New all-rounder king? (TNT-J2306)

[Duster]

Just watched Marty Backe's video of Roger EUC on the Sherman L with the stock TNT tire. At around 19:22 in the video, Roger states that the tire is "almost as good as the Shinko 244... So tire nerds, rejoice." Well, I'm almost ready to do so!

First of all, looking at the tire, it looks familiar...

Many of us have already called-out that it's a Michelin City Grip 2 knockoff, but that might be a good thing? See further below why...

(For those not yet familiar, this is the Shinko 244:)

 

 

Now, as someone who mostly rides on the street, I have been trying to find the best, easy-to-source tire that performs well in the wet, and well enough off-road that I can safely exit and re-enter bike paths to avoid pedestrians, dogs, and other hazards that enter into bike paths without warning. So far, the best tire for that has been the Shinko 244. Many riders who like knobbys recommend it, and say that it performs like a street tire for a great price. I agree with that sentiment, but two things about the 244 bother me: (1) I'm not the most confident on it in the wet, even with its water sipes; and (2) the center knob (the one that looks like a pig nose) is taller than the rest of the knobs, making the tire feel inefficient and hindering to acceleration.

Having watched Marty's video, Roger shows a massive amount of confidence in the TNT J-2306. Granted, Roger is a pretty confident rider in general, but in the video his off-road riding suggests the J-2306 performs relatively well in dry dirt and grass, and the water sipes should arguably make the tire perform better on wet roads than the Shinko 244. At this point, I am starting to wonder if the J-2306 will gain popularity as an all-rounder recommendation, rivaling the 244.

At least here in the states, a lot of alternative tires are difficult to source. The Heidenau K66 used to be very popular here as an all-rounder, but then the 80/90-14 tire stopped being made for some reason (I blame inflation), with the shorter 80/80-14 being the only option from the manufacturer, and the remaining 90's overseas now costing around $200 to buy and ship to the states... Similarly, the authentic Michelin City Grip 2's are hard to find in 80/90-14 sizes, with the closest being 90/90-14, for $80+. I've heard that wheels like the Sherman L and Extreme Bull GT Pro can handle the 90/90-14, but chances are the Sherman L shipping with the 80/90-14 J-2306 suggests that it might not actually fit the wider size well. So, overall, it seems like a blessing that the J-2306 is available from Ewheels for $55. Sure, the 244 is 69% the price (nice) at $38, but most EUC tires are $55 anyway, so it's generally worth it.

What do you think? It's definitely not an off-road tire, that's for sure, but would Roger's compliments convince you to see it as a 244 competitor?

[techyiam]

1 hour ago, Duster said:

So far, the best tire for that has been the Shinko 244. Many riders who like knobbys recommend it, and say that it performs like a street tire for a great price. I agree with that sentiment, but two things about the 244 bother me: (1) I'm not the most confident on it in the wet, even with its water sipes; and (2) the center knob (the one that looks like a pig nose) is taller than the rest of the knobs, making the tire feel inefficient and hindering to acceleration.

Among the tires you have put on your wheels and draw your conclusion from, was the Shinko 241 one of the tires.

For street use, is the 244 much better than the 241?

[Duster]

2 hours ago, techyiam said:

Among the tires you have put on your wheels and draw your conclusion from, was the Shinko 241 one of the tires.

For street use, is the 244 much better than the 241?

I've heard some good things about the 241. I have not tried it yet, but from what I remember people saying (including FortNine on YouTube), trials tires like the 241, the Kenda K262, or the CST C-186 are also good for all-round use, with the universal caveat that the knobs on the far sides aren't sturdy enough to allow for low leans, and thus provide less handling, hence why the Shinko 244 has two knobs connected at their lower point on the sides (I've seen off-road motorcyclists show disdain of the 244 for that very reason, as it makes the knobs less likely to flex and adapt to the uneven terrain). Also, trials tires are not very good in mud, since the knobs are too thick to really bite into the terrain. There are some differences that make either one of those three tires better than the other, though:

1. The CST C-186 has a flat profile on the top, which makes it feel like it falls suddenly when you reach a certain angle of lean.
2. The Kenda K262 has a reportedly rounder profile, making for more consistent lean. However, it still is susceptible to the side knobs being unsupportive of low leans. (Out of the three, I've owned this tire, and sharp leans result in a scary wobble that comes from the side knobs and sidewall flexing too much.)
3. The 241 seems to be the best rated out of the three trials tires, with some credit going to the bridges between the center knobs (see the photo below).
   • I still don't know what to think about the side knobs, though. They don't utilize the bridging method like the 244 does.

Without having ridden the 241, I can only speculate on what I have seen when researching tires (I didn't think to bookmark those pages, so this is mostly my recollection): Firstly, putting a bridge between knobs increases their rigidity, which is good for on-road use as it makes the tire feel tight and responsive, more like a street tire. It can worsen off-road performance, though, so where such bridges are placed counts. Secondly, the sides of a tire matter for cornering, so the bridging method increases cornering performance, while the lack of bridges between knobs worsens cornering.  With that said, I think I have seen riders who ride off-road prefer the 241 over the 244, while those who ride slightly more on-road prefer the 244. I think that makes sense. Peep what FortNine said about trials tires in the video linked below. I think he even has a 241 mounted to the bike he demonstrates with!

What tires have you tried? Which would you say have performed competently in the most situations?

 

[techyiam]

11 hours ago, Duster said:

What tires have you tried? Which would you say have performed competently in the most situations?

I am afraid I am no much help here.

I have owned only one 20" wheel, and I am still riding the original stock tire. And I am strictly a pavement rider. 

However, on the 16" front, I like the riding characteristics of the Chao Yang H626 street tire on my V12 and my S16 Pro.

IMO, the H626 improved my V12 significantly. My V12 became more stable, and the ride more cushy, well for a non-suspension wheel anyway. 

Unlike the stock street tire, there were the absence of gyro effects, and steers intuitively. 

[Duster]

12 hours ago, techyiam said:

I am afraid I am no much help here.

I have owned only one 20" wheel, and I am still riding the original stock tire. And I am strictly a pavement rider. 

However, on the 16" front, I like the riding characteristics of the Chao Yang H626 street tire on my V12 and my S16 Pro.

IMO, the H626 improved my V12 significantly. My V12 became more stable, and the ride more cushy, well for a non-suspension wheel anyway. 

Unlike the stock street tire, there were the absence of gyro effects, and steers intuitively. 

Man, I really wanted the H626 for 20" wheels, as it's like a slightly more slick Heidenau K66, but Jason of Ewheels said that there were only 2.5" versions available for the 20" size. We would want 2.75" or 3.0" instead.

The variety of tires for 20" wheels seems big enough, but so many seem dedicated to street or offroad use. The K66 and the H626 are the closest to being street tires with knobs on them (if you catch my drift), but the sizes available for 20" wheels are just not the best. That's why the TNT J-2306 being sold by Ewheels at a common 20" size, and being praised by Roger as "Almost as good as the Shinko 244," is a pleasant surprise. If the 244 is like a 55%/45% (road/offroad) bias tire (based on motorcyclist reviews) and the 241 a 45%/55% (based on offroaders preferring it to the 244), then I could totally see the J-2306 as an unofficial 60%/40% tire, or a 65%/35%. That just might be my kind of tire!

[Duster]

UPDATE: We've got yet another mention of the Shinko 244 in comparison to the J-2306 in WheelGoodTime's video. This embed should be timestampped at when the mention of the tire comes in.