V11 cutout + a look inside the top elec box

[M640x]

 

Some of you may remember the topic of my wheel cutout last Saturday.  I have been working with Jason at wheels and Liam Zeng from IM.  First off let me say an extremely grateful thank you to them and their teams for all of the attention and focus this past week.  The level of customer service was superb.  For those that don't know, my V11 cutout while I was riding last Saturday.  I was on the first ride on the wheel and the cutout occurred at 6+ miles while going slowly up a mild hill.  All riding previous to that was on flat ground.

The cause of the cutout hasn't been determined yet.  As it stands, the wheel is to be sent back to Jason and probably IM for further evaluation.  I assisted with some basic troubleshooting and in doing so removed the top electronics cover.  I'm going to include a couple pics so you can have a look at what's in there.  There's also a teardown video of the V11 out there somewhere.  One thing worthy of noting is there are green leds on and flashing even when the wheel is off.  I've been able to connect my IM app with the wheel powered off.  

I accessed the top area by first removing the side saddle covers.  I covered the removal of the side covers here "V11 top air valve access".  The top electronics cover is held on by 4 screws.  I don't know the size but they are smaller than M4.  I used the ratcheting screwdriver in one of the pics with a number 2 phillips bit.  The cover is sealed with a black flexible sealant of some kind.  Looks like silicone.  I had to unplug the XT90 connectors to take voltage readings.

There are 2 battery cables.  One on the left and one on the right.  They travel upwards from the battery packs on the sides, go over the top of the boards and then plug into the boards.  

I'm going to throw my opinion and theory out there but obviously I don't really know.  When testing the battery leads coming up from the batteries, I found 0 volts on the left side plug and approx. 70 volts on the right side plug.  If I'm not too far off, I think there should be voltage on both sides.  I think when I went up the hill that the amps went up and the volts went down to a level that caused the bms, controller or both to shut down the wheel in a case of self preservation.  Basically doing what they're supposed to do.  With less total power available, it was easier and faster to get to the cut off point.  Also could have been some error codes floating around in the electronics and that caused the cut out.  Once again, just a quick theory on my part and I could be completely wrong since as of right now we don't really have a solid answer.

My thanks to everyone who voiced their concerns.  My shoulder is currently on the mend and is getting better every day.   Also for those that mentioned it, a quick press of the power button while riding will only turn on and off the light.  

Edited July 25, 2020 by Senior Coffee

[Rywokast]

0 on one side???? i think your assumption about why it shut off is correct,, though it should never read zero.. im thinking maybe that lead from the one pack became desoldered or disconnected in some way

[M640x]

Yeah with 0 volts I'm thinking the same thing about a desoldered connection or possibly the BMS is faulty and the voltage isn't making it through.

[EUC Custom Power-Pads]

On 7/25/2020 at 2:09 PM, Senior Coffee said:

When testing the battery leads coming up from the batteries, I found 0 volts on the left side plug and approx. 70 volts on the right side plug.  If I'm not too far off, I think there should be voltage on both sides.  I think when I went up the hill that the amps went up and the volts went down to a level that caused the bms, controller or both to shut down the wheel in a case of self preservation.  Basically doing what they're supposed to do.  

Um, wasn't that one of the advertised features that if a single battery fails, the V11 can still continue to run with reduced power without problems, or something like that? 

[Rywokast]

2 hours ago, buell47 said:

Um, wasn't that one of the advertised features that if a single battery fails, the V11 can still continue to run with reduced power without problems, or something like that? 

it can, like any wheel.. it did run without problems, however no wheel in existence would work equally with half it's batteries operating.. it could have reduced the power for all we know but the operator would have no clue in hell and push it just as hard which could easily cause an over lean or power spike that the wheel couldn't handle, though with these circumstances on such a powerful wheel seems a bit odd, perhaps with such powerful motors and advanced boards the batteries are the weakest link now?.. the obvious with this would be one of the packs became disconnected somehow and the spike from going up the hill was too much for one battery pack... it could be something entirely different though and the battery reading was just a coincidence but I doubt it this seems pretty obvious. 

I can't tell from the pics but was this a pre production unit? either way this will be valuable information for inmotion and they always put out fw updates soon after a new wheel is released.. it's not like cars that have to pass a slew of safety tests and go through a huge ordeal before they can come to market.. we are the testers lol

Edited July 27, 2020 by Rywokast

[musk]

5 hours ago, Rywokast said:

...it could have reduced the power for all we know but the operator would have no clue in hell and push it just as hard which could easily cause an over lean or power spike that the wheel couldn't handle,

If the wheel is elegantly handling a battery fault and operating on one pack,  I wonder how the rider is supposed to know about it.  It'd be good to know if there's an announcement through the wheel's speaker when the mainboard is conscious of the problem.

[M640x]

9 hours ago, Rywokast said:

it can, like any wheel.. it did run without problems, however no wheel in existence would work equally with half it's batteries operating.. it could have reduced the power for all we know but the operator would have no clue in hell and push it just as hard which could easily cause an over lean or power spike that the wheel couldn't handle, though with these circumstances on such a powerful wheel seems a bit odd, perhaps with such powerful motors and advanced boards the batteries are the weakest link now?.. the obvious with this would be one of the packs became disconnected somehow and the spike from going up the hill was too much for one battery pack... it could be something entirely different though and the battery reading was just a coincidence but I doubt it this seems pretty obvious. 

I can't tell from the pics but was this a pre production unit? either way this will be valuable information for inmotion and they always put out fw updates soon after a new wheel is released.. it's not like cars that have to pass a slew of safety tests and go through a huge ordeal before they can come to market.. we are the testers lol

It was a production V11.

[Rywokast]

1 hour ago, Senior Coffee said:

It was a production V11.

[M640x]

No new info yet as to the cause of the cutout.  My shoulder is much better and I've been practicing my parkour rolls daily to aid in my next fall excursion lol.  I conquered "Hospital Hill" on my Z10 with no issues.  Hope to have another V11 soon.  It's a very smooth riding wheel.

[M640x]

Update:  Received my second V11 this past week.  This wheel is so smooth and it's nice to be able to ride it beyond 7 miles this time.  I've been back to the hill where my original cutout occurred and all is good this time.  I think I have the suspension all set with the correct psi and it feels great on the bumps.  Great power and easy to ride.  I have adapted to it pretty quickly.  Shoulder still has pain at times.  Pretty sure I didn't break anything but bruised it enough that I'm still feeling tenderness with certain movements.  I've been practicing parkour rolling and feel pretty comfortable that in a bad situation similar to the original cutout that I'd be able to react faster.  Anyway, overall great wheel, well worth the wait and $$.