUCs being available through a household-name retailer such as Amazon could be good for the growth of the broader EUC community even though it would likely still be bad for individual consumers purchasing through Amazon rather than through a western distributor with better support. Edited September 28, 2021 by AtlasP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtlasP Posted July 24, 2021 Author Share Posted July 24, 2021 (edited) The plot thickens. It appears "InMotion Direct" on Amazon is actually registered out of Hong Kong? Quote Business Name:xiangganglexingyundongkejiyouxiangongsi Business Address: jiulongwangjiaomidundao610hao helihuoshangyezhongxin1318-19shi hongkong hongkong 999077 HK [Source: Amazon.com Seller Profile: Inmotion Direct ] So is this just a random reseller and not actually officially InMotion? Edited July 24, 2021 by AtlasP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmudel Posted July 24, 2021 Share Posted July 24, 2021 If you click on “details” and look on the right of the page it says “sold by Freemotion”. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtlasP Posted July 24, 2021 Author Share Posted July 24, 2021 (edited) 45 minutes ago, Schmudel said: If you click on “details” and look on the right of the page it says “sold by Freemotion”. That's in "Other Sellers". (For those not familiar with how Amazon works, there can be multiple sellers of the same item/listing.) The main listing above that clearly states: Ships from Inmotion Direct Sold by Inmotion Direct Edited July 24, 2021 by AtlasP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmudel Posted July 24, 2021 Share Posted July 24, 2021 This is interesting, I just checked it again. If you select a US address for shipping it says inmotion direct, if you select a Canadian address it says Freemotion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtlasP Posted July 25, 2021 Author Share Posted July 25, 2021 20 hours ago, Schmudel said: This is interesting, I just checked it again. If you select a US address for shipping it says inmotion direct, if you select a Canadian address it says Freemotion. Oh I see, good catch. It still seems 'InMotion Direct' is the one that created/controls the main 'Amazon store' though and the root listing for each model, with Freemotion piggy-backing off that as an alternate seller for those listings. (Presumably the default seller waffles depending on which markets each of those sellers has selected to ship to or not.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 inmotion wheels have official UL and IP ratings though... i believe so do ninebots and anything from segway/ninebot, which were also sold on amazon but theyre out of the EUC game now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tryptych Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 Sounds like a good thing. Amazon's customer service is awesome. Do you get a warranty? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtlasP Posted July 28, 2021 Author Share Posted July 28, 2021 (edited) 19 hours ago, Rywokast said: inmotion wheels have official UL and IP ratings though... i believe so do ninebots and anything from segway/ninebot, which were also sold on amazon but theyre out of the EUC game now This is false. See: https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/17309-up-to-date-euc-comparison-table/page/2/?tab=comments#comment-323377 . (That comment mostly talks about IP ratings, but it's a similar story for UL2272 rating--only a single EUC ever made was UL2272 rated, and that was the Ninebot One S1 [but NOT the One S2]. The certification is just too expensive and ultimately not worth it for such tiny companies. There is some discussion whether some of Ninebot's and/or InMotion's battery packs are UL rated and/or IP rated, but that's just one component and would not extend to the whole device.) Edited July 28, 2021 by AtlasP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 56 minutes ago, AtlasP said: This is false. See: https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/17309-up-to-date-euc-comparison-table/page/2/?tab=comments#comment-323377 . (That comment mostly talks about IP ratings, but it's a similar story for UL2272 rating--only a single EUC ever made was UL2272 rated, and that was the Ninebot One S1 [but NOT the One S2]. The certification is just too expensive and ultimately not worth it for such tiny companies. There is some discussion whether some of Ninebot's and/or InMotion's battery packs are UL-rated, but that's just one component and would not extend to the whole device.) really? ive seen multiple sources claim that for them... but i cant even find any info or any sort of database for such ratings.... whos to say anyone couldnt just slap a sticker on it and say that lol, dont know why information about it is so vague.. smartwheel claims its cheap ass hoverboards are all UL certified https://www.smartwheel.ca/Smartboard-R8-65-Cool-Hoverboard-with-LED-Wheel-LED-Top-Bluetooth-Free-Bag_p_1937.html so dont know how expensive it could be? i would definitely believe their batteries are Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtlasP Posted July 28, 2021 Author Share Posted July 28, 2021 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Rywokast said: really? ive seen multiple sources claim that for them... but i cant even find any info or any sort of database for such ratings.... whos to say anyone couldnt just slap a sticker on it and say that lol, dont know why information about it is so vague.. smartwheel claims its cheap ass hoverboards are all UL certified https://www.smartwheel.ca/Smartboard-R8-65-Cool-Hoverboard-with-LED-Wheel-LED-Top-Bluetooth-Free-Bag_p_1937.html so dont know how expensive it could be? i would definitely believe their batteries are Edited: The numbers were actually even worse than I remembered in my first attempted response here. I found one of the source comments by Jason McNeil on the subject: https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/6954-v5fv8-ul-certification-safety-question/?tab=comments#comment-87760 Edited July 28, 2021 by AtlasP 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planemo Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 Interesting, I wasn't aware of the UL2270 certification. Having read a little about it, I am not surprised that the current crop of EUC's don't have it. The drop tests alone would probably render any Gotway useless. I would think Inmotion and Kingsong would be the best current contenders, although I suspect the venerable old Z10 would probably pass it now if I'm honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtlasP Posted July 28, 2021 Author Share Posted July 28, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Planemo said: Interesting, I wasn't aware of the UL2270 certification. Having read a little about it, I am not surprised that the current crop of EUC's don't have it. The drop tests alone would probably render any Gotway useless. I would think Inmotion and Kingsong would be the best current contenders, although I suspect the venerable old Z10 would probably pass it now if I'm honest. There's another comment by Jason where he explains that the UL2272 cert doesn't even support the size of batteries (technically total voltage) used in virtually all EUCs today. So to get an EUC certified, you'd actually have to petition for them to extend UL2272 to encompass larger batteries/higher voltages, or almost NO contemporary EUC could pass. Everything else is moot if that wasn't resolved first. Edit: found it - https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/8518-help-all-lithium-ion-cycles-banned-at-usc/?tab=comments#comment-123703 . All bow to my google-fu. ;-) (To be clear, the speculation in that 2017 comment that the 14d/16s might become certified never actually happened.) Edited July 28, 2021 by AtlasP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Planemo Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 13 minutes ago, AtlasP said: There's another comment by Jason where he explains that the UL2272 cert doesn't even support the size of batteries (technically total voltage) used in virtually all EUCs today. Yep, 60v. So no surprise that the Z10 was designed at 58.8v then... 13 minutes ago, AtlasP said: Edit: found it - https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/8518-help-all-lithium-ion-cycles-banned-at-usc/?tab=comments#comment-123703 . All bow to my google-fu. ;-) (To be clear, the speculation in that 2017 comment that the 14d/16s might become certified never actually happened.) Interesting comment from Jason about having to get re-certified even if a change of cell was used in a particular model. That alone would be a bit of a nightmare too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtlasP Posted July 28, 2021 Author Share Posted July 28, 2021 (edited) 43 minutes ago, Planemo said: So no surprise that the Z10 was designed at 58.8v then... Good call, I never put those 2 and 2 together for the Z10's voltage specifically. Although in the end the Z10/Z-series was never UL2272 certified. But it would make sense as a reason for their otherwise strange design choice there, if the cert was something they were considering during the design process (and after having gone through the cert process once already for the One S1). Edited July 28, 2021 by AtlasP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rywokast Posted July 29, 2021 Share Posted July 29, 2021 6 hours ago, AtlasP said: There's another comment by Jason where he explains that the UL2272 cert doesn't even support the size of batteries (technically total voltage) used in virtually all EUCs today. So to get an EUC certified, you'd actually have to petition for them to extend UL2272 to encompass larger batteries/higher voltages, or almost NO contemporary EUC could pass. Everything else is moot if that wasn't resolved first. Edit: found it - https://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/8518-help-all-lithium-ion-cycles-banned-at-usc/?tab=comments#comment-123703 . All bow to my google-fu. ;-) (To be clear, the speculation in that 2017 comment that the 14d/16s might become certified never actually happened.) hmmm, after reading that i now know that UL certification is ridiculous and never meant to be for advanced PEVs xD interesting.. i honestly had no clue clue before what it entailed, just that it was a type of safety certification for electronics.. yea thats never gonna happen lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtlasP Posted July 30, 2021 Author Share Posted July 30, 2021 On 7/28/2021 at 8:43 PM, Rywokast said: hmmm, after reading that i now know that UL certification is ridiculous and never meant to be for advanced PEVs xD interesting.. i honestly had no clue clue before what it entailed, just that it was a type of safety certification for electronics.. yea thats never gonna happen lol It was pretty-clearly created as a knee-jerk response to the hoverboard fire scare, and myopically at that--without any anticipation of the broader PEV/micro-vehicle revolution we find ourselves in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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