Are big heavy wheels such as V13, Sherman S or any wheels around 100 lbs good for me?

[UPONIT]

On 5/22/2023 at 4:34 AM, mrelwood said:

The reason it’s not talked about is that the general consensus seems to strongly indicate that it’s simply not worth it to use with the suspension removed. Kuji said so as well. There’s a good reason that ALL EUCs (excluding a few tiny Begodes) for the last two years are equipped with suspension.

The fact that you call it “bounciness” and ”springiness” sounds like you haven’t perhaps experienced other suspension wheels than the V11. The V11 suspension is unique in that it doesn’t have any dampening. ALL other suspension wheels do. The V11 is not very good for forming an opinion on suspension wheel behavior in general. They are not bouncy or springy, unless adjusted to the extremes for some reason.

I thought I was clear that I meant "when you FIRST start to learn to even step on the damn thing, having the pedals sink and rise can be very disorienting." There are already enough novel experiences going on, eliminating that one is surely helpful to some people? I have tried other suspension wheels. I LIKE SUSPENSIONS JUST FINE. It also doesn't hurt me if there is an OPTION. I can't know everyone's situation, but I acknowledge that other situations than my own do exist.

On 5/22/2023 at 4:34 AM, mrelwood said:

I don’t think it will. Inmotion stopped shipping the locking components for the V13 because practically no one was using them. It doesn’t seem sensible to use work hours and other resources to implement a feature that will not be used.

Will not be used by many. Sure. But it is still nice to have as an option, even if you can't relate to people who want the choice. Making it an optional purchase or whatever doesn't hurt you.

On 5/22/2023 at 4:34 AM, mrelwood said:

All air shocks can be deflated of course. But one has to confirm that the end stop is such that it can continuously carry the rider’s weight.

or you can adjust so that it doesn't bear the full rider weight at the bottom.

On 5/22/2023 at 4:34 AM, mrelwood said:

The V13 is a very extreme wheel in many regards. And even many experienced V13 owners wouldn’t consider it as their only wheel. I can’t fathom a situation where a beginner could have enough rightful information that they could make an informed decision to determine that the V13 was the wheel for them. In general it requires a lot of experience to be able to choose any wheel based on anything other than trial and error.

I’d definitely suggest that you’d try it first though. You’d probably be surprised.

I doubt I will purchase a V13. But I am fortunate enough to have a local dealer, so in an ideal world I'll be able to try it both ways and see for myself.

Believe it or not, there are people who don't have enormous incomes and can't afford to own several wheels, or serially purchase them. If they thought the V13 was right for them and only got one purchase, it could be that learning without suspension, then riding with the suspension might be ideal for them. Choice, choice, choice. It isn't only for reproductive health!

Also, my local dealer makes lockout kits for several coil suspension models, so there has to be SOME demand?

On 5/22/2023 at 4:34 AM, mrelwood said:

Suspension isn’t removable on scooters, bicycles (lockable for pedaling uphill on some, but not removable), motorcycles, or cars for a very good reason. The benefits far outweigh the cons. I don’t see how EUCs would be any different.

Oh come on. You don't think any bikes come without suspensions? You see no difference between all those multi-wheel vehicles and EUCs?!?!?

On 5/22/2023 at 4:34 AM, mrelwood said:

Not all advancements need choice though, especially if all it needs is getting comfy with it. Cars with electric windows don’t have an option to go manual, despite it would be nice to be able to be able to roll down the windows without turning on the ignition.

With all due respect, you are really reaching for analogies here. Windows?!?!? Also, again, just because you can't think of a situation doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Why eliminate CHOICE because you don't use it? My way or the highway?

On 5/22/2023 at 4:34 AM, mrelwood said:

Suspension on EUCs is simply worth it. And learning on the one you’ll ride is not that bad of an idea either. I do recognize that learning with a suspension wheel may slow down learning some aspects of riding, but still, riding a non-suspension wheel is a slightly different set of skills. Why learn both of you’ll only use one?

Why is the V12 a popular seller at several dealers? Because everyone is different. Want EUCs to be more popular? Cover all the bases. Give choices. Little old ladies and 6 year olds matter too. Don't YOU know how to ride both? People who want to eliminate choice puzzle me greatly. Is it the inability to conceive of other realities? Or is it the feeling that one's own way is the best and only way?

On 5/22/2023 at 4:34 AM, mrelwood said:

Take it that way if you will. Of course every wheel can be learned on, but the community does have quite a bit of collective knowledge on how much harder learning on a V13 sized or weighed wheel can be.

Sigh. Harder but not impossible. And then when you ride on smaller wheels, you will be zipping around tight turns like a pro! I bet it would have been harder for me to learn on Mten4 or MonsterPro than V11, so I agree with you that there's a sweet spot. Thank goodness there's more than one model available. Of course collective knowledge is important. But this isn't politics, where majority rules should be the norm. If it hurts no one to offer options, why not offer them?

On 5/22/2023 at 4:34 AM, mrelwood said:

Is it really?

Of course it is. But it’s just one feature. The humongous weight, increased braking distance, required assertive user commands etc. outweigh the moderately increased stability.

 

On 5/22/2023 at 11:57 PM, UniVehje said:

Stability sounds like a positive word but it’s really just a description. You could also describe the same thing with words stiff and slow to turn. Depending what you use it for. Going straight and for long commutes the slow and stiff turning behavior feels good, hence the positive description of stable. You want it to be relaxed feeling. 
Same with the opposite: agile and responsive are positive words used for too lively or twitchy. Same things though. You might want agility if you need to make a lot of turns all the time. But if you mostly ride straight for long periods, lively and agile wheels get tiring quickly as you need to constantly be alert and manage the wheel. 
 

For learning agile wheels are usually better. For that you should read stable as slow to react and somewhat negative. 

So you would suggest Mten4 as the perfect learner? I see people basically spinning in place on it.

I'm making a joke, but I agree that there's a sweet spot in the middle for learning on. 14-18"? But in some cases, a big powerful wheel might be the dream EUC for someone who can only get one, or who needs the POWER not the SPEED.  Or who is overweight or overtall or just likes big wheels. They will learn on it eventually, and a wheel that can be customized to the user seems like it would appeal to more people (even if it is only 100 more).

In other words, I agree with everything the two of you are saying. But I don't see the harm in having the option. It hurts no one.

I hope InMotion keeps giving options.

edit: I messed up with multiple replying to @mrelwood, so you have to expand to see my replies. Sorry.

Edited May 26, 2023 by UPONIT
Fixed the quote levels. (Thank ya!--Up)