Learning to go backward and forward help please.

[Tritzzy]

So I am starting on a RS 19 HT, and using a wall to get the back and fourth motion to feel natural. But i sometimes drift backward and turn without trying.

I'm assuming that it has to do with my feet and the pressure I am putting but it's unconsciously. 

Any tips on that specific aspect of learning?  

[meepmeepmayer]

In general, it helps to visualize that an electric unicycle just follows your center of gravity. If that is exactly above the wheel, you keep still (or keep going at your current speed). If it's behind the center of the wheel, you brake and eventually go backwards. If its forward, you accelerate.

So if you go backwards from a standstill, your center of gravity is a little too far back. Stand relaxed and upright and look forward, not down, and feel out a nice comfortable "neutral" stance on the pedals.

Turning happens if you have uneven foot pressure on the pedals. The wheel will turn towards the side with more pressure.

Probably you will get used to all this with a bit of practice, so no point in overthinking this.

After you learn to ride, you can learn free-mounting. Here the same applies: if your center of gravity isn't nicely over the wheel, it will try to get away from under you when you step on. So don't mount from the front or back, but with the wheel exactly under you (of course also do this while you still use a wall for help).

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Unrelated, but the RS HT is a damn nice wheelEnjoy the learning.

[360rumors]

Congrats on getting into EUC! Are you standing with your weight on your heels? If so maybe you can try standing with more weight toward the ball of your feet.

[rcgldr]

On 4/30/2022 at 8:18 AM, Tritzzy said:

Using a wall to get the back and fourth motion to feel natural. But i sometimes drift backward and turn without trying.

Kuji Roll has a beginner girl doing this on an Inmotion V8. You may want to go back to the beginning of the video and watch the rest of it for more beginner tips.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6o8ZMlo5ko&t=84s

Kuji mentions one foot glide, which is normally used to learn how to free mount, but in this case, he wants the girl to be able to dismount and keep control of the V8 so it doesn't roll off into a car, since he's teaching her in a parking lot. The video shows her learning to ride, but never free mount. Kuji and Wrong Way both recommend learning to ride before attempting free mount, although others teach free mount first. For some riders, either way is OK, but learning free mount first is more tiring, having to remount every time a rider bails because they didn't learn to ride using support to mount and launch first.

The rocking back and forth gets you somewhat used to how the EUC will respond, and for some riders to trust that the EUC is not going to fly out from under you. Later in Kuji's video, he explains the girl can lean forward (within reason) and to trust that the EUC will not fly out backwards underneath her.

For your issues, without a video, it's not clear what the problem is. Drifting backwards could be due to you leaning back or putting pressure on your heels or pushing yourself backwards with your hand on the wall. Turning could be uneven pressure on the pedals, or due to you unknowingly creating a twisting force with your hand on the wall For the rock back and forth, focus more on leaning forwards | backwards a small amount without focusing too much on toe versus heel pressure, and only rock back and forth a small distance so you don't have to move your hand on the wall.

 

20 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said:

In general, it helps to visualize that an electric unicycle just follows your center of gravity. If that is exactly above the wheel, you keep still (or keep going at your current speed). If it's behind the center of the wheel, you brake and eventually go backwards. If its forward, you accelerate. 

...

After you learn to ride, you can learn free-mounting. Here the same applies: if your center of gravity isn't nicely over the wheel, it will try to get away from under you when you step on. So don't mount from the front or back, but with the wheel exactly under you (of course also do this while you still use a wall for help).

The free mount part conflicts with the first part: if your center of gravity is off (forwards or backwards, different than being off left or right), then the wheel will try to get under you (not away from you). The typical first time free mounting issue is so little lean that the EUC doesn't accelerate (since it's balanced), and the rider has to bail due to going too slow. I learned to ride first (speed control, yaw and tilt steering) using support to mount and launch. My first attempts to free mount were on grass, the only time I've been on grass, and I didn't lean enough on the first two tries, but got it on the third try. In this video Wrong Way (Adam)'s girlfriend Monokat (Kate), had ridden 60 to 80 km before attempting free mount in the video, on her 77 lb Veteran Sherman. Same as me, too slow on first attempt, got it on her second attempt moving arms forward. Also similar to me and following Adam's advice, Kate moves her wheel forwards and steps on:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qW-y5RiecMc&t=634s

Assuming you plan to learn to ride first, in my case, I found yaw steering via arm flailing (flail left to steer right, flail right to steer left), literally twisting the wheel for balance and direction, allowed me to do laps around a tennis court at 3 to 5 mph on my first attempt after spending about 20 minute or so doing drills and short rides using fence for support. My wife took a video on the next day, but it was essentially the same as my first attempt. I saw that I was hunched over, which I corrected afterwards. I'm riding a V8F.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPyy84EThmM

This 3 year old is also using arm flailing:

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/z9YiHu5HJ6o

I moved to a long straight and found my V8F became stable at around 6 to 8 mph, where I didn't have to focus on balance. This wasn't some "it just clicked moment", but similar to a bicycle, a wheel becomes stable at or above some speed. Speed control, lean forwards | backwards to accelerate | brake, wasn't an issue. I then experimented with tilt steering, at first tilting my V8F to see how it would respond, then mild weave patterns and then large radius turns. I had to estimate how much to body lean versus tilt my V8F depending on speed and turning radius, having to make mid-turn corrections. It took a while for this to feel natural, a transition that occurred during my first 2 months, and continued to improve for another month or so. As an example of just how stable the V8F becomes at sufficient speed, my wife took a video of me on day 10, at night, where you can see the headlight beam stabilize at around 8 mph. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keDvRMScO1g

In addition to watching how to ride EUC videos, I also looked for videos of a rider tilt steering with minimal movement, Marty Backe style. Marty's videos are mostly long straights, so I used this video of a girl on an S18 as an example, no carving, no arm flailing, no body twisting, ..., just leaning her body and tilting her S18. Due to speed, weight, and turning radius, she leans more than she tilts the S18:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hWMwK3Cfs0

Once you can ride, eventually you'll want to learn to be able to move your arms and | or look around without upsetting balance or changing direction.

Edited May 1, 2022 by rcgldr

[meepmeepmayer]

7 hours ago, rcgldr said:

The free mount part conflicts with the first part: if your center of gravity is off (forwards or backwards, different than being off left or right), then the wheel will try to get under you (not away from you).

Due to the one-side-only foot pressure, the wheel will instantly turn and tumble away to the side while you land on your ass. At least that was my very first attempt just when I got my wheel. That's what I meant with "away from you"

Agree with the rest you wrote. "Too slow" is indeed the most common thing people do.

[rcgldr]

32 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

Due to the one-side-only foot pressure, the wheel will instantly turn and tumble away to the side while you land on your ass. At least that was my very first attempt just when I got my wheel. That's what I meant with "away from you"

Wouldn't that more likely be an issue with side to side balance, not having the wheel tilted inwards enough with one foot on while stepping with the other foot? There's also the "split" issue where the rider moves the wheel forwards too far from the planted foot instead of also stepping forwards with the planted foot so this doesn't happen. 

Similar to Monokat in Wrong Ways' video, I move the wheel forwards and step on quickly without doing a proper one foot glide, like the advanced riders that can one foot glide with the other pedal up, and while one foot gliding, put the other pedal down, and then step on.

[meepmeepmayer]

6 minutes ago, rcgldr said:

Wouldn't that more likely be an issue with side to side balance, not having the wheel tilted inwards enough with one foot on while stepping with the other foot? There's also the "split" issue where the rider moves the wheel forwards too far from the planted foot instead of also stepping forwards with the planted foot so this doesn't happen.

My first free mount attempt was literally from standing behind the wheel. Did not end well No chance of wheel tilting/leg pressure. Worse than you may have imagined