Dylan Baker Posted December 2, 2022 Share Posted December 2, 2022 Howdy! I could only find posts about upgrading the suspension unit itself - nothing about upgrading the bolts or bearings. If there’s already a post about this, let me know… This is the second time I have blown out my suspension on my s18. Both times the components that failed were the bolts that connect the suspension linkages together. I keep my suspension inflated just below the max psi. When I checked the o-ring after this last suspension failure, it wasn’t fully bottomed out. I should probably upgrade the suspension unit itself regardless, since I’m definitely doing bigger jumps than this thing was designed to be able to handle. that being said, it seems like the weak point is actually the suspension bolts and bearings. Has anyone tried upgrading them to a higher grade of metal? I’m pretty sure they’re aluminum - correct me if I’m wrong. Steel or titanium should prevent the bolts from stripping as easily and if the bearing casing was steel or titanium they wouldn’t get crushed as easily. thoughts? Links to bolts/bearings if anyone has tried this? Thanks! Dylan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Brahan Seer Posted December 2, 2022 Share Posted December 2, 2022 This is the link you are looking for... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tawpie Posted December 2, 2022 Share Posted December 2, 2022 (edited) 5 hours ago, Dylan Baker said: the weak point is actually the suspension bolts and bearings. Has anyone tried upgrading them to a higher grade of metal? I’m pretty sure they’re aluminum - correct me if I’m wrong. I do not think you're wrong at all. Those bolts are called "binding bolts" and they got that name because they were developed to allow a printer of books to print a stack of paper, drill some holes in the stack, and bind them together. Because the bolt part is not the full length of the hollow 'nut' part, you could use the same bolt for different sized stacks of paper! But they were for holding paper together, not for hanging a suspension. I suspect that the stock and most Ali replacement bolts are paper binding bolts, not proper shoulder bolts (the name for bolts that are probably stronger is "shoulder bolt"), but shoulder bolts are difficult to find in the lengths we need. By definition, hollow things aren't terribly strong, and making the hollow part longer doesn't help. I would drop into a mountain bike shop and chat up the techs there. Find a shop with suspension geeks. I'd bet they know of a source for stronger fasteners, or could Mcgyver up something that's stronger. They will certainly be able to advise you on many options to spend hundreds on a different shock. If you do find a source for stronger bolts, please do share! Edited December 2, 2022 by Tawpie 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted December 2, 2022 Share Posted December 2, 2022 17 minutes ago, Tawpie said: Those bolts are called "binding bolts" and they got that name because they were developed to allow a printer of books to print a stack of paper, drill some holes in the stack, and bind them together. 26 minutes ago, Tawpie said: By definition, hollow things aren't terribly strong, and making the hollow part longer doesn't help. Thanks. Absolutely astounding. Bolts, designed for binding stacks of paper together.......are being used to fasten suspension. From google search: https://www.fastenright.com/general-fixings/low-profile-socket-sex-bolts-metric/sb006 Often known as Binding Post Screws, Chicago Screws, Interscrews or Binder Screws, these Socket Sex Bolts are used for architectural applications and also for fastening sample books, albums etc. Male screw threads into internally Threaded Barrel Nut (Sex Bolt). ________________________________________ Customers are placing their trust in manufacturers' expertise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redfoxdude Posted December 2, 2022 Share Posted December 2, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Paul A said: Bolts, designed for binding stacks of paper together.......are being used to fasten suspension. I'm not so sure they are literally paper binding bolts, but the unusually long length that is used for our EUC linkages perhaps makes shoulder bolts a better solution, or at least not aluminum binding bolts. These ones are some kind of steel according to the listing:https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832179877555.html Edited December 2, 2022 by redfoxdude 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted December 2, 2022 Share Posted December 2, 2022 4 minutes ago, redfoxdude said: the ones used for mountain bike pivots are not literally book binding bolts, they are suspension pivot bolts designed for this new purpose. Perhaps there are binding bolts designed for this new purpose, utilized in mountain bikes. Thread originator has stated the EUC suspension bolts have failed twice. Have they been subjected to unreasonable forces, or are sub standard to the requirements? There might be similar discussions on other threads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redfoxdude Posted December 2, 2022 Share Posted December 2, 2022 16 minutes ago, Paul A said: Perhaps there are binding bolts designed for this new purpose, utilized in mountain bikes. Thread originator has stated the EUC suspension bolts have failed twice. Have they been subjected to unreasonable forces, or are sub standard to the requirements? There might be similar discussions on other threads. There are indeed. For example, some from Cannondale. However, in the typical MTB solutions, there is not such a large distance between the linkage pivot and the shock's pivot. The wider distance between the supported ends and the load from the shock in the middle means there will be more deflection to address, so a stronger material is ideal/necessary. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul A Posted December 2, 2022 Share Posted December 2, 2022 2 hours ago, Tawpie said: If you do find a source for stronger bolts, please do share! Thanks RFD. @Tawpie Please refer to above post/link from RedFoxDude regarding Cannondale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewB Posted December 2, 2022 Share Posted December 2, 2022 52 minutes ago, redfoxdude said: I'm not so sure they are literally paper binding bolts, but the unusually long length that is used for our EUC linkages perhaps makes shoulder bolts a better solution, or at least not aluminum binding bolts. These ones are some kind of steel according to the listing:https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832179877555.html One would think they would tell you what they are made of, but that looks promising. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewB Posted December 2, 2022 Share Posted December 2, 2022 I would think the first thing to do is find out how much @Dylan Bakerweighs. I, for example, am in the sub-130-pound range, so I don't think I could bend one of those if you threw me out of a fourth story window with my feet strapped to an S18 and a cinder block tied around my neck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tawpie Posted December 2, 2022 Share Posted December 2, 2022 I got replacements for my S22 on Ali from the DELT SAKE BIKE Store, they're ferrous (attracted to a magnet) and say "MTB/ROAD Meet EN/BS1/CPSC Standard" whatever that means. It could mean anything and likely means nothing. https://a.aliexpress.com/_mqiAEhQ 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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