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Charging 420wh battey


Scott Henley
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I have a KS14D so 420wh battery . The range on it is decent for the type of riding I have been doing lately but I do seem to be charging it almost every night. My main question here is whether or not that is bad for it ? Today for instance I checked my battery level and it’s at 84%. Given that I run into the power restrictions and warning beeps somewhere around 40% I decided to top it off before I head out . Will doing this decrease the life of my battery ? I’ve heard 20-80% is the “sweet spot “ but due to the low wh rating I really need to be at 95-100%  if I’m planning on going out for long rides . 

 

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28 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

The entire battery concerns are waaaaaaay overblown. By the time you notice any differences with any battery treatment (no matter how bad), you'll have a new wheel anyways because you replaced it not due to battery problems, but due to it being old as **** and you wanted a new one 3 years ago, if only for safety reasons with only some old ass electronics keeping you from faceplanting.

What is theoretically bad for batteries is having them at 100% (or close to 100%) for a long time, especially at high temperatures. In the pressure analogy, it's like fully blowing up a balloon which makes it wear out/be less elastic faster. Same for battery membranes. That's about it. (Ignoring too low charge for long time, which isn't going to be a problem).

Charging batteries often does nothing bad. It just means you have more charge cycles (1 cycle = 100% of battery charged, you charge from 30% to 80% and have a half cycle e.g.). You simply can't use the wheel without using the batteries.

But even if bad treatment reduces the charge cycles from 1000 to 500 (a very pessimistic number AND crazy 50% reduction for real) before the batteries get "old", you'll still have

420Wh * 500 cycles / 15Wh/km = 14000 km !!!!!!!!

You can basically intentionally treat your batteries as bad as possible without setting them on fire, and still you have 10000 miles on your 420Wh wheel!!!!!

How long do you think you'll need to get 10K miles on your 14D? Will it ever happen? Again, this is a minimum number when you basically do your worst. Double hat is probably more realistic, if you don't keep the battery at 100% for 48 hours at 35°C every time.

--

In other words, don't worry about it. You can use a charge doctor or timed outlet to only charge to 85% or 90% or whatever if you feel like it, but if you so much spend any mental effort on "how much do I need to charge for my range", just plop the charger in and fill the thing up! Especially with smaller battery wheels where you don't have so much extra range.

I whole heartily agree. I'm so over worrying about batteries.

My oldest wheel, the ACM, has had 30 charges over the past 1-year.  My second oldest wheel (also 1-year old) is the Monster, and it as 22 charges. And many of these charges are not from 10% battery level. Sometimes 50% or more.

My ACM is about to be sold. The Monster I will probably be keeping longer term, but I still probably won't own that 2-years from now. It'll probably have 50 charges by then.

At least in my case, I've come to the realization that even a wheel that I keep for a looooong time will never see 100 charges. The motor, control board, shell, tire, etc. will fall apart long before the batteries give out.

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1 hour ago, meepmeepmayer said:

The entire battery concerns are waaaaaaay overblown. By the time you notice any differences with any battery treatment (no matter how bad), you'll have a new wheel anyways because you replaced it not due to battery problems, but due to it being old as **** and you wanted a new one 3 years ago, if only for safety reasons with only some old ass electronics keeping you from faceplanting.

What is theoretically bad for batteries is having them at 100% (or close to 100%) for a long time, especially at high temperatures. In the pressure analogy, it's like fully blowing up a balloon which makes it wear out/be less elastic faster. Same for battery membranes. That's about it. (Ignoring too low charge for long time, which isn't going to be a problem).

Charging batteries often does nothing bad. It just means you have more charge cycles (1 cycle = 100% of battery charged, you charge from 30% to 80% and have a half cycle e.g.). You simply can't use the wheel without using the batteries.

But even if bad treatment reduces the charge cycles from 1000 to 500 (a very pessimistic number AND crazy 50% reduction for real) before the batteries get "old", you'll still have

420Wh * 500 cycles / 15Wh/km = 14000 km !!!!!!!!

You can basically intentionally treat your batteries as bad as possible without setting them on fire, and still you have 10000 miles on your 420Wh wheel!!!!!

How long do you think you'll need to get 10K miles on your 14D? Will it ever happen? Again, this is a minimum number when you basically do your worst. Double hat is probably more realistic, if you don't keep the battery at 100% for 48 hours at 35°C every time.

--

In other words, don't worry about it. You can use a charge doctor or timed outlet to only charge to 85% or 90% or whatever if you feel like it, but if you so much spend any mental effort on "how much do I need to charge for my range", just plop the charger in and fill the thing up! Especially with smaller battery wheels where you don't have so much extra range.

Thank you for such a detailed response @meepmeepmayer. I find myself stressing and worrying over things that probably have no significance at all. It’s just how I am . I see myself having the 14d for quite some time but when my new larger wheels arrive it will become either my designated commuter or I’ll give it to my son when he learns to ride confidently. The internet is full of bad advice and lies . Very grateful to have this forum to turn to for trusted advice! 

49 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

I whole heartily agree. I'm so over worrying about batteries.

My oldest wheel, the ACM, has had 30 charges over the past 1-year.  My second oldest wheel (also 1-year old) is the Monster, and it as 22 charges. And many of these charges are not from 10% battery level. Sometimes 50% or more.

My ACM is about to be sold. The Monster I will probably be keeping longer term, but I still probably won't own that 2-years from now. It'll probably have 50 charges by then.

At least in my case, I've come to the realization that even a wheel that I keep for a looooong time will never see 100 charges. The motor, control board, shell, tire, etc. will fall apart long before the batteries give out.

I shall also be done worrying about this issue . Thank you ! 

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