Funky Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 8 people alone on this topic have said smaller/lighter wheel.. Brings a tear to one's eye. I'm so happy, that i'm not alone after-all. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xiiijojjo Posted September 6 Author Share Posted September 6 44 minutes ago, Funky said: 8 people alone on this topic have said smaller/lighter wheel.. Brings a tear to one's eye. I'm so happy, that i'm not alone after-all. I'm not personally interested in owning such a wheel but I have to admit that making a small wheel is the smartest business move at this point, taking their existing lineup and that of competitors into account. But even if I'm not interested in owning that wheel I understand how much it would boost the Leaperkim market share not just for small EUC but for EUC in general as it would help getting the name out there for riders who are disinterested in the current lineup. If they price this smaller wheel correctly and it becomes a commercial success it could have huge long-term benefits for what Leaperkim can do/afford to do in future EUC releases. Releasing such a wheel could give them the profits needed for engineering something to knock the Lynx off the throne. I think the market for small-medium wheels in the biggest one. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 (edited) 28 minutes ago, xiiijojjo said: I'm not personally interested in owning such a wheel but I have to admit that making a small wheel is the smartest business move at this point, taking their existing lineup and that of competitors into account. But even if I'm not interested in owning that wheel I understand how much it would boost the Leaperkim market share not just for small EUC but for EUC in general as it would help getting the name out there for riders who are disinterested in the current lineup. If they price this smaller wheel correctly and it becomes a commercial success it could have huge long-term benefits for what Leaperkim can do/afford to do in future EUC releases. Releasing such a wheel could give them the profits needed for engineering something to knock the Lynx off the throne. I think the market for small-medium wheels in the biggest one. I like imagine that most people buy single wheel and use it many years. Not so called hobbyists, who wanna get the newest and best every single year and have over dozen wheels in their collection. I also would like to think people who gonna be buying one wheel and use it over many years will not look at price firstly. They gonna buy - what they actually need. Is the wheels build quality good enough. Is it fast enough. Will it do everything they need true daily use. For some (me) having a great carry/trolley handle alone is a selling point. (Most already know that on this forum..) And big enough tire. I don't care about voltage and overall speed. Heck i don't even care about battery size or suspension. I personally would gladly pay 2500$ for Falcon performance/type of a wheel built by Leaperkim, which is around 20kg heavy. Even without suspension. 2500$ over 5 years of use is nothing. They can even use that wheel for longer time. If it does everything they need and nothing better gets released. (Me and my 18xl.. Going strongly for 4 years already. Been looking for new wheel past 2 years. As i wan't something lighter, but same top speed, which has also somewhat better build quality.) Edited September 6 by Funky 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slippyfeet Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 I’m not holding my breath over anything LeaperKim offering that will be under 75lb or a 12” rim. The issue will likely be newer riders that start big and try smaller wheels will inevitably feel limited by its capabilities, likely why their current lineup has overlaps, whether it be weight and/or tire size. I’d love to be wrong, but for now they bank from power users. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpong Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 1 hour ago, Funky said: .., I personally would gladly pay 2500$ for Falcon performance/type of a wheel built by Leaperkim, which is around 20kg heavy. Even without suspension. 2500$ over 5 years of use is nothing, ... i used my tesla V2 for 5 yrs with no probs other than a few mishaps.... it would be a gamble on leaperkims part. but if they ignore the small euc sector, they could be missing out on alot of sales in a totally different consumer market. they have the manufacturing ability to make smaller eucs so its not for lack of resources. im guessing they think they can survive by simply making large fast EXPENSIVE eucs. IMO, boring and shows a total lack of foresight with regards to the euc community in general. i would be going out on a limb and make an observation that perhaps, if leaperkim were a european based company with manufacturing in europe as well, they may have a totally different outlook on providing eucs for the community. as a european based firm, they would have a less obtuse view on the euc market, and would combine and balance performance requirements with practical requirements. it would be an interesting premise to throw around to say the least. i have nothing against the chinese manufacturer, but leaperkims focus on what the euc rider wants in a machine is rather thin and narrow and doesnt really impress me as presenting a broad range of choices for an euc buyer. i own a lynx and leaperkim should be damn lucky i purchased it. its a great euc, but there are other choices out there i could have chosen that would meet my riding requirements as well. i chose the lynx because of its good combination of power, suspension and BMS. but that doesnt change my mind about leaperkim's selection of eucs and how it reflects on them. their narrow focus on high priced models, large, heavy, powerful, and well suspended only serves to pigeon hole them into a narrow sector. as i already said earlier on, it would be in leaperkims best interests to showcase other euc models that are based on totally different design criteria - take a gamble and make a small, well designed and highly portable euc ! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WheelGoodTime Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 3 hours ago, Funky said: 8 people alone on this topic have said smaller/lighter wheel.. Brings a tear to one's eye. I'm so happy, that i'm not alone after-all. Don't get me wrong, LK isn't going to be releasing anything even close to your requested specs. They've said before that they have no interest in developing a truly small wheel like the kind you want (in every thread...). However the patton is the next logical step for them to refresh. That wheel has loads of power for its size, but demand for it has completely dried up because of the lynx and the fact that those wheels weigh the same. If LK releases a feature-rich, 70-80 lbs update to the Patton, then it'll sell extremely well. 😊 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 (edited) Make few models for very big $$$ and sell them for somewhat good profits. Have less warranty case - because you are selling only top notch wheels. Also spending less man hours on fewer wheels as possible. 101 of any agency who is in for the money.. I see nothing wrong with that. Why would they wanna start making 1/3 of the profits and spend extra man hours on not so profitable journey.. Edited September 6 by Funky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WheelGoodTime Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 (edited) 1 hour ago, bpong said: i used my tesla V2 for 5 yrs with no probs other than a few mishaps.... it would be a gamble on leaperkims part. but if they ignore the small euc sector, they could be missing out on alot of sales in a totally different consumer market. they have the manufacturing ability to make smaller eucs so its not for lack of resources. im guessing they think they can survive by simply making large fast EXPENSIVE eucs. IMO, boring and shows a total lack of foresight with regards to the euc community in general. i would be going out on a limb and make an observation that perhaps, if leaperkim were a european based company with manufacturing in europe as well, they may have a totally different outlook on providing eucs for the community. as a european based firm, they would have a less obtuse view on the euc market, and would combine and balance performance requirements with practical requirements. it would be an interesting premise to throw around to say the least. i have nothing against the chinese manufacturer, but leaperkims focus on what the euc rider wants in a machine is rather thin and narrow and doesnt really impress me as presenting a broad range of choices for an euc buyer. i own a lynx and leaperkim should be damn lucky i purchased it. its a great euc, but there are other choices out there i could have chosen that would meet my riding requirements as well. i chose the lynx because of its good combination of power, suspension and BMS. but that doesnt change my mind about leaperkim's selection of eucs and how it reflects on them. their narrow focus on high priced models, large, heavy, powerful, and well suspended only serves to pigeon hole them into a narrow sector. as i already said earlier on, it would be in leaperkims best interests to showcase other euc models that are based on totally different design criteria - take a gamble and make a small, well designed and highly portable euc ! LK has expressed in the past that day want to remain a small, boutique manufacturer. They don't seem to have the desire to grow in size as a company, and they are perfectly happy to pump out their 200 EUC per month or so, which is what I heard is there maximum capacity presently. Since they are limiting themselves voluntarily in this way, they can't make a bazillion new EUC models in the same manner that Begode does. They have to create a product that has the highest likelihood of commercial success, and stick with it. I personally wish they would increase in size and in production capacity, but that's just the capitalist in me speaking... Edited September 6 by WheelGoodTime 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 (edited) 18 minutes ago, WheelGoodTime said: Don't get me wrong, LK isn't going to be releasing anything even close to your requested specs. They've said before that they have no interest in developing a truly small wheel like the kind you want (in every thread...). However the patton is the next logical step for them to refresh. That wheel has loads of power for its size, but demand for it has completely dried up because of the lynx and the fact that those wheels weigh the same. If LK releases a feature-rich, 70-80 lbs update to the Patton, then it'll sell extremely well. 😊 Yeah i know that very well.. And still people like me will never buy that Patton even if it was 65lbs or for that matter even 60lbs. We don't need range/speed. Especially me - who is riding on sidewalks and have very small cities, short commutes. FYI: My new wheel budget is well over 7000$ From this moment.. I just don't see anything worth my money/time. Just shows how much i don't want/need heavy wheel. Or a second wheel. Also when i first time saw that Fatton. A 16" in that weight.. No thanks. KS16X over it any day of a year. What one can do that other can't... Both do the exactly same thing. Edited September 6 by Funky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slippyfeet Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 (edited) 24 minutes ago, WheelGoodTime said: LK has expressed in the past that day want to remain a bl small, boutique manufacturer. They don't seem to have the desire to grow in size as a company, and they are perfectly happy to pump out their 200 EUC per month or so, which is what I heard is there maximum capacity presently. Since they are limiting themselves voluntarily in this way, they can't make a bazillion new EUC models in the same manner that Begode does. They have to create a product that has the highest likelihood of commercial success, and stick with it. I personally wish they would increase in size and in production capacity, but that's just the capitalist in me speaking... Also realistically speaking, their “slowest” wheel is 45mph from 4+years ago so that is their rock bottom benchmark. They won’t make anything weaker than a Patton/shermax, so expect everything to be relatively large until their engineers find viability in pumping those speeds in a smaller wheel. Edited September 6 by slippyfeet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpong Posted September 6 Share Posted September 6 (edited) 2 hours ago, slippyfeet said: ..., They won’t make anything weaker than a Patton/shermax, so expect everything to be relatively large until their engineers find viability in pumping those speeds in a smaller wheel. slippyfeet, IMO, the small euc is not about getting high speed out of a smaller euc...its about fulfilling other requirements like portability, and small form factor, and low maintenance... Edited September 6 by bpong 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slippyfeet Posted September 7 Share Posted September 7 27 minutes ago, bpong said: slippyfeet, IMO, the small euc is not about getting high speed out of a smaller euc...its about fulfilling other requirements like portability, and small form factor, and low maintenance... Yup I’m all for that especially with the wheels in my staple, but just speculating the reputation held by the LeaperKim name I don’t see them under-spec’ing any wheel they made prior Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpong Posted September 7 Share Posted September 7 47 minutes ago, slippyfeet said: Yup I’m all for that especially with the wheels in my staple, but just speculating the reputation held by the LeaperKim name I don’t see them under-spec’ing any wheel they made prior I hav to agree with you on that. But from a business pov, they are foolish not to explore other euc classes because they hav a great product in one class. Things are always changing... if regulations change and laws are created to control eucs and force owners to purchase liabilty insurance, then leaperkim will be fucked (as will the other manufacturers). I hav now seen twice this year on my commute to work, pedestrians charging escooter riders for some infraction on the sidewalks. its just a matter of time when things change in our euc paradise....and this is in toronto, ontario.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted September 7 Share Posted September 7 (edited) 6 hours ago, bpong said: I hav now seen twice this year on my commute to work, pedestrians charging escooter riders for some infraction on the sidewalks. its just a matter of time when things change in our euc paradise....and this is in toronto, ontario.... Recently around my area, we ALL needed to register our e-scooters. (Same number plate as cars have..) Anything with 1000W motor and under. And with 25kph speed. (Anything over 1000W and 25kph could not be registered. Did people stop using their over 1000W and 25kph scooters? Ofc not.) Same for my EUC, i could not register even if i wanted. 2200W and 50kph speed. (I don't) So i don't care about any new laws, etc made.. I will keep riding the same way i have been for years. Edited September 7 by Funky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
litewave Posted September 7 Share Posted September 7 15 hours ago, bpong said: slippyfeet, IMO, the small euc is not about getting high speed out of a smaller euc...its about fulfilling other requirements like portability, and small form factor, and low maintenance... Ehh, why not do it all? We will get there soon. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted September 7 Share Posted September 7 (edited) 1 hour ago, litewave said: Ehh, why not do it all? We will get there soon. How soon is the question. Next 5 years soon, or when Gen A already are 6 feet under? Riding the high road to heaven. Edited September 7 by Funky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
litewave Posted September 7 Share Posted September 7 55 minutes ago, Funky said: How soon is the question. Next 5 years soon, or when Gen A already are 6 feet under? Riding the high road to heaven. EUCs have evolved very fast and have improved dramatically in the past 5 years. I think/hope the next batch of Falcon competitors will bring iterative improvements, adding more power and battery while maintaining or decreasing weight. The next leap forward will be facilitated by denser and safer batteries which are already in production for specific industries. Once a major battery manufacturer starts making general purpose cells using these new processes, some EUCs will start to use them. My guess is 3-4 years for next-gen 1, and another 2-3 for next-gen 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skampster Posted September 7 Share Posted September 7 Light small and fast, big problem they have to overcome is physics. There’s good reasons why fast wheels are big wheels, there’s no way in hell id ride 60+ kph on my Falcon or 16x if they could. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted September 7 Share Posted September 7 (edited) "Fast" is just a word.. For some 25kph is fast. For other 80kph is fast.. Falcon type of a wheel. Weight wise being 20-25kg max speed should be ~50kph - that's pretty good for it's size/weight. Smaller wheels aren't been made for speed in first place. It's their ease of grabbing and tossing around without any effort. (Being portable while powered off.) People who are ridding best 5-10km daily and share path with pedestrians, anything over 40kph is already to fast. And by law you are meant to go max 25kph anyways. But i don't really follow that rule. Around people i like to go from 5-25kph, but same time without anyone around would like to go 40kph. Edited September 7 by Funky 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alcatraz Posted September 8 Share Posted September 8 3 hours ago, Funky said: For some 25kph is fast. For other 80kph is fast.. Good point. People often forget we live in vastly different places. If I bought a Lynx and rode it where I live it would be ridiculous. None of my destinations have any roads faster than 60km/h and cars often drive slower than that. I average 35-40km/h wherever I go and I'm often slowed down by surrounding traffic. What many forum users need is not at all what I need. Not even close. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted September 8 Share Posted September 8 14 hours ago, alcatraz said: Good point. People often forget we live in vastly different places. If I bought a Lynx and rode it where I live it would be ridiculous. None of my destinations have any roads faster than 60km/h and cars often drive slower than that. I average 35-40km/h wherever I go and I'm often slowed down by surrounding traffic. What many forum users need is not at all what I need. Not even close. Same. Riding Lynx on sidewalks with pedestrians - No Thanks.. Don't get me wrong. If i didn't need to carry my wheel - it would be awesome to ride one even going slower. And with that big battery - i could literally charge it once a month. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacGyverCanada Posted September 8 Share Posted September 8 8 minutes ago, Funky said: Same. Riding Lynx on sidewalks with pedestrians - No Thanks.. That's the #1 reason why I don't own a Lynx right now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky Posted September 8 Share Posted September 8 Watch now.. Some smart ass will comment: Emm actually that wheel isn't intended for that purpose in first place. Hurp-Durp. You don't say.. Tell manufacturers to make something like Lynx for that intended purpose then. So we all can be happy Leaperkim wheel enjoyers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skampster Posted September 8 Share Posted September 8 3 hours ago, Funky said: Riding Lynx on sidewalks with pedestrians - No Thanks. I ride both a Lynx, Sherman S and soon Sherman L around pedestrians on sidewalks (legal here) ain’t no difference between that and the Falcon/16x. Stop talking rubbish. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poker Posted September 8 Share Posted September 8 For a pedestrian a large wheel can come off as more intimidating, same as a full face helmet versus a light bicycle helmet 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.