Riding the beeps

[WattsWheelhouse]

I live in a rural area with little traffic and long roads, and I tend to ride my sherman max at relatively high speeds for long stretches. Is riding constant beeps at over 38-40 mph just life with a sherman? It feels a bit like the "boy who cried wolf", as I'm quite used to the beeps now and I have no idea how close I am to the wheel's limit.

Is there a better way than the wheel's beeps to be alerted of the headroom left? I admit I'm not too familiar with darkness bot, but I do have it downloaded. 

[Fab]

I ride the Sherman and noticed it has different kind of beeps. I assume that 1 beep means 30% left, 2 fast consecutive beeps less than 30, 3 fast beeps even less than that.

I am not willing to test up to how many fast beeps you can go

[WattsWheelhouse]

Oh interesting! I've only encountered the single beeping. 

[Tawpie]

In general, there are three app settable alarms that for most wheels (I'm not familiar with Sherman) will beep once per second at the first alarm, twice for the second and three or more when you hit the third alarm. The beep behavior varies per manufacturer and may vary between models. It gives you a way to set things up the way you like personally. My KS wheels are set to 2 mph under max for the third alarm, 3 under max for the second and 4 under max for the first. So when it's single beeping, I have 4 mph of headroom which on a KS wheel isn't a lot so it's time to back off. But it's probably ok for me to ride single and perhaps double beeps if the road is nice and smooth and I'm not going uphill at all.

You can try them out by setting them to some low number so you know what they sound like, and then reset them to taste.

It's funny... people turn around for the beeps but don't seem to pay attention to anything else. I've been tempted to set the first alarm to something like 10 mph so I'm basically always single beeping and use that for AVAS, but haven't gotten around to it. Beeping does get people's attention for some reason and I'm not always wanting that much attention!

Edited September 30, 2022 by Tawpie

[WattsWheelhouse]

My gf has a 16x, and the app is very useful. The sherman doesn't have a companion app other than the firmware updater that I know of. The wheel beeps pretty loudly. But with a full face helmet, it could be better. Since opening this thread, I've looked at past rides in darknessbot and seen 90+% pwm, which I would imagine is flirting with disaster. Even so, I've only heard single beeping from the wheel, so I feel like I'm getting mixed signals. Maybe I'm actually not even close to the limit, but bumps in the road are putting it into beep territory. 

Edited September 30, 2022 by WattsWheelhouse

[Mayhem]

On 9/30/2022 at 4:09 PM, WattsWheelhouse said:

My gf has a 16x, and the app is very useful. The sherman doesn't have a companion app other than the firmware updater that I know of. The wheel beeps pretty loudly. But with a full face helmet, it could be better. Since opening this thread, I've looked at past rides in darknessbot and seen 90+% pwm, which I would imagine is flirting with disaster. Even so, I've only heard single beeping from the wheel, so I feel like I'm getting mixed signals. Maybe I'm actually not even close to the limit, but bumps in the road are putting it into beep territory. 

Have you calibrated the pwm on darkness bot?? It needs to be calibrated with your wheel at 100% charge. If you haven’t done that your readings are incorrect approx (7-10%) You also need to do speed correction calibration. All speed in the app are inflated by (8-9%) by default. 
 

Sherman starts to beep at 70% factory pwm vs gotways 80% pwm. So for example if you have all alarms set to off and you reach the factory pwm alarm you will hear 5 consecutive beeps. If your only hearing 1 beep what your hearing is your first speed alarm. 
 

The closer your pwm is to 100% the closer you are to cutting out. Also keep in mind as your battery level goes down your pwm will increase higher, earlier. Example at 80% battery you can achieve 100% pwm 10 mph earlier than at full battery. 

Edited October 6, 2022 by Mayhem

[Chriull]

On 9/30/2022 at 10:09 PM, WattsWheelhouse said:

16x

 

8 hours ago, Mayhem said:

Have you calibrated the pwm on darkness bot??

Kingsong wheels report pwm % (inverter_load) since "ages" natively - so there should be no need to calibrate anything. Darknessbot should use this value and not calculate/estimate as with other wheels not reporting this value (sherman/begode)?

@WattsWheelhouse - if you have some android phone you could try EUCWorld and compare the numbers - it shows safety margin which is 100 - pwm% as send from the controller. Most likely wheellog and/or native KS App should show pme%, too (maybe named inverter_load?)

On 9/30/2022 at 10:09 PM, WattsWheelhouse said:

seen 90+% pwm

At and above 88% there should be 4 consecutive beeps repeating.

8 hours ago, Mayhem said:

which I would imagine is flirting with disaster.

Definitely, or one has much luck and stands the overlean:

 

[Mayhem]

2 hours ago, Chriull said:

 

Kingsong wheels report pwm % (inverter_load) since "ages" natively - so there should be no need to calibrate anything. Darknessbot should use this value and not calculate/estimate as with other wheels not reporting this value (sherman/begode)?

@WattsWheelhouse - if you have some android phone you could try EUCWorld and compare the numbers - it shows safety margin which is 100 - pwm% as send from the controller. Most likely wheellog and/or native KS App should show pme%, too (maybe named inverter_load?)

At and above 88% there should be 4 consecutive beeps repeating.

Definitely, or one has much luck and stands the overlean:

 

The op was talking about riding beeps Sherman max though not 16x. That’s what my response is geared towards
 

Yea kingsong pwm is the more accurately reported as they provide the info where other manufacturer don’t but in my experience it still needed calibration in the app. (16x & 18L) Now it did require less calibration to be accurate compared to a gotway wheel but it still wasn’t 100% accurate until I adjusted it…. 
 

Best way to check if anyone is uncertain if it’s properly calibrated. Do a lift test at full charge and check your pwm chart. If your wheels max pwm is above 100% on the chart it needs to be calibrated. 

Edited October 7, 2022 by Mayhem

[Chriull]

1 hour ago, Mayhem said:

The op was talking about riding beeps Sherman max though not 16x. That’s what my response is geared towards

My fault - i saw the mentioning of the 16x and ignored the sherman 

1 hour ago, Mayhem said:

Yea kingsong pwm is the more accurately reported as they provide the info where other manufacturer don’t but in my experience it still needed calibration in the app. (16x & 18L) Now it did require less calibration to be accurate compared to a gotway wheel but it still wasn’t 100% accurate until I adjusted it…. 
 

Best way to check if anyone is uncertain if it’s properly calibrated. Do a lift test at full charge and check your pwm chart. If your wheels max pwm is above 100% on the chart it needs to be calibrated. 

I would _not_ recommend calibrating kingsongs natively reported pwm% as this should directly be the "relative opening time" of the mosfets. Even if somehow internaly in firmware this value exceeds 100% (by for example PID overshoot) the 100% opening time cannot physically be exceeded. So by "calibrating" one looses safety margin.

For begode/shermans/etc were pwm is calculated/estimated by tables/function from other reported values calibration sjould make sense. But this values should be used with care anyhow!

[WattsWheelhouse]

Thanks for the helpful information!