Popular Post Hellkitten Posted October 27, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 27, 2021 I received my wheel in late August 2021 and had some software issues that finally were resolved. I ended up doing multiple firmware and software updates that fixed my issues, allowing me to finally learn to ride. 🙏 I charged cells and went to pump up the shocks, turns out one of the saddle fasteners was broken right outta the box, as well as one of the hex bolts was stripped. So I ended up using a Dremel tool to grind a slot into the bolt to remove it before I could even access the shocks. I sanded and roughed the saddle fasteners then reinforced all of them and fixed the broken one with epoxy putty. Found the QC sticker in the process.....😑 I’ve been training in a local school yard close to my place. There is a grassy field, wheelchair ramp with handrails up both sides and two basketball hoops about ten feet apart. A ton of great options for someone bumbling around on a wheel. Day 1- I suck at riding one of these confound contraptions. Mostly fence grabbing and very short bursts flying solo. Very humbling experience. 😖 Day 2- I added some DIY yoga block pads. WHAT A DIFFERENCE! I can’t imagine why these things aren’t stock on all bigger wheels. I have way more confidence and control now. I figured out my foot placement as well. Wobble factor is much reduced. I’ve been using the wheelchair ramp for most of my runs. I can’t mount without something to hold onto. The ramp has about a ten foot straight run then a sharp corner and another ten foot run. I started being able to do those freehanded (mostly) and grabbing the railing to corner. Much happier with my day two, still feel like an infant learning to walk. 👶🏻 Day 3- Still on the ramp getting in practice. I also started going back and forth between the basketball hoops. It’s a straight freehand run then grab the pole and swing around for another run. Serendipitously I found a grocery cart next to the school and added that into my training. Thank you @OldFartRides for the tip! Still can’t free mount, still can’t turn very well. I am doing longer stretches before bailing. Did curb drop and stayed on! 👍 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldFartRides Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 Good work ! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 Got it all backwards. The EUC is training for riding a shopping cart... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellkitten Posted October 28, 2021 Author Share Posted October 28, 2021 37 minutes ago, Paul A said: Got it all backwards. The EUC is training for riding a shopping cart... Oh I did some shopping cart training back in the day. Not quite at that guys level. Lol. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellkitten Posted October 28, 2021 Author Share Posted October 28, 2021 Day 4- more laps between the hoop posts and a few up and down the ramp. I did a few 50-75 foot lengths with some quirky cornering. I really got a few glimpses of low speed flying on a wheel, between barking my shins...... might go back out later if my legs allow me. 🦵 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottie Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 All in all you are doing well to even be riding the V11 at this point. Sounds like you are doing much better than I was on day 4. It will not be long now. Significant improvement should start coming faster for you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellkitten Posted October 28, 2021 Author Share Posted October 28, 2021 Thanks! It’s tough, not going to lie. Lol. I’m an avid cyclist hopefully the balancing helps. Can’t wait to get to the point of just riding the thing. Although part of the reason I wanted to try one of these things, was the challenge. So I’m trying to enjoy this part of the process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldFartRides Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 They are indeed a challenge. Too bad about the challenge of getting the wheel going right off the bat. The learning phase is perhaps the most rewarding. Enjoy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 Try making sure to stand up straight. No slouching, no crouching. Have the spine totally erect and straight up. Head up, chin up, eyes looking off into the distance/horizon, not looking down at the ground in the near distance in front. Place ankles at the center of the pedals. Toes might protrude over the front of the pedals, but that is ok. People sometimes mistakenly align the feet in relation to the pedals. They position their feet to be evenly spaced on the pedal. Alignment of ankles to the vertical line/middle of the pedals, means the vertical line of the body is aligned with the vertical center line of the EUC's center of gravity/mass. Hope these suggestions help. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottie Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 6 hours ago, Hellkitten said: Although part of the reason I wanted to try one of these things, was the challenge. So I’m trying to enjoy this part of the process. The challenge is the best part. Yes, being up and riding is fun. But the learning and improving day by day is the satisfying part. And the exhilaration of your 1st good roll is unmatched! As you said ... enjoy this part as much as you can. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcgldr Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 (edited) Old guy here (69 years old). I watched a few how to ride EUC videos before ordering and then while waiting for my V8F to arrive. Following Kuji Roll's advice I planned to learn how to free mount last, and ride with support mount and launch, so when I did learn free mount I would already be able to ride and stop. I got a 15 minute intro using a rail and getting advice from another rider, mostly to constantly steer left and right rather than trying to balance while going straight. Later that day, I was on my own and I went to a tennis court. After a few minutes using the fence for mount, launch, and ride assist, I was able to veer away from the fence using arm flail | yaw steer (fail left to steer right and vice versa), steering into fall for balance, and also guiding the V8F where I wanted it to go, at around 4 or 5 mph. Managed to do laps right away. For some riders, the arm flailing seems almost instinctive, such as this 3 year old: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9YiHu5HJ6o My version of this (doesn't look any better than the 3 year old). The video helped me realize I was hunched over, which I corrected afterwards. I learned to stop without grabbing the V8F later on. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPyy84EThmM On my 3rd day, I switched to a location with a long straight where I felt comfortable going a bit faster. At around 6 to 8 mph, the V8F became mostly self-stable (with your legs kept evenly bent, you lean the EUC as much as you lean due to imbalance, and it tilt steers enough to correct for the imbalance, but I was not consciously tilt steering yet), which allowed me to focus on leaning forwards | backwards for speed control, and experiment with tilt (move inside foot down, outside foot up) steering, since I didn't know how the V8F would respond. After a few passes, I was able to do mild weave patterns like the girl near the end of this video. I used this video as a guide, since the girl is nearly motionless other than leaning and tilting the EUC, no arm flailing, body twisting, or carving, ... . Due to her light weight, speed, and turning radius, she leans more than she tilts the EUC. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hWMwK3Cfs0 I don't know how fast you need to go on a V11 before it becomes stable. Once I could ride at slow (3 mph or so) and moderate speed (6 to 10 mph), I learned to free mount on a soccer field, my only time on grass. Since I already knew how to ride, rather than learning proper one foot glide, it was just a couple of steps and hop on. Once I could free mount, I started riding on a very long and wide pathway, with a half circle on one side I could use for some turn practice. You can get an idea of the stability of the V8F at moderate speed in my only other video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keDvRMScO1g For me, the tilt steering wasn't instinctive, and I was pretty much estimating how much to body lean and tilt steer the V8F depending on speed and turning radius, and having to make some conscious mid-turn corrections. Over time, the turns improved, and the tilt steering gradually evolved into a reflexive response. During that time and currently, I'm mostly riding at a bike trail with mild turns, declines and inclines, or on the private streets where I live. I rarely work on low speed, tight tilt steering turns, so far about 4 sessions on this, as it isn't needed at the locations I ride at. Left turns are a bit more awkward for me, so I've spent more time on them. Once I reduced the tight tilt steering turns down to about 8 foot diameter circles, it was good enough for 90 degree turns on a standard sidewalk intersections, so I haven't tried making the turns tighter. If needed, I can stop and step off, uturn the V8F with my mounted foot and remount. Edited October 28, 2021 by rcgldr 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 (edited) One simple way to turn is to keep one leg straight, and push the knee of the other leg forward. eg: if wanting to turn/steer right......keep the left leg straight, and push the right knee slightly forward. The body needs to lean very slightly to the right, because the right side has become a little shorter with the right knee/leg having moved, become a little shorter in height. Just do it very gently, very small movement, at the start. Edited October 28, 2021 by Paul A 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellkitten Posted October 28, 2021 Author Share Posted October 28, 2021 Thank you for all the detailed responses! I’ll try to incorporate those tips in my routine. I’ve done a bit of the tilt steering, but don’t have much control. A lot of wobbles still. I’m able to understand the very subtle techniques needed to properly control an EUC, but I’m not yet able to apply them. I’ll try and stand up straighter and keep focused on where I want to go. I am looking less at the wheel than I was when I started. My knee and shin took a bit of a beating last night and I didn’t go back out. Still sore today. Lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcgldr Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, Hellkitten said: I am looking less at the wheel than I was when I started. Take a look at the youtube how to ride EUC videos. Most of them will mention you want to look straight ahead (not down) which helps with balance. You could try the arm flailing method for low speed, or try to increase speed to about 6 mph (slow jogging speed, so you can still bail by stepping off), to see if the V11 becomes stable. You'd want to do this in an area with a long enough straight section. Edited October 28, 2021 by rcgldr 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 (edited) Trial by fire.. find an open parking lot with nothing to hold on to or run in to. Try to ride from one side to the other. Learning to free mount sucks, but it must be done. Once you do finally get going, youll want to stay on it so you don't HAVE to free mount. Of course, then you are at the other end of the lot and HAVE to. I started in grass free mounting for a day or few. I eventually hit concrete. I spent a couple hours in a large open parking lot and the rest is history.. Sounds to me like you're doing pretty good. I think that a shopping cart isnt going to help you at this point. If you are already able to roll for 40', you've passed one of the steepest parts of the curve. I find that 8-10mph is the sweet spot for turns in the beginning. Like a bicycle, a certain amount of speed makes it easier. Going slow is TOUGH. Muscle conditioning takes time. If you've already dropped a curb, it seems that fear is and won't be a problem. You'll be great as you will try to tackle everything. Youll also be terrible because you try to tackle everything. Excellent combo and I can't wait to hear how it develops. fwiw, dont put fingers in fences for practice, and dont use thread locker near plastic (unless specificaly designed for it) Edited October 28, 2021 by ShanesPlanet 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellkitten Posted October 28, 2021 Author Share Posted October 28, 2021 Two curb drops now..... lol. I’ve done a ton of downhill mountain biking so I’m comfortable driving off of things. Thanks for the encouragement. I am seeing improvements, from my side I just wanted them faster. I can be impatient by nature though. The school yard I’m practicing in has a decent sized concrete area that I’ve done my longest stretchs in. I’ll try the arm flailing, but I like the lean turning idea better. I think you are right about the speed. Around running pace things seem to stabilize, I think my max speed was 10mph. Which I’m sure was just a high peak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcgldr Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 (edited) 5 hours ago, Hellkitten said: I’ll try the arm flailing, but I like the lean turning idea better. I think you are right about the speed. Around running pace things seem to stabilize, I think my max speed was 10mph. Which I’m sure was just a high peak. Arm flailing is meant for new riders at low speed or experienced riders at very slow speeds (usually dirt trails with very low speed tight turns). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ro3o8U9uZeU&t=57s You've since realized that around running pace on the V11, it becomes more stable. At this speed, you can experiment with leaning forwards | backwards for speed control and tilt steering for turning. As I posted earlier, tilt steering wasn't instinctive for me, since the tilt to steer response isn't "linear" and also varies a bit with speed. It's easier to learn if you can narrow your speed range, say 8 to 10 mph (if 8 mph is stable on the V11), which eliminates one of the variables you deal with when learning to tilt steer. For slower speeds, instead of arm flailing, you can yaw steer without flailing arms, twisting at the middle to twist your legs to steer the V11, while your upper body isn't twisting very much. Mostly used when mounting or slowing to a stop. You can combine the leg twisting with tilt steering, which will look like carving on snow skis. Extreme low speed example of this (the leg twisting may be due to the response of the tilt steering, since the rider is trying to keep his upper body from not twisting to keep the camera stable). The rider scrapes his shoe once and walks off the EUC, but at 3 mph, not an issue. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83gEm6MzODw Edited October 29, 2021 by rcgldr 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellkitten Posted October 29, 2021 Author Share Posted October 29, 2021 Ahhhh thanks for more experienced insights. I used to ski a far bit. I think I could incorporate that leg leaning turning. Makes sense. 👍 It’s still difficult for me to add a bunch of various subtle maneuvers into my riding. It’s a bit of a battle each time I’m on the thing. The wheel and I are still negotiating the parameters of our relationship......... 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 (edited) I would also suggest to not use pads or try NOT to lean into them. The foundation of good control and no wobbles, relies on your ability to weight shift with just your feet. I LOVE my pads on the sherman, so Im not anti pad. I do find myself getting lazy tho and I start using my leg into the pad, more than the weight in my feet. I only caution you, as going from knowing how to use the feet and NOT clench the wheel, to: using pads is easy. If you fail to learn the relationship of feet and weight first, yuo may find it hinders you in the bigger picture. YOur next plateau will come and youll get a rush when wobbles hit you at speed. Your first reaction will be to grab the wheel and slow down. Most of us find that staying loose and leaning is more effective. I am constantly amazed at how minute shifts in weight or posture, make big changes. The subtlety of what we are doing, MUST be on a level deeper than what I have to actively think about. Thats the rub in the beginning. Thinking about it can only get you so far..... Edited October 29, 2021 by ShanesPlanet 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellkitten Posted October 29, 2021 Author Share Posted October 29, 2021 Mmmmm that’s probably good advice. I found it much harder without pads. What if I got the fundamentals with them on, then took them off after I was more comfortable? Do you think that would set me back? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..... Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 22 minutes ago, Hellkitten said: Mmmmm that’s probably good advice. I found it much harder without pads. What if I got the fundamentals with them on, then took them off after I was more comfortable? Do you think that would set me back? Yeah, its harder without pads, as its requiring you to use different muscles and you have no supporting it with upper legs/shin. I don't know about setting you 'back' or anything. Its not like its a race or theres any SET method of riding. I'm no pro, so I cant say for certain that any order of progression is much better than another. Maybe just try it both ways over time. Its also of note that I don't ride a v11. I do however ride a padless 18xl, and i rarely ever touch the shell on it. A much different ride feel and style than a padded wheel. Again, I own no v11, so maybe someone else with one, can chime in. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hellkitten Posted October 29, 2021 Author Popular Post Share Posted October 29, 2021 That makes sense to me. I often ride my mountain bike in a “floating” style. Feet and hands only making contact with the bike, crouching over the seat. Which allows me to kinda offset the bikes weight from my own and absorb various road/track obstacles. Day 5- I just got back from what was EASILY my best session yet! I ended up doing quite a few laps of the school yard. Full circles, of a few hundred feet, long straight stretches, I tried the leaning on one pedal to turn it worked very well for the most part. Yes there was some arm flailing which also helped. It was crazy windy out which I don’t think helped, I felt like a bit of a sail. I bailed a few times, but I actually really rode the wheel in a way that it’s meant to be used. I rode almost the full block home from the school as well and made sure to jump the curb. Thank you to everyone here helping me out and spending your time giving feedback and tips. They’ve really helped. This is a very welcoming forum. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellkitten Posted October 29, 2021 Author Share Posted October 29, 2021 Day 5.5- went back out after a tea and break. Did a bunch more laps and went up and down my st, plus more cornering, I even managed half a dozen free mounts. Very wobbly ones, but no posts or trees. My bruises have new bruises now though. Very happy with my results today. Had some good flying moments. 🦅 getting a feeling for the addiction....... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 Great to hear. Time now for lesson number 2..... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellkitten Posted October 29, 2021 Author Share Posted October 29, 2021 Whoa!! I’m a tad bit from doing any of that. Lol 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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