V11 with a Michelin City Pro 80/90 14

[Vatherian]

Hi folks,

The team I bought my V11 from has it in for some repairs and there's an opportunity to change out the tire. I had seen good reviews of the Michelin City pro, but can't see if it's been installed on a V11.

My biggest issue with the stock V11 is its tendency to follow lines.

I found a couple of variations:

Michelin City Pro 80/90-14 Road Scooter Front & Rear Tyre (thsmoto.co.nz)

Michelin City Pro - Scooter Retro Tyre Range (hastingshonda.co.nz)

 

Would anyone have experience with these, or could comment on the likely chance of success if I order one of them for the reseller to attempt on the V11?

 

We're in different cities and getting tires in NZ can be tricky so hope I might be able to get some info from the good folks here before I take a stab at it.

 

Thanks!

 

[fbhb]

The Michelin City Pro in 80/90-14 comes up quite wide on a 40mm wide rim (78mm+ for me), so you may find it is too wide to allow enough clearance for the V11's shell.  I have the same size City Pro fitted to my Sherman and found it to clear just fine on that wheel, even though it's actually wider than the stock Kenda 262.

This topic from another forum member has some good information on the City Pro in the smaller size of 70/90-14, which may prove to be a better fit for the V11:   

 

[EMA]

13 hours ago, Vatherian said:

My biggest issue with the stock V11 is its tendency to follow lines

keep in mind that all MC has this tendency too becouse they are stiffer, the tire that do not follow lines at all is the knobby

[Vatherian]

18 hours ago, fbhb said:

The Michelin City Pro in 80/90-14 comes up quite wide on a 40mm wide rim (78mm+ for me), so you may find it is too wide to allow enough clearance for the V11's shell.  I have the same size City Pro fitted to my Sherman and found it to clear just fine on that wheel, even though it's actually wider than the stock Kenda 262.

This topic from another forum member has some good information on the City Pro in the smaller size of 70/90-14, which may prove to be a better fit for the V11:   

 

Thank you for the advice.

I ordered the City pro yesterday - I also have a Sherman Max on order - so I guess if the V11 is a total no go it can at least go onto that.

How do you find it on the Sherman? I'm not really into offroading mostly tarmac maybe a little grass if I'm crossing a field or something.

 

Also, Howdy fellow Kiwi! No one else I've seen around here on one as yet.

[digithom]

On 6/3/2022 at 7:30 AM, Vatherian said:

Thank you for the advice.

I ordered the City pro yesterday - I also have a Sherman Max on order - so I guess if the V11 is a total no go it can at least go onto that.

How do you find it on the Sherman? I'm not really into offroading mostly tarmac maybe a little grass if I'm crossing a field or something.

 

Also, Howdy fellow Kiwi! No one else I've seen around here on one as yet.

I would also like to install a mc tire on my V11...
Anny update on your City Pro 80/90-14 on your V11 ?

Edited June 20, 2022 by digithom

[Vatherian]

17 hours ago, digithom said:

I would also like to install a mc tire on my V11...
Anny update on your City Pro 80/90-14 on your V11 ?

Hiya,

The wheel is still being worked on by the team I bought it from. Their feedback was that it *just* fit. Though they haven't yet assembled it and taken a ride so far as I'm aware.

 

I'm currently waiting on them to finish work on the V11 and hopefully have a Sherman Max in before I'll make the trip over to see them and pick up the wheel. I'll update on anything I find out.

It's possible that a 70/90 might be an easier install? Though I'm not experienced with tyres!

[fbhb]

28 minutes ago, Vatherian said:

The wheel is still being worked on by the team I bought it from. Their feedback was that it *just* fit. Though they haven't yet assembled it and taken a ride so far as I'm aware.

The Michelin City Pro 80/90-14 even fitted to a 40mm wide rim will still come up quite wide, especially on the V11, where there may well be issues with it rubbing inside the wheel well when ridden. 

My observation is based specifically upon my fitting the same tyre to my V1 Sherman (40mm wide rim), where it actually comes up wider than the OG Kenda 262 knobby, but fortunately still has plenty of clearance on that wheel and so No rubbing at all!

A narrower version of the City Pro may very well work better for the V11, should you find clearance is an issue.

[Funky]

6 hours ago, Vatherian said:

It's possible that a 70/90 might be an easier install? Though I'm not experienced with tyres!

70/90 - is VERY, VERY small tire. It's smaller than 18x2.5 tire! The height alone from where rim/tire meet is ~50mm. Even 18x2.5" tire has ~55mm.

80/80 has ~58mm height.

80/90 has ~64mm height.

From where rim/tire meets.

I would never want 70/90 tire, because it's so short - you need more psi to not damage the rim. Because of that ~50mm height. Also it will be more harsh ride.

Edited June 21, 2022 by Funky

[digithom]

On 6/21/2022 at 12:02 PM, Funky said:

I would never want 70/90 tire, because it's so short - you need more psi to not damage the rim. Because of that ~50mm height. Also it will be more harsh ride.

As you know I have a M/C 70/90 street tire on my ks18xl, believe me, it is not a matter of rim damage because M/C tire is really hard even at low pressure and the rim is more protected than with stock tire even if it is 5mm less, the problem is the riding comfort, it is hard like wood.
 

Edited June 23, 2022 by digithom
syntax mistake

[Funky]

2 hours ago, digithom said:

As you know I have a M/C 70/90 street tire on my ks18xl, believe me, it is not a matter of rim damage because M/C tire is really hard even at low pressure and the rim is more protected than with stock tire even if it is 5mm less, the problem is the riding comfort, it is hard like wood.
 

And as you know i have K66 80/80-14 installed on mine 18xl.  And having 58mm height vs 50 is worlds difference. Also M/C tire.

What i was trying to say - someone who has originally 18x3" tire. Going to 70/90 is BIG i mean BIG-BIG mistake.

Edited June 23, 2022 by Funky

[digithom]

1 hour ago, Funky said:

And as you know i have K66 80/80-14 installed on mine 18xl.  And having 58mm height vs 50 is worlds difference. Also M/C tire.

 

Anyway, don't forget that k66 is not properly a street tire, due to it's tall thread it would be soft even if it was 50mm

 

Quote

What i was trying to say - someone who has originally 18x3" tire. Going to 70/90 is BIG i mean BIG-BIG mistake.

on this I agree with you, if you have a stock 18x3" you have the space to fit a 80/80 or better a 80/90, so, why choose a smaller one ?!

 

[Funky]

1 hour ago, digithom said:

Anyway, don't forget that k66 is not properly a street tire, due to it's tall thread it would be soft even if it was 50mm

Still better than 1488.  Thread is only ~5mm tall. You said it the best about street tires "it is hard like wood" So i would say K66 wins by being "softer" than "real" street tire, but same time more robust than regular euc tires. Great middle ground. When i went from stock 1488 to K66, i didn't notice much change at all.

Also comparing K66 to 1488 i would 100% say it's much harder, than that flimsy rubber 1488.

At your weight "softer" tires would be better.  It would feel better.

1 hour ago, digithom said:

on this I agree with you, if you have a stock 18x3" you have the space to fit a 80/80 or better a 80/90, so, why choose a smaller one ?!

The guy upwards in post post mentioned 70/90 for V11. That's why i said - what i said..  

[Yook]

For what its worth, i stuck a "Michelin Pilot Street 2 Motorcycle Tyre Front Or Rear - 80/90-14 46S" onto a v11 a month back. 
I'm new to EUC'ing, but its F'in amazing. Doesn't want to "fall over" off centre due to more even shape than factory. Is dead silent, SO quiet. Its stiffer so need less tire PSI, this makes it a bit harder to ride at slower speeds. I adapted and like i said, I'm 3months into this. 

That said, its winter now and its slippery as balls on wet dirt, mud or grass. I'm now scouring the web, looking for a knobby to put on it.

[Critzlez]

On 6/21/2022 at 3:02 AM, Funky said:

70/90 - is VERY, VERY small tire. It's smaller than 18x2.5 tire! The height alone from where rim/tire meet is ~50mm. Even 18x2.5" tire has ~55mm.

80/80 has ~58mm height.

80/90 has ~64mm height.

From where rim/tire meets.

I would never want 70/90 tire, because it's so short - you need more psi to not damage the rim. Because of that ~50mm height. Also it will be more harsh ride.

Just to note, but these heights are  wrong. Check here: https://tiresize.com/comparison/

 

70/90 is 64mm in sidewall height, 483mm total diameter. The other tire size numbers are also wrong. Plus, calculating manually would be 70 * .90 == 63mm

I measured by 18x3 CST 1488 tire, and it's exactly 19 inches in diameter, which is around 483mm total diameter. It wouldn't be too small but actually the exact measurement of 18x3

Edited August 13 by Critzlez

[Funky]

16 hours ago, Critzlez said:

Just to note, but these heights are  wrong. Check here: https://tiresize.com/comparison/

 

70/90 is 64mm in sidewall height, 483mm total diameter. The other tire size numbers are also wrong. Plus, calculating manually would be 70 * .90 == 63mm

I measured by 18x3 CST 1488 tire, and it's exactly 19 inches in diameter, which is around 483mm total diameter. It wouldn't be too small but actually the exact measurement of 18x3

Height from rim... Not counting bead that is hidden under rim. (Yes 70/90 is 64mm i know that. But from rim it's around 50mm - not couting the hidden part. You didn't read my post, i said: From where rim/tire meets.

80/80 being 58mm is 100% right.  As i have measured it in real live... Not reading some websites and what people have said. I have it in my hands.... (Talking about Heidenau K66 80/80-14 tire.)

And that 80/90 also was K66.. I had asked few people to measure it - They even showed me photo. It was ~64mm in height from rim. (Sadly those links don't work anymore - i asked year ago.. Otherwise i would have posted an image showing it.)

I had CST C-1488 but in 18x2.5" size. It was ~475mm. K66 80/80-14 is 480mm on the mark. (~3-5mm difference if more psi in tire or less.. Also how new tire.. Tread worn off.)

 

I know these sizes mostly on K66 - as i was looking at 80/80 & 80/90 size to fit onto my ks18xl wheel. At the end i went with 80/80..

Edited August 14 by Funky

[Critzlez]

2 hours ago, Funky said:

Height from rim... Not counting bead that is hidden under rim. (Yes 70/90 is 64mm i know that. But from rim it's around 50mm - not couting the hidden part. You didn't read my post, i said: From where rim/tire meets.

80/80 being 58mm is 100% right.  As i have measured it in real live... Not reading some websites and what people have said. I have it in my hands.... (Talking about Heidenau K66 80/80-14 tire.)

And that 80/90 also was K66.. I had asked few people to measure it - They even showed me photo. It was ~64mm in height from rim. (Sadly those links don't work anymore - i asked year ago.. Otherwise i would have posted an image showing it.)

I had CST C-1488 but in 18x2.5" size. It was ~475mm. K66 80/80-14 is 480mm on the mark. (~3-5mm difference if more psi in tire or less.. Also how new tire.. Tread worn off.)

 

I know these sizes mostly on K66 - as i was looking at 80/80 & 80/90 size to fit onto my ks18xl wheel. At the end i went with 80/80..

Don't be rude about it man. I did read it; you didn't specifically say not counting the hidden part.

 

But even so, imo i wouldn't say it's too small unless you think 18x3 is also already small for you. 70/90 is the closest size to 18x3 compared to 80/90.  80/90 is a bigger difference to 18x3 than 70/90

Edited August 14 by Critzlez

[Funky]

2 hours ago, Critzlez said:

Don't be rude about it man. I did read it; you didn't specifically say not counting the hidden part.

 

But even so, imo i wouldn't say it's too small unless you think 18x3 is also already small for you. 70/90 is the closest size to 18x3 compared to 80/90.  80/90 is a bigger difference to 18x3 than 70/90

Sorry about it. I did say where rim/tire meet.. Got heated, because i know those sizes from examples.. One self measured and second one showing picture with measurement instrument right next to it.

Closest that comes to 18x3" is that 80/90 size. Most wheels that can use 18x3" size go with 80/90... There's countless topics about tires. 18x3 = 80/90 is the most common.

70/90 - smallest. 80/80 - middle. 80/90 - biggest. From my experience of owning C-1488 in 18x2.5" size. And going to K66 80/80 size. They both where almost same size in diameter. Meaning 70/90 would be even smaller. (As it has less height. Yes 70/90 and 80/80 is almost the same size in height 63 vs 64mm. But being mounted on rim, etc.. There's difference. Like rim being 40mm wide, will make wider tire be bigger in height. It moves outwards more. Where 70 width doesn't move that much outwards. 50 vs 58mm weight.)

Try bending 70mm long stick and try bending 80mm long stick - 80mm one will have more height when bent/mounted on rim. <<< Simple. That where the 50 vs 58 mm comes into play. (70/90 vs 80/80)

There where a topic where a guy did mount a 70/90 size tire on his 18xl. And he personally said it's height was 50mm. (I asked him to measure where tire/rim starts. Long time ago.) I remember that - because i was looking for aftermarket M/C tire that could fit my wheel. Without cutting tire sides only tire that would fit in 2.5" wheel well was 70/90 tires. 70 being with and 90 being height. (70-90%=63mm real height. Wrong formula to calculate the height, but it works also.. Same for 80/80 or 80/90 sizes >> 80-80%=64mm. 80-90%=72mm)

 

I think you got it wrong.. 70/90 would be something in 18x2.125" size... Go in tire section and open any topic about any wheel that use 18x3" tires. There will be many mentions about 80/90-14 size. Just saying.

TL;DR The topic.  70/90 is the smallest. Of those 3 sizes.

 

 

Edited August 14 by Funky

[Critzlez]

46 minutes ago, Funky said:

Sorry about it. I did say where rim/tire meet.. Got heated, because i know those sizes from examples.. One self measured and second one showing picture with measurement instrument right next to it.

Closest that comes to 18x3" is that 80/90 size. Most wheels that can use 18x3" size go with 80/90... There's countless topics about tires. 18x3 = 80/90 is the most common.

70/90 - smallest. 80/80 - middle. 80/90 - biggest. From my experience of owning C-1488 in 18x2.5" size. And going to K66 80/80 size. They both where almost same size in diameter. Meaning 70/90 would be even smaller. (As it has less height. Yes 70/90 and 80/80 is almost the same size in height 63 vs 64mm. But being mounted on rim, etc.. There's difference. Like rim being 40mm wide, will make wider tire be bigger in height. It moves outwards more. Where 70 width doesn't move that much outwards. 50 vs 58mm weight.)

Try bending 70mm long stick and try bending 80mm long stick - 80mm one will have more height when bent/mounted on rim. <<< Simple. That where the 50 vs 58 mm comes into play. (70/90 vs 80/80)

There where a topic where a guy did mount a 70/90 size tire on his 18xl. And he personally said it's height was 50mm. (I asked him to measure where tire/rim starts. Long time ago.) I remember that - because i was looking for aftermarket M/C tire that could fit my wheel. Without cutting tire sides only tire that would fit in 2.5" wheel well was 70/90 tires. 70 being with and 90 being height. (70-90%=63mm real height. Wrong formula to calculate the height, but it works also.. Same for 80/80 or 80/90 sizes >> 80-80%=64mm. 80-90%=72mm)

 

I think you got it wrong.. 70/90 would be something in 18x2.125" size... Go in tire section and open any topic about any wheel that use 18x3" tires. There will be many mentions about 80/90-14 size. Just saying.

TL;DR The topic.  70/90 is the smallest. Of those 3 sizes.

 

 

I still don't understand. The total outer diameter of 70/90-14 is 19", no matter the sidewall depth difference. Plus the rim lip height i believe would vary between wheels, so measuring from that would be inaccurate no? I'm talking in totality of the outer diameter, which should be a more accurate

I measured 18x3" CST 1488 to be exactly 19". And it's exactly 2.75" (70mm) wide. Am I missing something? That's exactly 70/90, no matter the measured height starting from the top of the rim. 80/90 would be 19.7" diameter and 3.14" (80mm) wide, which is a bigger difference. Plus the diameter would be even larger as the width is bigger.

Ideally he should've measured the entire diameter rather than sidewall height.

I will report later today if 70/90-14 is smaller or the same. I'm getting a 70/90 pilot street for my Lynx and will compare it to my V11's cst 1488. But I'm very confident its the same dimensions as those tire size numbers are accurate for a reason. We'll see if im wrong though lol

Edited August 14 by Critzlez

[Funky]

26 minutes ago, Critzlez said:

I still don't understand. The total outer diameter of 70/90-14 is 19", no matter the sidewall depth difference. Plus the rim lip height i believe would vary between wheels, so measuring from that would be inaccurate no? I'm talking in totality of the outer diameter, which should be a more accurate

I measured 18x3" CST 1488 to be exactly 19". And it's exactly 70mm wide. Am I missing something? That's exactly 70/90, not matter the measured height starting from the top of the rim. 80/90 would be 19.7" diameter and 3.14" wide, which is a bigger difference. Plus the diameter would be even larger as the width is bigger.

Idk about total diameter.. Each tire is different also. Example tire which have those crazy knobbies.. They don't even count those knobs into tire size.. Crazy right? (They do somewhat, but not actually right..)

Same for 80/80 size. It can be 75mm or 80mm wide. At which tire you are looking.. And from which manufacturer.

70/90-14 is very rarely seen tire sizes, because it's very small in real world.

I 100% know only about 80/80 and 80/90 sizes and K66 model. 80/80-14 is ~480mm in diameter. And 80/90-14 is around ~510mm. (From edge of tire to other edge and while being mounted on rim.)

70/90-14 i saw only in that post.. And it was small. (Only post about 70/90 size in general almost..) Most people talk about 80/90 the most. Because it is direct compereson to 18x3"

26 minutes ago, Critzlez said:

I measured 18x3" CST 1488 to be exactly 19". And it's exactly 70mm wide. Am I missing something? That's exactly 70/90, not matter the measured height starting from the top of the rim. 80/90 would be 19.7" diameter and 3.14" wide, which is a bigger difference. Plus the diameter would be even larger as the width is bigger.

Yes mostly. Just that if you mount that 70/90 on thin rim like 40mm it makes it around 65-66mm wide.. Where 18x3" is right on mark 70mm. (Yes it's 4-5mm different, but that difference makes the tire bigger and will it fit or not fit into your wheel well. Example for my wheel the 70mm would not fit. But 66mm does.)

K66 80/80-14 was 76mm wide while it was mounted on rim. (I cut it sides afterwards and got it down to 66mm)

 

Edited August 14 by Funky

[Critzlez]

Yeah. I just checked the post (should've done so earlier). The post mentioned that it's closer to 18x2.5, but that's inaccurate. "18x2.5" tends to measure by largest width. Both my CST 1488 and zx 1685 (16x3) measure exactly 2.75" without tread, but much closer to 3" measuring with the tread. So even based on that post's measurements, 70/90 is indeed equivalent to 18x3. Not sure of diameter, but it would also be the same but I will check on that later today.

Here's a cool reference about 18x3 tires from this forum, but the main takeaway is 18x3 tires can be as narrow as 2.6" (apparently) and that it's measured by largest width.

70/90 is much less common so im sure that's why 80/90 is recommended more. Some wheels aren't that great with 80/90, which makes sense because it's much wider than 18x3. The lynx for example has little tire clearance with 80/90, which is why 70/90 would fit best because it's designed more for 18x3 tires

 

[Critzlez]

Okay just got my 70/90-14 pilot street 2. It indeed is 19 inch, so it's an exact replacement to 18x3 as I suspected! @Funky

Edited August 14 by Critzlez

[Funky]

3 hours ago, Critzlez said:

Okay just got my 70/90-14 pilot street 2. It indeed is 19 inch, so it's an exact replacement to 18x3 as I suspected! @Funky

Tell us it's measurements - when you have mounted it on rim please. I generally wanna know now..

[Critzlez]

8 minutes ago, Funky said:

Tell us it's measurements - when you have mounted it on rim please. I generally wanna know now..

Alright so width is 72mm. And diameter is the same 19 inches

[Funky]

10 hours ago, Critzlez said:

Alright so width is 72mm. And diameter is the same 19 inches

And what's the height from where rim/tire meets? (Measure from edge of rim to tire center where tire touches the ground.) Also show us the side, so we can see that it's really is 70/90.  

[Critzlez]

4 hours ago, Funky said:

And what's the height from where rim/tire meets? (Measure from edge of rim to tire center where tire touches the ground.) Also show us the side, so we can see that it's really is 70/90.  

Okay I measured it and 70/90 is ~50mm sidewall, 18x3 cst 1488 is ~64.5mm. Diameter though is a very little difference where it's 19in for 70/90-14 and I remeasured 19.5 in for cst 1488. It was difficult to measure as the tire profile was curved lol.

19.5" diameter measurement makes much more sense because I did hear online somewhere that 18x3 or 16x3 is effectively 100% aspect ratio, but I initially mismeasured the 1488 tire so I thought it was wrong at first. so basically, 18x3 would really be 70/100. Diameter of that is 19.5" or so.

All-in-all, it is indeed smaller so you are correct with that. Though 70/90 is still closer than 80/90 is. 70/90 is 2.6% shorter than 18x3 (70/100). But 80/90 is 1% taller and 9.7% wider, so the delta of 10.7% is a much bigger difference than 70/90's 2.6%. Either is fine really, but 70/90 would be a better alternative if clearances are pretty tight

 

(Caliper looks off, but the camera can't capture it accurately because the tire is curved)

Edited August 15 by Critzlez