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New Inmotion V10 / V10F


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Definitely don't want you to be stuck without a wheel, and you shouldn't have to be repairing a brand new one, so we are gonna make it right. Just got off a chat with @Bobwheel and we'll hook you up w

I agree that the company is too tight for the information about V10, and I am little upset too.  The reason we do this way is: We want to keep our engineer and manufacture teams away from distrac

Hey, I've been trolling this site (can you say voyeur) for about 3 months, decided to put my 2 cents in. First of all thank you for all of your input/info, this is the best site for quality info on EU

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2 hours ago, Stan Onymous said:

Here we are, my V10F and me, on the Cliff Hill on the north side of Griffith Park between the Helipad on top of the mountain and Wilson Harding Golf Course down below. The day was an 80 degree June afternoon, and I had been riding for about an hour and a half to get up to the top of that hill. This was a very impressive stress test for the V10F and it passed with flying colors. 

Of course I made it back down the hill. The music was done by Deemster aka Butcher . He has given me permission to use his music with credit. Check it out.

 

can't hear you with the wind noise and back ground music.

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19 minutes ago, eddiemoy said:

can't hear you with the wind noise and back ground music.

Yeah, I am not that interesting. Its the hill thats the star. I think I said going down the hill that it was difficult doing this hill on the KS18s because the machine is so top heavy, and that the V10 isnt top heavy but I am on top of it.” Something like that.

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48 minutes ago, Stan Onymous said:

Yeah, I am not that interesting. Its the hill thats the star. I think I said going down the hill that it was difficult doing this hill on the KS18s because the machine is so top heavy, and that the V10 isnt top heavy but I am on top of it.” Something like that.

That hill looks steeper than overheat hill.  

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8 minutes ago, steve454 said:

That hill looks steeper than overheat hill.  

Over heat hill has more gullies and dirt so it slows you down more and is a better stress test. This hill atleast is paved and that lets one get up the momentum to continue up the hill unabated. It is butt clenchingly steep though lol.?

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2 hours ago, soulson said:

@Demargon I've noticed that the (Android) app doesn't record power usage when the screen is turned off. Did you pocket your phone during the ride?

Yes, the phone was in my pocket almost all the way. That explains the extraordinary low power reports, thanks for the info.

I did a high speed cruise test untill 45% of battery, hope this time the data are more useful.

Images are from the first reached tilt back and the end of the trip. 57kmh are from little crash, both spining in the tarmac with no consecuences.

The afternoon was windy and the route in flat tarmac, my weight are 60kg and I rode sitting 1/3 of the time, the tire pressure isn't change since unboxing and firmware updated (39 kmh limit today) ride type A

 

Screenshot_20180627-211110.png

Screenshot_20180627-232202.png

Edited by Demargon
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13 minutes ago, Demargon said:

I rode sitting 1/3 of the time, the tire pressure isn't change since unboxing and firmware updated (39 kmh limit today) ride type A

Can you share how you are riding sitting? I’ve tried it a bit now and planning to make a seat for it soon. 

Interesting you got the new firmware to go 39 km/h. It seems quite random sometimes. 

Let us know how the ride feel changes when you pump your tire. Personally I like 2.8 bars on trails and 3 bars on paved roads. I try to keep somewhere in between. 

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49 minutes ago, UniVehje said:

Can you share how you are riding sitting?

One way is push with boot legs inside sharing the weight between upper legs and foots. That is great for control.

Other way is putting the chest almost over the knees or the top of the euc. Something like the motoGP riders do for better aerodynamic but need a bit of yoga stretching to reach it.

I want to use soft padded protection to the top. My experience with v5 v8 and v10 ? said is a weak point. If you have a seat planned can be a useful protection, please share your ideas

 

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On 6/26/2018 at 11:19 PM, that0n3guy said:

@Bobwheel

I like the ride modes idea.   Have you ever looked into onewheel?  Its a very popular usa based company that has a one wheeled skateboard.

They've released several new ride modes and named them crazing things like "sequoia", "cruz", or "Delirium".   These modes all FEEL pretty different, its not just the top speed that changes on them.   Some react differently when breaking/accelerating or when hitting bumps, etc... very similar to your different ride modes.

My point is, that I think you're on the right track creating different ride modes.   Constant updates are what has driven onewheels growth and popularity in the US. 

I think you just need a better naming scheme.  Here are some ideas:

  • Classic - for the original ride settings
  • Smooth/glassy/react/fluent/creamy - Playing off the description of "A" mode.

BUT you should probably keep the old ride settings as well.   There are too many people that dislike change.   Most of the complaints I've heard about on the new firmware (excluding extreme tiltback and speed limit) have to do with ride feel.

Good call, that makes lot of sense!

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On 6/27/2018 at 7:40 AM, Demargon said:

I have lot of connection problems with the app. Only works sometimes if the Wheelog is started and GPS active.

 Last use ends with a different configuration interface. Anyone know what is this?

  

Screenshot_20180626-231736.png

Try to turn off your bluetooth of your phone, wait a few seconds, connect the wheel again. 

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3 hours ago, Bobwheel said:

@Stan Onymous Thanks for your feedback. Actually the quite a lot of engineers are not very good at riding, so we need a better product manager rather than engineers. An ideal product manager should be a very good rider, and be able to think and make decisions like a rider. Most of Chinese companies don’t have that core decision makers IMO. 

 

Bob, if I can also suggest to choose a 200 pound guy...   ?

If I am saying this, that's because reading previous posts, it looks like people having overloaded motor problems are about that weight.

So, if you did not discover any bad motors issues with motors not being built at specs, I would then imagine the problem being at the firmware level.

If I understand that range tests are all made with a 75Kg person, what looks to be standard for that particular test, firmware have to be tested with heavier people!!!

If not, do not advertize the wheel with a max payload of 120Kg. If people heavier then 75-80Kg have to permanently get off the wheel, you will create a lot of frustration and will cause a lot of troubleshooting and/or motors replacement potentially for nothing.

That is why firmware has to be tested with 100+Kg person to ensure the thresholds set in that firmware do not make the wheel unusable for most.

If not, most of customers will go for another brand, what will be a pity since I still believe the V10 being a very capable wheel.

Just my 2 cent.

Edited by Fastmike
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5 hours ago, Fastmike said:

Bob, if I can also suggest to choose a 200 pound guy...   ?

Thats a great idea for a ride setting in the App. Call it American Fried in honor of Calvin Trillin. ? Maybe a ride setting for heavier people is necessary since there must be something to all their complaints and overheating besides riding technique and motor capabilities.

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5 hours ago, Fastmike said:

Bob, if I can also suggest to choose a 200 pound guy...   ?

If I am saying this, that's because reading previous posts, it looks like people having overloaded motor problems are about that weight.

So, if you did not discover any bad motors issues with motors not being built at specs, I would then imagine the problem being at the firmware level.

If I understand that range tests are all made with a 75Kg person, what looks to be standard for that particular test, firmware have to be tested with heavier people!!!

If not, do not advertize the wheel with a max payload of 120Kg. If people heavier then 75-80Kg have to permanently get off the wheel, you will create a lot of frustration and will cause a lot of troubleshooting and/or motors replacement potentially for nothing.

That is why firmware has to be tested with 100+Kg person to ensure the thresholds set in that firmware do not make the wheel unusable for most.

If not, most of customers will go for another brand, what will be a pity since I still believe the V10 being a very capable wheel.

Just my 2 cent.

my point is all the vehicle makers claim the performance of his cars and bikes with a standar rider weight. It can do a especially testing with high load but isn't logical, for example, to test a bike or car performance loaded to his max weight capacity, everybody understan you can't reach the top performance of a car pulling a caravan or loading it with bricks

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23 minutes ago, Demargon said:

my point is all the vehicle makers claim the performance of his cars and bikes with a standar rider weight. It can do a especially testing with high load but isn't logical, for example, to test a bike or car performance loaded to his max weight capacity, everybody understan you can't reach the top performance of a car pulling a caravan or loading it with bricks

As I said, I understand range performance test to be performed with a 75Kg person, but other tests have to be performed at maximum load or near to.

Will you accept you car to stop working each time you take 3 passengers??? If the payload is 120Kg, the device should work as expected with 120Kg, like any other wheel. Range will be shorter, but for the rest, should work as expected/advertised.

If not, just say max payload is 80Kg and don't fool people that can directly buy another brand.

Edited by Fastmike
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16 minutes ago, Fastmike said:

As I said, I understand range performance test to be performed with a 75Kg person, but other tests have to be performed at maximum load or near to.

Will you accept you car to stop working each time you take 3 passengers??? If the payload is 120Kg, the device should work as expected with 120Kg, like any other wheel. Range will be shorter, but for the rest, should work as expected/advertised.

If not, just say max payload is 80Kg and don't fool people that can directly buy another brand.

My Fiat Panda is a great example for that, it can pull of a roulote but I didn't expect to reach his maximum speed without stop frecuently for let it cold dawn. Beside I agree with you, the makers are generally lie with the performance specifications. Here we are used to it thanks to makers like Volkswagen

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Yesterday I have my first crash in public street. It was because I hit the bicicle path division of the image.

The v10f ride over it but the hit makes it left a bit behind of my feets, putting me on the front edge of the pedals, in a instinct reaction I lean to right avoiding the car path were I end the jump. Next I do a emergency landing firs with right foot follow of knee, hip and hand, no serious injury beside a slight torn trumb. The v10 landed near my with some scratches.

I think was my fault because I paying more attention on the people surrounding than to the road, but if the obstacles are well signed probably I didn't hit it. Other major issue is the slipper surface of the contact zones of the v10, maybe if it have more grip in pedals and shell I was capable of manage the hit without getting body at ground.

 

Screenshot_20180627-235457.png

Edited by Demargon
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2 minutes ago, Harold Farrenkopf said:

Testing and specs of the wheel should be done at maximum load! I'm very close to 120kg so I want to know how it works at max load when I buy a wheel!

assume you gona get some in the half of maximum performance, safety and range of what makers spects said

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4 minutes ago, Demargon said:

Yesterday I have my first crash in public street. It was because I hit the bicicle path division of the image.

The v10f ride over it but the hit makes it left a bit behind of my feets, putting me on the front edge of the pedals, in a instinct reaction I lean to right avoiding the car path were I end the jump. Next I do a emergency landing firs with right foot follow of knee, hip and hand, no serious injury beside a slight torn trumb. The v10 landed near my with some scratches.

I think was my fault because I paying more attention on the people surrounding than to the road, but if the obstacles are well signed probably I didn't hit it. Other major issue is the slipper surface of the contact zones of the v10, maybe if it have more grip in pedals and shell I was capable of manage the hit without crash.

 

...

Almost the same thing I've been through a couple of years ago! My fault, low speed (even too low), no damage... Paying too much attention to people around me. Newbie fault at that time for me.

 

Glad you're OK!

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5 minutes ago, Vik's said:

Almost the same thing I've been through a couple of years ago! My fault, low speed (even too low), no damage... Paying too much attention to people around me. Newbie fault at that time for me.

 

Glad you're OK!

thanks, that kind of empathy is really welcome. I'm assuming my role of newbie again until I calibrate the largest uncertainty zone due the higer speed of my new wheel

Edited by Demargon
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Lets look at horse power to weight ratio. A person weighing 175 on a V10F which has a horse power rating of just under 3 hp means that your HP/weight ratio is .0135. My Subaru Justy, which was the most powerful engine under the new CAFE emmissions standards of the late 80’s early 90’s, as measured by horsepower to cubic inchesof engine size is at a rating of .035 . And the average car that weighs 3500lbs and has 195 hp has a ratio of .054. The closer you get to 1, the more powerful the vehicle. My 25 hp Subaru 360 has a ratio of .025

In power terms The V10 can lift 990 pounds of coal 100 ft in about a minute. Obviously the new EUCs on the market are power stations capable of much more than the overheating issues suggest they are capable of. So where is the power going to if its not going to the wheel motor, or a better question is what part of the system is throttling the power in such a way to not maximize the HP?

You can do the equations for yourself with your weight as well. 746watts = 1 hp. Figure your motor’s hp out, with the V10 it is just under 3 but I use 3 for simplicity. Then divine your weight plus the weight of the vehicle and divide 3(hp) by the total weight. I think you will find that weight doesnt really change the ratio that much, so why are heavier riders having issues? Could it be pedal attenuation sending too much current, because it was calibrated for a 120lb rider? I dont know, ask @Bobwheel about it. 

Edited by Stan Onymous
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1 hour ago, Harold Farrenkopf said:

Testing and specs of the wheel should be done at maximum load! I'm very close to 120kg so I want to know how it works at max load when I buy a wheel!

You will certainly not get the max range but maybe the max speed.

The problem is that, at this time, your V10F will probably kick you off with an overload message far more often than your friends riding older generation KS or Gotway wheels with less power.

Hopefully InMotion will release a better tuned firmware that allows people over 75Kg to use their V10F as much as their older wheels   ?

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1 hour ago, Demargon said:

My Fiat Panda is a great example for that, it can pull of a roulote but I didn't expect to reach his maximum speed without stop frecuently for let it cold dawn. Beside I agree with you, the makers are generally lie with the performance specifications. Here we are used to it thanks to makers like Volkswagen

The problem is that the V10F is announced as the 'Ferrari' of the wheels, not as the Fiat Panda version... if I want a Fiat Panda equivalent EUC, I will opt for a 500W or less motor (for half the price or less)!

Edited by Fastmike
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