Custom wheel frame/shell

[Tilmann]

AD0 seems to be a address selection PIN, so in theory you could maybe attach two MPUs at the same time:

I2C ADDRESS

AD0 = 0 1101000
AD0 = 1 1101001

For INT it depends on the controller, but I would somehow guess that the workflow of calculating balance in a wheel makes it not necessary to let the MPU be the triggering part for starting calculations, so my guess is you will likely not need it.

Redundant MPUs? That's the Fjutschär, baby! 

Thanks for your clarification, @jayjay23. At that level, my spotty knowledge leads me on very thin ice...

[esaj]

Got some more work done on the wheel over the weekend, although not as much as I would have hoped... But, at least it's nearing the first "beta"-stage completion   http://imgur.com/a/Qugi3

 

This is pretty much the stage I started from now, the pieces of cardboard are there just to measure things up a bit, I didn't plan on using them as casing

Like I said earlier, I'll be using scrap floorboard laminates for building a "makeshift"-casing at first.

At one point somewhere here, I also did test to see it powers up & works as it should. What I had forgotten (and I've probably forgotten to mention it earlier on in the battery project-thread also) is that FIREWHEEL WILL START IF YOU PLUG IN THE BATTERY WITHOUT THE POWER SWITCH BEING CONNECTED. No power switch -> it turns on the second it gets power. No idea why, I guess the power switch then CONNECTS the power-pins on the mainboard when the button is up (ie. off-position) and disconnected is the on-state?  It has happened to me once before during the battery-project, but I had just forgotten about it.

So, I had moved the wheel as I needed to use the miter saw, and the wheel is leaning on the wall, tire on the ground, casing inside, and I plug in the battery connectors. "Welcome to use Firewheel, sport mode" "Wait, what..."? Of course I did have connected it to the motor also at that point (yes, the whole thing was inside the frame as I was fitting it there). The cherry on the cake: the mainboard was the wrong way around, and as it tried to balance itself, it started running the motor in the wrong direction and slammed itself on the concrete. WHAM! Whoops... luckily it seems nothing broke, just scared the living shit out of me.

Placing the mainboard the wrong way around was a really, really stupid mistake, I though I was being careful, thinking "yeah, it's this way around in the original shell, the cable comes in from underneath"... yeah, except that the cable is on THE OTHER SIDE of the wheel than where I finally put it during assembly 

Yup, the batteries aren't going to fit with the paddings they need on the other side.

Time to redesign the casing a bit:

 

That should do it. There's only one battery pack now, wrapped in a plastic foam. I've still got a few problems to solve (mostly how to get the nuts of the bolts closing the top in place from the sides with the casing in the way ), before I can close the top up, but it's getting there (if I still have the energy to work on it tonight, might not). The motor wires are connected by a screw terminal for now, probably need to solder those too, as I don't trust it to hold in the longer run. And add the voltage-display (and maybe even the original battery display, as I have space now).

Here's a couple of video bits I shot. In the first one I try that the wheel still starts up & works while it's standing on the bricks (so the tire is in the air and this time the mainboard is the right way around ), and in the second bit I put in the same video, I take it off the bricks, test that the balancing works and then let it run over the top speed by picking it up:

 

 

Edited October 11, 2015 by esaj

[jayjay23]

You are really crazy :-)

I'm planning on a battery update also, I already got 64x2,6Ah cells at home but waiting for the BMS, so I need to modify the case so 4 packs will fit, so what you do is really a cool thing.

[esaj]

You are really crazy :-)

Somebody has to be the village idiot, right?

[Villac]

That is a beautiful creation! The wood and metal is like an old surf wagon!

[esaj]

First version is ready for ride now, although since it was already over midnight, the street lights were out, and I didn't want to risk trying it in the pitch black darkness outside. I did push it around for some time, about few hundred meters worth, to see that it still works, and did some "hopping" with my other foot on the pedal, but of course can't say anything about how it rides based on that. Tomorrow I'll try it out in daylight.

http://imgur.com/a/1zT8I

Ran into some trouble with the charge-port & power-button... I don't have a 16mm drill bit, and my smallest hole saw is 32mm   So, I drilled them with 12mm bit (the largest I had) and filed the holes bigger. That took a while.

Then I had to make a "pedestal" for the voltage-display, as it's both too deep and too wide to fit inside the mainboard compartment. It came out pretty good, although I again had to do a lot of drilling & filing to get it to fit. It's tight enough that the display won't get thrown off even if the wheel crashes. The picture above is testing that it works with a single battery pack.

There are more pictures in the album about fitting the pieces inside, this is the last one before I closed everything up. In hindsight, I should have taped the foams around the packs on the other side too, figured it too late (well, of course I could have just pulled them out and redo the wiring, but didn't bother right now ). Not too much space, but still enough to fit everything. And despite being tight, it's still so much easier to work with than the original shells.

All closed up and pedals in place in the latter picture. I put a "tie down strap" around the frame to keep it closed. There is still the problem remaining about how I'm going to close up the top part of the aluminum frame, as I cannot get the nuts behind the bars with the casing in the way... something I didn't think about too much when making the casing  Any ideas? I thought that maybe I could use threaded rod that goes through the upper part in front and back (sideways) and use nuts on both sides, like this:

Trying to give some scale of how big the wheel is... and yeah, that jacket is huge   At some point I noticed that in certain corners of the garage I could see my breathing (steam), so guess it's pretty cold. Didn't really notice it though

Front view. The dimensions are: about 68cm tall from ground, about 15cm wide, about 43cm in length. Might sound large, but it isn't THAT big. KS18 is actually as tall (and wider), the specs say: Machine size (mm): 680mm(H) x 465mm(L) X 190mm(Thickness)   Of course this is only 16", but the frame could probably hold a 18" motor too (At least as long as the pedal frame bolts fit and the width of the motor is the same, otherwise it requires modifications).

There are no lights yet (the front ride light is 22mm in diameter, so I guess I should get a drill bit for that, ain't going to file a hole that big), or then just wait until I get the 3000-lumen (yeah, probably not really as much as advertised, but I'd expect them to be bright enough ) led spots I ordered a while back. No back light either, it's actually white, so I also need a piece of transparent red plastic for that too (or just mutilate the original red plastic from the original shells). Also need to add some sort of handle, while tall, it's not tall enough that I could hold it with my hand without crouching. I thought I'd place a round piece of wood between two pieces of aluminum flat, that swivel around two bolts holding the other ends. That way I could turn the handle up when I need to use it, and swivel it underside when riding... will have to take a closer look if that's going to work. And also need to add some foam padding on the sides, I don't want to rip my jeans on any sharp corners on the vertical supports (the sides of the bars aren't sharp, but the cut corners are, have to file them down some time).

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 15, 2015 by esaj

[zentype]

Looking good! If you ever want to take some cross country trips ala Ugo, Looks like it wouldn't take much to also rig up a simple saddle / seat setup. So you can sit down for those times when you want to give your feet a break. Probably one of the features I like most about the KS 18" 

[esaj]

Looking good! If you ever want to take some cross country trips ala Ugo, Looks like it wouldn't take much to also rig up a simple saddle / seat setup. So you can sit down for those times when you want to give your feet a break. Probably one of the features I like most about the KS 18" 

When I was a kid, I had a bicycle with a saddle like this:

Would be probably pretty good for the wheel also    (Then just add a fixed handle bar and it's a cheap Ryno-clone ).

[OliverH]

Nice build But go and buy a welding machine to weld the frame.

[esaj]

Nice build But go and buy a welding machine to weld the frame.

I already cheaped out on a 65 euro (around 74USD) miter-saw blade for aluminum cutting and cut them all by hand with a hacksaw instead  Welding machine would cost a lot more, especially suitable for aluminum welding (and I haven't done any welding since I tried a little bit with my fathers' machine when I was a kid, so I'd have to learn that first too). Had I used steel for material, my neighbor could have probably welded the frame (but I understood his machine is not suitable for aluminum, it will probably just melt the bars or not make proper seams).

[Jag_Rip]

Nice! Did you ride it yet?

You should totally trick it out! Darken the wood, coppercolor the aluminium add a few skulls and chains and the steampunk coffinwheel extraoridinaire is born! \m/

[esaj]

Nice! Did you ride it yet?

Just did some laps between two streets for about half an hour, maybe couple of kilometers worth (it's about 2-300m back and forth, didn't count how many times I went around), mostly to get the battery voltage lower, as I'm still a bit paranoid about them (still have the issue of cut out if the voltage raises too high during regenerative braking). No cut outs, falls or unintentional dismounts. Didn't take it into any really fast speeds either, but I did do some faster accelerations (not really fast, but fast ), and I think I might have been close to hit the first warning speed (18km/h) at one point, but didn't get it to start and ran out of space. I don't wan't to try to outlean it either, as it's probably easier with the wheel being more top-heavy    

As for the rideability, it clearly is a different beast. With my knees touching the sides of the shell, it needs a bit of a different foot position than I normally have (feet turned more outwards). Couple of times during hitting smaller bumps, it felt that it "over-corrects" a bit (compared to original Firewheel), which I suspect is due to the mainboard being further away from the axle (the accelerometer will detect more powerful accelerations). Doing really tight circles will take lots of practice, but I can still turn it fairly tight by moving my knees away from the wheel body and doing the tilting it with my ankles while pushing down the pedal on the side I want to turn to. Also moving my feet on the pedals during riding is really easy, as the wheel will lean on the leg/knee of the side where my weight is. Overall the riding feel is really stable so far (of course it helps there are four battery packs that can give out 40A continuous / 80A max, translating into about 2.4kW / 4.8kW). The real test will be later tonight, after I take it out to the hiking paths.

I hastily padded the wheel a bit before I started to ride it, in case it would slam to the concrete during this first test :

Pretty, eh?   Still need to add a flashlight to the front before I venture further. Also I put the strap around it and taped it so that it can't fall to the tire/motor, but I definitely need to make some more fixed handle. Moving it around with the strap alone doesn't work, and I pushing it crouched isn't fun

 

You should totally trick it out! Darken the wood, coppercolor the aluminium add a few skulls and chains and the steampunk coffinwheel extraoridinaire is born! \m/

I plan on making separate shells for it later, like I've stated in the above posts.

[OliverH]

We like to see you take a ride

[esaj]

We like to see you take a ride

I probably could get some footage while riding on the lit street, but in the dark forest paths, the video would probably show nothing but a dim light from the flashlight (I've tried shooting videos in the dark earlier, but you can't see pretty much anything from those). It gets dark after 6PM here this late in the fall, and I usually stop working between 6 and 7PM (I like to sleep late, and having flexible hours & working from home has its perks ). I'll see if I get anything shot tonight (it's already 9:20PM here), might be that I'll wait 'til tomorrow so I can do it during the day light.

Also, got the notice that the first light of the two I ordered (I ordered them separately, as then they stay below the minimum price that customs rates are charged for ) has arrived in the post office, but haven't picked it up yet. This should help riding in the dark paths:  http://www.aliexpress.com/item/1-125W-3000LM-Cree-U7-Car-Motorcycles-LED-Fog-Light-DRL-Blue-Circle-Universal-LED-Driving/32462932543.html  That was actually pretty fast, ordered on 4th, was shipped on 6th and now it's already here    The other light is from the same seller, but comes with a switch (was about 0.30€ more expensive), and took one with white "ring"-light and the other with red. Don't know which one has arrived.

Edited October 16, 2015 by esaj

[esaj]

I did try out a small lap in the forest with a low-powered flashlight (so didn't see that far ahead of me ). I'm not sure if it's caused by the wheel bouncing of the ground or if it's the accelerometer causing stronger reaction, but hitting larger bumps, the wheel "kicks back" stronger than before when it straightens itself up. Got a bit surprised when it did the first time, luckily nothing happened. Also, after riding, I was pushing the wheel (still on) to the garage, and there's a tallish (about 5cm/2inch) step on the door frame. The tire jumped up a bit, hit the ground, jumped again etc., and each time it hit the ground the motor was pushing it in the opposite direction (as I was holding it, so it was swiveling back and forth). For a second there I thought it's going to get out of hand (as I can't get a good grip on it with no handle), but luckily it settled down pretty fast   Yeah, need that handle...

Also managed to shoot some video while riding my "test lap" on the street, I used the light on the iPhone camera, and it didn't come out as dark as I feared, actually it shows the tire reflectors nicely (when shooting by holding the phone on my side), luckily I also managed to point it in the generally right direction and not just shoot the tarmac whizzing by. Didn't try any really high speeds here, as I don't want to break the phone (it's not mine, it's the company's ) and I feel I still need to get more accustomed to the wheel.

Edit: The white "blob" here and there is my finger in front of the lens as I move the phone to shoot from another position

Edited October 16, 2015 by esaj

[Colestien]

Your doing great!  Keep going.  After all you have done, your shell will be a snap for you.

[esaj]

I did take it for a spin in the forest yesterday, but didn't shoot any video... I kept the speed pretty low at all times, no problems with bumps and holes otherwise, except when hitting a more "sharp" obstacle, like a rock poking out of the ground. When the wheel tilts forwards, the reaction is... almost violent    It really rips itself back to upright. I guess this is due to both the center of gravity being high (it tilts forward more easily when the wheel gets "blocked" by something for a split second, like the more upright side of a rock), and the mainboard being much farther away from the axle, so the accelerometer gets much higher readings than before. Might have to re-design a bit, so I could bring the mainboard closer to the wheel, or maybe I should go even as far as redesigning the frame somewhat so I could get the batteries and the mainboard next to the wheel (that would also bring the center of gravity down).

In other news, I picked up the lights today. 

They're powered directly from the original Firewheel batteries here. Oh, and the room is fully lit, but the lights are apparently bright enough to make it otherwise look dark with the photos. Otherwise nice, except:

-There are three wires (red, black and yellow) coming from the lights, and no instructions what the yellow wire is for, there's supposedly "high", "low" and "strobe" beam modes here, but don't know in which one they are now (well, definitely not strobe) and if and how the yellow wire is used to change the mode (I could of course just try to connect it to ground or positive wire
-The one with colored outer "ring" was supposed to be red and not green
-Another one of those was supposed to come with an on/off switch, but neither did

 

Edited October 18, 2015 by esaj

[esaj]

Otherwise nice, except:

-There are three wires (red, black and yellow) coming from the lights, and no instructions what the yellow wire is for, there's supposedly "high", "low" and "strobe" beam modes here, but don't know in which one they are now (well, definitely not strobe) and if and how the yellow wire is used to change the mode (I could of course just try to connect it to ground or positive wire
-The one with colored outer "ring" was supposed to be red and not green
-Another one of those was supposed to come with an on/off switch, but neither did

Let's add to the list that the one with the white circle light stopped working after the first try (the main light no longer lights up ). Yeah, my usual luck, as always.

I did, however, figure out the logic of the wires with the other light. With the yellow wire attached to positive source and black on the ground, only the circle light and a single red led inside the main light light up. With red & black connected to power source, it's those + the main light.

Now, if the other light was the right color (red) I wanted in the first place, I could use this as rear- or brake-light by using the yellow wire. But it's green. I could also use the other light for front "notification" light when riding in the public, similarly just by powering the circle light, and maybe even the low beam could be "dim" enough not to blind anyone, so I could use it on roads . But as the main light on the one with white circle light doesn't work, no go. Also, the circle light cannot be turned off, it's always burning. Already sent the seller a message what to do about the lights, no sense in sending them back as it's going to cost more than the lights did in total with shipping. Hopefully they'll either refund or send replacements, if not, I'll dispute it and hit 1 star reviews with full details on them. I still can use the green one off road, as there it won't matter as much that the color isn't what it supposed to be (only white light to front allowed).

Also figured that the light-mode changing happens simply by turning the light on and off. First on: high beam, second: low beam, third: strobe. Then it starts again from high beam. So I'll have to trigger them on and off to get the mode I want at times. At first I was a bit confused how I got it to start strobing suddenly, but after flicking it on and off for a while, it was pretty obvious

 

Edited October 18, 2015 by esaj

[OliverH]

Any news on the project?

[esaj]

10 hours ago, OliverH said:

Any news on the project?

Unfortunately I haven't had much time to work on this the last couple of weeks, just dismantled the electronics/battery casing. The next step is to build a new separate casing for the mainboard, so I can place it closer to the tire (about the same position as it is in the original shell), and to see if it helps with the "overreaction" of the accelerometer. Also, I've got parts for the batteries now, so I should be able to get them working so that they no longer shut off during braking even when charged to full, which is nice too, won't have to be so worried about braking with fuller batteries   If after that the center of gravity is still too high, I'll have to redesign the frame further, so I can place the batteries somewhere lower.

The roads have already been somewhat icy sometimes in the mornings (I think we already had first snow by this time last year), as the temperature has been dipping below freezing during some nights, might have to start getting parts for battery heating & building a studded tire, if I want to test it...

Edited November 2, 2015 by esaj

[Jag_Rip]

Yeah, I saw on vee's latest vid that there is some sugarcoating on his dirt-track already

I am thinking of getting a threaded tire myself, since I will be riding on the snow and over wet forest paths..

Good luck on the relocating of the mobo!

Edited November 2, 2015 by Jag_Rip

[zenbooster]

On 9/21/2015 at 12:00 AM, esaj said:

The simplicity of a taller "box" is also an option, that way it would be fairly easy to stuff everything on top of the tire, kinda like vee has done with the MSuper:

 

What is the thickness of the shell at the point of contact with the legs? And how comfortable was it to ride with such a thickness?

[Molly Friedrich]

I made one of these?

 

It's based off the Bel y Bel  Z One custom monowheel, but with slightly different era Vespa panels. And a different EUC inside it.  Mine has a KS18xl.

It's Vespa Vbb panels kitbashed onto a fibreglass and steel frame.

I felt it corners too aggressively, so I'm currently turning it into a reverse tripod.