2 month old V12 HT died - broken shoulder

[2disbetter]

I am healing. Another week and I start physical therapy. I am hopeful that I'll get full range of motion back. 

I am waiting on Inmotion to respond to my case, but cannot remove the kickstand from the wheel well right now since I can't use both arms. 

I suspect that if I can get that out the wheel will be fine. I am really interested in what Immotion say though. I mean that kickstand is REALLY lodged in there. I am kind of worried that pulling it out will pop the tire, or cause it to explode. 

 

[Brendan "nog3" Halliday]

9 hours ago, 2disbetter said:

I am healing. Another week and I start physical therapy. I am hopeful that I'll get full range of motion back. 

I am waiting on Inmotion to respond to my case, but cannot remove the kickstand from the wheel well right now since I can't use both arms. 

I suspect that if I can get that out the wheel will be fine. I am really interested in what Immotion say though. I mean that kickstand is REALLY lodged in there. I am kind of worried that pulling it out will pop the tire, or cause it to explode. 

 

Unfortunately that does look like the kickstand fouled up your tyre and that's why you were thrown.

I have seen loose kickstands from time to time caused by the owners dropping on one side and warping the inner shell just enough that the friction isn't strong enough to hold the kickstand properly.

There are modifications that help mitigate the chances of this happening, but it's always been a bone of contention for me with customers I had installed knobby tyres for on the V11 that I would remove the kickstand as part of this install to completely remove the risk of them being injured by my work.

In any case - condolences on your injury, hope you are healing well.

[Paradox]

17 minutes ago, Brendan "nog3" Halliday said:

There are modifications that help mitigate the chances of this happening, but it's always been a bone of contention for me with customers I had installed knobby tyres for on the V11 that I would remove the kickstand as part of this install to completely remove the risk of them being injured by my work.

https://hulaj.market/en/inmotion-v11/162-improved-kickstand-holders-for-inmotion-v11-v12.html

[2disbetter]

I am of the opinion that the kickstand will be completely removed, and I'll never have another adjustable kickstand on an EUC again. 

I am worried that the kickstand damaged internals on the wheel though. I am waiting for Inmotion to respond. 

 

I don't want to be quick to say this is a liability that Inmotion should address, but the fact of the matter is, I was riding perfectly fine. No wobble, perfect road. I did nothing wrong. The kickstand failed and as a result I have a broken shoulder and an inop V12 HT. 

I don't want Inmotion to compensate me, expect in the event my wheel is broken as a result. I would strongly encourage them to make a note about the kickstands, and provide instructions on how to remove them. 

Edited March 24, 2023 by 2disbetter

[Punxatawneyjoe]

Sorry to hear of the kickstand failure ,hope you are healing well, definitely something i need to consider putting the knobby on my v11.

[Hellkitten]

20 minutes ago, Punxatawneyjoe said:

Sorry to hear of the kickstand failure ,hope you are healing well, definitely something i need to consider putting the knobby on my v11.

My buddy rides a v11 with a knobby, he took the kickstand off. 

[chanman]

Without any impact to the wheel it's just what, a screw failing and the stand falling down fully and into the tire, and the knobby doing what it does best? Pretty unfortunate design if so.

Probably would want to deflate the tire and see if you can wiggle it out of there, save you disassembling the whole thing. The board might be toast though if it doesn't turn on still, so some disassembly needed anyway.

[2disbetter]

17 hours ago, chanman said:

Probably would want to deflate the tire and see if you can wiggle it out of there, save you disassembling the whole thing.

That is what I wanted to do, but the valve stem is not exposed. Not sure I can do that now. I am not sure the board is fried, because I could power on when plugging in the charger. I was able to pull logs for Inmotion this way. So I am hopeful that because the wheel cannot move, there is some kind of failsafe that is preventing the board from powering up. 

 

Edited March 25, 2023 by 2disbetter

[2disbetter]

SO Inomtion's offical take is that the driver board is bad and needs to be replaced. I still need to get the kickstand out of the wheel well though. I am curious if once that obstruction is removed if the wheel will then turn on like normal.

 

[2disbetter]

The arm is doing better and I am looking forward to getting back on the wheel. This time fully armored up. Broken bones suck terribly! 

[Dan48]

Hey man. Take care to do rigorously the kinetotherapeutic rehabilitation program to regain all the full motions of your shoulder. If it’s a money problem, do at least a 2 weeks program to learn the moves then continue do them rigorously at home without paying (though you will miss the pulleys and other apparatus - you can replace the pulleys at home by elastic bands over a pull-ups bar). You can find on youtube also very good exercises. I know exactly what are going through, since I had also a shoulder fracture falling with a scouter/moped directly on my left shoulder. The fracture was on top of the shoulder where the lateral shoulder ligament binds with the upper bone. I had my left arm immobilized with a bandage to the body for 2-3 weeks, I don’t recall exactly, then the arm was completely “cemented”, I couldn’t rise the arm in lateral not even an inch, neither if helped with the other arm or by someone else. In front, I could rise the arm only like 2-3 inches. I did 6 months kinetotherapeutic rehabilitation with kinetotherapist and also for the first two weeks they made me some Ultrasonic or radiation treatment to the shoulder with some apparatus to help the healing process and used some kind of cream regularly. Sorry, there are years and I forgot these details, but I remember all the regularly effort made for 6 months to recover all the full motions of my arm. I went to treatment twice a week, I wanted more often, but the doctor told me, it’s not good for the healing process to force to much in first months. I did a lot of exercises with a stick (held by both hands and helping the movement with the good arm) and with pulleys (by pulling one corespondent pulley with the good, right arm to rise a little the hurt, left arm). Session by session, week  by week the amplitude of rising the left arm has increased. At the end, 5th - 6th month I started doing push-ups and pull-ups. Now fully recovered. Keep the spirit up and do the exercises regularly, two sessions per week, without forcing the movement, you should not feel pain when doing it. When you feel pain, stop the motion. Patience is key.

[2disbetter]

3 hours ago, Dan48 said:

Hey man. Take care to do rigorously the kinetotherapeutic rehabilitation program to regain all the full motions of your shoulder. If it’s a money problem, do at least a 2 weeks program to learn the moves then continue do them rigorously at home without paying (though you will miss the pulleys and other apparatus - you can replace the pulleys at home by elastic bands over a pull-ups bar). You can find on youtube also very good exercises. I know exactly what are going through, since I had also a shoulder fracture falling with a scouter/moped directly on my left shoulder. The fracture was on top of the shoulder where the lateral shoulder ligament binds with the upper bone. I had my left arm immobilized with a bandage to the body for 2-3 weeks, I don’t recall exactly, then the arm was completely “cemented”, I couldn’t rise the arm in lateral not even an inch, neither if helped with the other arm or by someone else. In front, I could rise the arm only like 2-3 inches. I did 6 months kinetotherapeutic rehabilitation with kinetotherapist and also for the first two weeks they made me some Ultrasonic or radiation treatment to the shoulder with some apparatus to help the healing process and used some kind of cream regularly. Sorry, there are years and I forgot these details, but I remember all the regularly effort made for 6 months to recover all the full motions of my arm. I went to treatment twice a week, I wanted more often, but the doctor told me, it’s not good for the healing process to force to much in first months. I did a lot of exercises with a stick (held by both hands and helping the movement with the good arm) and with pulleys (by pulling one corespondent pulley with the good, right arm to rise a little the hurt, left arm). Session by session, week  by week the amplitude of rising the left arm has increased. At the end, 5th - 6th month I started doing push-ups and pull-ups. Now fully recovered. Keep the spirit up and do the exercises regularly, two sessions per week, without forcing the movement, you should not feel pain when doing it. When you feel pain, stop the motion. Patience is key.

Thank you so much! Just yesterday the doc found that my bone has healed. I had a fracture in my humorous right where it connects to the socket. Clean break. It is completely healed, bone wise now, muscles not so sure. My motion is quite limited, but it is not stiff, and I'm grateful for that. I have good insurance, and so far I have 10 physio sessions. If I need more, I will certianly ask for them. 

Today like an idiot I took the V13 out in front of my house. I really just miss riding. I did not go faster than 20 kph, and I was super careful. If I had to bail I would jump off and not care about the wheel at all. Don't worry I am not going out regularly, I just did it to make sure I still could. I miss riding a lot. 

 

Inmotion is sending me a driver board, but I still have to get the kickstand out of the wheel well. Not really sure how I am going to do that. 

 

Thank you again for your words of encourament! I plan on working as hard as a can to regain my shoulder. I was strong in that arm, and I have shrunk a lot. I look really weird in the mirror now. But I am happy and grateful that my healing has gone as well as it is has up to this point. I'm positively positive about the future. 

[Hellkitten]

2 hours ago, 2disbetter said:

but I still have to get the kickstand out of the wheel well. Not really sure how I am going to do that.

Can’t you cut the stand at the mid point that’s sticking out? Then remove both sections. It’s hard to tell exactly what’s going on in that pic, but I’d think that would work. 

[2disbetter]

5 minutes ago, Hellkitten said:

Can’t you cut the stand at the mid point that’s sticking out? Then remove both sections. It’s hard to tell exactly what’s going on in that pic, but I’d think that would work. 

What do I cut it with? 

And I think if  cut it, the part that is lodged in the wheel well will be even harder to remove. 

 

[Hellkitten]

Bolt cutters, angle grinder, dremal, metal saw. 

[2disbetter]

Btw, Inmotion is sending me a new Driver board. Is this the mainboard? How many boards are in the HT? 

Edit: I just looked up a video from Inmotion on how to replace the board. That is indept and a involved thing. I guess I am going to get to know the wheel real well. I hope I put it back together well enough. I need to pick up some blue locktite. 

Edited April 2, 2023 by 2disbetter

[Dan48]

On 3/31/2023 at 6:59 PM, 2disbetter said:

Thank you so much! Just yesterday the doc found that my bone has healed. I had a fracture in my humorous right where it connects to the socket. Clean break. It is completely healed, bone wise now, muscles not so sure. My motion is quite limited, but it is not stiff, and I'm grateful for that. I have good insurance, and so far I have 10 physio sessions. If I need more, I will certianly ask for them. 

Today like an idiot I took the V13 out in front of my house. I really just miss riding. I did not go faster than 20 kph, and I was super careful. If I had to bail I would jump off and not care about the wheel at all. Don't worry I am not going out regularly, I just did it to make sure I still could. I miss riding a lot. 

 

Inmotion is sending me a driver board, but I still have to get the kickstand out of the wheel well. Not really sure how I am going to do that. 

 

Thank you again for your words of encourament! I plan on working as hard as a can to regain my shoulder. I was strong in that arm, and I have shrunk a lot. I look really weird in the mirror now. But I am happy and grateful that my healing has gone as well as it is has up to this point. I'm positively positive about the future. 

“I plan on working hard” DO NOT DO IT. The doctor told me not to force the recovery process, the more you force the longer recovery will be. Do the weekly session regularly, without forcing/hard. Give the muscle and tendon time to heal and grow. It’s like in bodybuilding: if you train too hard and too often, without giving the time for the muscles to recover and grow, you will not see any gains, or maybe even lose some mass. PATIENCE IS KEY. Just forget for a few months about EUC shit universe, fill your head with something else and do patiently, with focus, your recovery program. EUC can wait, your health is more important. Give it all your attention. Don’t come back to this forum or Youtube EUC videos, since this will make you eager to recover faster to be again on your EUC, and you will want to force the recovery speed, which is not good. Just forget this shit for a wile and give all your focus to recovery and rest. You are recovered after 6 months from accident, when you will be able to do as many push-ups and pull-ups like when you were healthy, and feel really like new after a year (I mean not hearing any cranks when rotating the shoulder - in the immobilization period, some deposits are accumulated in the shoulder, that cause the “cementisation”, and all of this disappears in time). Just be patient, man. Your EUC doesn’t go anywhere. You want to be fully recovered. And then, buy some serious armor with shoulder protection, that doesn’t move and watch crash EUC videos to learn how to keep your arms in front, ready all the time and also be relaxed with the knees flexed, so that if fall again, to relax your legs and fall on the knees first and then in the hands, not stiff like a plank, on your shoulder. All the best.

[2disbetter]

7 hours ago, Dan48 said:

“I plan on working hard” DO NOT DO IT. The doctor told me not to force the recovery process, the more you force the longer recovery will be. Do the weekly session regularly, without forcing/hard. Give the muscle and tendon time to heal and grow. It’s like in bodybuilding: if you train too hard and too often, without giving the time for the muscles to recover and grow, you will not see any gains, or maybe even lose some mass. PATIENCE IS KEY. Just forget for a few months about EUC shit universe, fill your head with something else and do patiently, with focus, your recovery program. EUC can wait, your health is more important. Give it all your attention. Don’t come back to this forum or Youtube EUC videos, since this will make you eager to recover faster to be again on your EUC, and you will want to force the recovery speed, which is not good. Just forget this shit for a wile and give all your focus to recovery and rest. You are recovered after 6 months from accident, when you will be able to do as many push-ups and pull-ups like when you were healthy, and feel really like new after a year (I mean not hearing any cranks when rotating the shoulder - in the immobilization period, some deposits are accumulated in the shoulder, that cause the “cementisation”, and all of this disappears in time). Just be patient, man. Your EUC doesn’t go anywhere. You want to be fully recovered. And then, buy some serious armor with shoulder protection, that doesn’t move and watch crash EUC videos to learn how to keep your arms in front, ready all the time and also be relaxed with the knees flexed, so that if fall again, to relax your legs and fall on the knees first and then in the hands, not stiff like a plank, on your shoulder. All the best.

Thank you Dan! I needed to hear that. I have been on the EUC already a few times, but never faster than 25 kph. I think I'm just going to stop that crap right now. A fully working shoulder is what I really want. 

[2disbetter]

On 3/24/2023 at 4:34 AM, 2disbetter said:

I suspect that if I can get that out the wheel will be fine. I am really interested in what Immotion say though. I mean that kickstand is REALLY lodged in there. I am kind of worried that pulling it out will pop the tire, or cause it to explode. 

So I have been in touch with Inmotion. Basically they said that the driver board is dead, and I guess that means this is what causes the accident. The kickstand must have been sucked in after the accident began. Anyway, they sent the board and the entire heat sink (very nice). However, after removing the kickstand from the wheel the entire thing died. It already wasn't not turning on normally, but if I plugged in the charger, it would turn on with the charging battery. Now this doesn't work either. On top of this the side walls look like they are no longer structurally sound on the right side of the wheel. This is where the kickstand went. 

So I wrote Inmotion telling them all of this and that basically, even if I were able to repair all of this, that I'm not sure I would regain trust in the wheel. I asked for a replacement wheel. Now it looks like this isn't an option, and I have to send my wheel (on my own dime) to Inmotion France, where they will diagnose and repair the wheel. 

I know how I feel about this, but I'm curious what the forum's reactions are? 

 

Regarding my arm, 2 Thursdays ago I was able to remove the sling, and I have started physical therapy. Things are going well. 

[chanman]

If your arm is rehabilitated enough for it I would go ahead and do the board replacement since you have the part already, which should get it going again. I don't think sending it off to have someone else do it will do much for your confidence in it, and if you do it yourself you can know it's done right. You can also pull the motor out to inspect/change the tire.

Not sure what to make of the charging thing, my thoughts are that dead boards don't usually power on or charge, and I don't know how the kickstand plays into it. On the potentially damaged tire/tube those are pretty easily replaceable as well, you can get a bike or motorcycle shop to do it since it might be difficult to do without straining your arm.

[Jkay]

I just changed the board on my V12HT for sudden tilt angle changes.  When I would ride level flat ground at a reasonably consistent speed the tilt angle would randomly change. Not comfortable at all.  The board change is fiddly but certainly not difficult, when you get to top opened up it slightly intimidating but the sockets are clearly marked on the cover,  patience and YouTube done in 1:30.  Wheel rides perfect now!  

[mlau]

10 hours ago, 2disbetter said:

 I have to send my wheel (on my own dime) to Inmotion France, where they will diagnose and repair the wheel.

inmotion france = newwalkings. I've sent a broken 2 month old wheel under warranty to them, they declared everywhing was caused by user error, and parts (motor+control board according to them) + labour cost would amount to the price of a new one.
I don't envy you at all.

[2disbetter]

Yeah I'm beginning to think I should just try to repair the wheel. Are there any EUC manufacturers that handle this better? I kind of thought Inmotion was going to be the best in this regard. 

[UPONIT]

Quote

I know how I feel about this, but I'm curious what the forum's reactions are?

Extreme confusion and genuine sympathy.

Quote

Regarding my arm, 2 Thursdays ago I was able to remove the sling, and I have started physical therapy. Things are going well. 

Really glad to hear that! Keep up the good work.

After 9 weeks in casts and splints that didn't stabilize the fracture at all, I've kinda set the requirement for my return to riding as "when I can do pushups again." Does that sound right to you?

[2disbetter]

On 4/16/2023 at 12:23 AM, UPONIT said:

After 9 weeks in casts and splints that didn't stabilize the fracture at all, I've kinda set the requirement for my return to riding as "when I can do pushups again." Does that sound right to you?

Kind of does. For me, I can do push ups, but not pull ups yet. 

I'm still working to get full range back. It is slow, and as has been mentioned here, the little exercises you are given to do, are the most important things you can do to regain full motion. 

I am going to sell my V12HT. I just can't fully trust it again. 

I trust my V13, but it is an entirely different machine. 

In generally I rarely ever go faster than 50 kph. Breaking a bone really has a way of tempering you.