Other toys for transport??

[Frankman]

@Trucktent welcome to the forum.  I'm an ultralight aircraft pilot and carry the EUC with me on my plane when I go for a flight. Another pilot is @Stefan(O). We are italian, and you?.

Please take a look at our posts, there are some images and some video:   

 

Edited March 28, 2016 by Frankman

[Sky Rover]

I always try to enjoy a range

[Luc]

Hi, so after 5 years I’m back to my old tricks and have made another comparison chart. This one is the most advanced yet and looks at various gadgets and rates them as commuting tools using objective measures. It’s unlike anything else you’ll find online because it uses a unique version of the decision matrix format (based on the Pugh matrix) to try and provide a truly objective and thorough evaluation.

How it works is actually quite simple – just using importance values (weightings) for various factors and seeing how each transport tool performs in each factor category. Just take a minute or two to read the info on how it works (shown at the top of the table) and then hopefully it will make sense. 

There’s even an interactive version where you enter your own personal importance values and the table adjusts according to what you put in to very clearly show what gadgets are most suitable for you.

Have only included two all rounder Eucs (ewheels) so far (Kingsong 16s and Inmotion V8)  - was sort of hoping that the Eucs would win over the other gadgets. Eucs score highly but scooters generally get higher scores thanks to the safety and convenience of the handles. It’s only rating them as commuting tools – so fun and tricks and looks are not included as factors. However, I’m always looking to see if any factor is missing – if you think I’ve missed anything let me know

Hope it’s fun and useful

https://peacemakerfoundation.com/2015/07/06/transportables-portable-transport-tools/

[xorbe]

3 hours ago, Luc said:

Hope it’s fun and useful

https://peacemakerfoundation.com/2015/07/06/transportables-portable-transport-tools/

For the love of all that is holy, skip the chart on the page, and click on the pdf to view.

Edited May 4, 2020 by xorbe

[Luc]

10 hours ago, xorbe said:

For the love of all that is holy, skip the chart on the page, and click on the pdf to view.

Haha! Sorry, about that. You have to scroll around the chart and depends on the device you're using. Should work fine on computers and ipads - but yes PDF is easier is to view in one go but no PDF for the interactive chart which is perhaps the most valuable aspect for many

[Luc]

So I really should be working now, but the chart is so addictive that have added some tweaks to better reflect the euc's capacity to get up curbs thanks to the larger wheels. So the euc scores have gone up a little. 

[xorbe]

47 minutes ago, Luc said:

Haha! Sorry, about that. You have to scroll around the chart and depends on the device you're using. Should work fine on computers and ipads - but yes PDF is easier is to view in one go but no PDF for the interactive chart which is perhaps the most valuable aspect for many

What I see is a chart that is like 3" wide and 20" tall, so I have to scroll 3 pages down to use the left/right scroll bar, and then scroll 3 pages up, so I can see the contents.  This in on a PC with a large 4K screen btw.  The layout could be slightly improved ... there seems to be some unused space left and right ...

 

Edited May 4, 2020 by xorbe

[Luc]

On 5/4/2020 at 4:14 PM, xorbe said:

What I see is a chart that is like 3" wide and 20" tall, so I have to scroll 3 pages down to use the left/right scroll bar, and then scroll 3 pages up, so I can see the contents.  This in on a PC with a large 4K screen btw.  The layout could be slightly improved ... there seems to be some unused space left and right ...

 

Hey, thanks for the feedback! Sorry, seems I made you trudge through a swamp to get the lotus, but you've helped prevent others getting their boots muddy. Have taken your advice and changed it round to make things much clearer and replaced the 1st excel chart with jpegs. Hope that's better now, any more ideas let me know! Thanks again

https://peacemakerfoundation.com/2015/07/06/transportables-portable-transport-tools/

[Luc]

Have updated the comparison chart, to include some extra factors, more transport tools, and made a quick video to show how it works https://greentransportideas.org/2020/07/27/transportables-portable-transport-tools/

If you don't like wading through text you can start with the video. Sorry I've not added that many ewheels (Eucs) yet

 

Edited September 5, 2022 by Luc

[atdlzpae]

@LucJust some nitpicks about the chart:

• I'd love to see Urmo with a handle test on any kind of curb. Definitely not 10/10, and definitely worse than EUC's considering the size of the wheel.
• Only 4 for vehicle control for an EUC's? Iota Trax (which is basically an EUC with a tiny, tiny wheel) gets 5? If it's "ease of riding" then make a separate category for it. IMO EUC's handle better than a bicycle, except for breaking.
• EUC's should have handling of 10 because of trolley handle. You can just go inside a shop with it. An electric scooter you have to leave outside. And things like Urmo you have to backpack, much less convenient than even a 30kg EUC.
• Charging time scores make no sense. EcoReco XS gets 2 points for charging at 4.6km/h (21km in 4.5h), while KS16 gets 0 points for charging twice as fast at 11.6km/h (70km in 6h)?

Edited September 5, 2022 by atdlzpae

[Luc]

On 9/5/2022 at 4:59 AM, atdlzpae said:

@LucJust some nitpicks about the chart:

• I'd love to see Urmo with a handle test on any kind of curb. Definitely not 10/10, and definitely worse than EUC's considering the size of the wheel.
• Only 4 for vehicle control for an EUC's? Iota Trax (which is basically an EUC with a tiny, tiny wheel) gets 5? If it's "ease of riding" then make a separate category for it. IMO EUC's handle better than a bicycle, except for breaking.
• EUC's should have handling of 10 because of trolley handle. You can just go inside a shop with it. An electric scooter you have to leave outside. And things like Urmo you have to backpack, much less convenient than even a 30kg EUC.
• Charging time scores make no sense. EcoReco XS gets 2 points for charging at 4.6km/h (21km in 4.5h), while KS16 gets 0 points for charging twice as fast at 11.6km/h (70km in 6h)?

Hi, Thanks for your comments appreciate that. And sorry for the very very late reply.  The scores are based on the criteria shown at the base of each column, none of the numbers are based on my hunches or feelings.  
1. Urmo up and down curbs is a 10 because of the handle which allows you to lift as you step up. With most eucs I take it you have to roll up with a little semi-hop which takes more skill to do.  But if you feel I should change the criteria (scoring system for up and down curbs let me know). 

2. Since making the video (and before seeing your comment) I added criteria so that Iota trax now gets 4 for vehicle control while the eucs listed get 4.5 (a higher score).

3. The eucs score high on portability if that's what you mean by handling, but you don't always have to fold an electric scooter, the handle is extremely convenient for pushing around which is why they often score highly as well for portability. I often do my shopping with an electric scooter, very easy to carry around as well if you have a light one. And the Urmo folds the moment it is lifted up so you hold it like a briefcase - again very convenient (no need for a backpack). 

4. I think I see what you mean about the charging time scores. The extra points for greater distances covered are in the range section- so the Kingsong 16 for example already gets its points for range. But that's an interesting idea you've raised -  proportionate distance gained per hour of charging. Hmm nice.  The problem is stated charging times can vary and then they can bring out new chargers. Let me know if you have any other comments - thanks again for your feedback.
Best wishes

[atdlzpae]

12 hours ago, Luc said:

1. Urmo up and down curbs is a 10 because of the handle which allows you to lift as you step up. With most eucs I take it you have to roll up with a little semi-hop which takes more skill to do.  But if you feel I should change the criteria (scoring system for up and down curbs let me know).

By that logic electric scooters and unicycles also should get 10/10 as you can just lift it as you step up.

12 hours ago, Luc said:

2. Since making the video (and before seeing your comment) I added criteria so that Iota trax now gets 4 for vehicle control while the eucs listed get 4.5 (a higher score).

Still ridiculous, as Urmo with a handle got 6 somehow. And I'm 100% certain OneWheelers would disagree OneWheels handle worse than Inventist or Epikgo.
Giving 4 points just for a handle is ridiculous, this way S1000 SuperRide (absolutely awful machine) would get better score than KS-16S.

12 hours ago, Luc said:

3. The eucs score high on portability if that's what you mean by handling, but you don't always have to fold an electric scooter, the handle is extremely convenient for pushing around which is why they often score highly as well for portability. I often do my shopping with an electric scooter, very easy to carry around as well if you have a light one. And the Urmo folds the moment it is lifted up so you hold it like a briefcase - again very convenient (no need for a backpack). 

Holding 7kg during your whole shopping is more convenient than pushing KS-16S?
Pushing an EUC (even a 30kg one) is way easier than pushing a scooter - single center of mass (instead of two wheels) and the engine actually does 95% of work for you.
So basing it on weight instead of how it handles misses the point completely.

And what's up with Zoom Stryder Pro getting 8.5 points and Xiaomi M365 getting 1 point despite the same mass?

 

 

And lastly, something completely different - IMO EUC's don't deserve 10/10 in off-road conditions. And especially not the tiny wheels you have listed there.

 

 

It's obvious you never rode half of these machines. And these scores are based only on your fantasy, not on experience or some objective measure (ex. opinions of expert riders). I'm only replying because I have fun with it's ridiculousness, your chart has zero real value.

Edited September 26, 2022 by atdlzpae

[Luc]

 

 ''electric scooters and unicycles also should get 10/10 as you can just lift it as you step up''.

There's a tiny adjustment made to cater for the length of the device, as you lift it up over a kerb and step up. You have to approach at a sidelong angle - hence extra point for one wheel devices or one wheel in line of motion. So I disagree. 

''Urmo with a handle got 6 somehow. And I'm 100% certain OneWheelers would disagree OneWheels handle worse than Inventist or Epikgo.''

Inventist is the name of a company not a transport tool but I see your point, I have been on a Onewheel and numerous hoverboards and would also regard the Onewheel as having slightly better control, I can take another look at that category and the scoring methods - perhaps an extra point for wheels over 10cm in width etc. 

 ''Giving 4 points just for a handle is ridiculous''

Disagree, I would say that the handle is worth at least four points - from experience. 

''Holding 7kg during your whole shopping is more convenient than pushing KS-16S?''
No I didn't say that. I said that carrying it is an option but you can very very easily push most scooters - I put my shopping basket off the handle and push it in the shop. Works like a dream and have been doing this for years.

''basing it on weight instead of how it handles misses the point completely.''

No it doesn't. Weight, convenience of rolling it around and size are all factors in portability. 

''And what's up with Zoom Stryder Pro getting 8.5 points and Xiaomi M365 getting 1 point despite the same mass?''

That's because of the size that the Xiaomi folds up into far greater than that of the Zoom stryder which influences the portablity. However; I agree that the score is too different so I may lessen importance of size compared to handling in terms of portability. Thanks for the idea. 

''IMO EUC's don't deserve 10/10 in off-road conditions. And especially not the tiny wheels you have listed there.''

OK thanks, may change the scoring method then to give them a slightly lower score.  
 

''It's obvious you never rode half of these machines. And these scores are based only on your fantasy, not on experience or some objective measure (ex. opinions of expert riders). I'm only replying because I have fun with it's ridiculousness, your chart has zero real value.''

Have ridden a fair number of these over many years - and have used the chart to guide my choices in terms of what to buy. So far it has worked very well. Not owned a euc yet though so you're partly right in terms of the eucs. It's a work in progress, but I believe it does have value.  It seems I'm still waiting for the first person to truly see and understand that potential value. 

 

 

[Luc]

Given the lacklustre reception it's received so far I'm not planning on sharing it here ever again unless requested but here is the final iteration of the decision matrix evaluating the various transport tools. Have followed some of the above suggestions & made it more understandable  https://greentransportideas.org/2020/07/27/transportables-portable-transport-tools/ It's for anyone trying to decide which transport tool to buy & probably requires about 5 to 10 minutes to understand how it works & see that there is in fact value in it. On another note have just learned about these! Woohoo!

just realised that when I pasted it before the link was not allowed so didn't display. Here's another video 

 

Edited February 22, 2023 by Luc