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We really need a new thread here, but I feel that the KS16s is the Best commuter wheel in performance range and ease of use. It has a built in handle, speakers, the usb port and at 22 mph you have all the speed you need on roads. Roads are, contrary to spec sheets, not smooth. Having to scan the pavement at 25-30mph is very difficult to do and keep your eyes on traffic as well. It is really only doable in short spurts and always risky. I have enough to think about on my way to and from work. Potholes spring up all the time so what was once a smooth road can quickly become a hazard.

The Gotway is the best track EUC. Break out the testosterone. If you have nice smooth trails to cruise, you can achieve the speeds the machine is made for. Unfortunately the beaches are much too crowded for anything over 22 mph, and unless you are going to enter a race on a track, they are just a heavier muted Kingsong with potential. Its like saying the Bugati goes 225 mph but the ferrari only goes 215. They are both high performance machines to drive in everyday use.

The real measurement for their performance is in the real world where those differences on the spec sheet get ameliorated. 

That Monster is a feat in Unicycles to be sure, but it would be better at 20" with pedal shocks. Then you would be able to utilize the speed and range to its fullest. However, in practical use it is too slow to compete with Motorcycles and too dangerous to go that fast on it for long stretches without shocks. Its like constantly scanning the road coming at you for 3 straight hours to get its full potential. Its just not natural.  Its size makes it the unicycle equivalent of the H2 hummer. I also worry about the safety for the 18" wheels and larger going forward if they dont start to utilize a suspension system for road travel. It is the next step in riding comfort now that range and speed are pretty much getting to where we want them. 

Ferrari does not need to catch up with Bugati and neither does Kingsong to Gotway. They are both progressing fantastically and since there are no competitve EUC sports, the argument of which has better performance is moot. On paper Gotway is Bugati.

 

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6 minutes ago, Stan Onymous said:

We really need a new thread here, but I feel that the KS16s is the Best commuter wheel in performance range and ease of use. It has a built in handle, speakers, the usb port and at 22 mph you have all the speed you need on roads. Roads are, contrary to spec sheets, not smooth. Having to scan the pavement at 25-30mph is very difficult to do and keep your eyes on traffic as well. It is really only doable in short spurts and always risky. I have enough to think about on my way to and from work. Potholes spring up all the time so what was once a smooth road can quickly become a hazard.

The Gotway is the best track EUC. Break out the testosterone. If you have nice smooth trails to cruise, you can achieve the speeds the machine is made for. Unfortunately the beaches are much too crowded for anything over 22 mph, and unless you are going to enter a race on a track, they are just a heavier muted Kingsong with potential. Its like saying the Bugati goes 225 mph but the ferrari only goes 215. They are both high performance machines to drive in everyday use.

The real measurement for their performance is in the real world where those differences on the spec sheet get ameliorated. 

That Monster is a feat in Unicycles to be sure, but it would be better at 20" with pedal shocks. Then you would be able to utilize the speed and range to its fullest. However, in practical use it is too slow to compete with Motorcycles and too dangerous to go that fast on it for long stretches without shocks. Its like constantly scanning the road coming at you for 3 straight hours to get its full potential. Its just not natural.  Its size makes it the unicycle equivalent of the H2 hummer. I also worry about the safety for the 18" wheels and larger going forward if they dont start to utilize a suspension system for road travel. It is the next step in riding comfort now that range and speed are pretty much getting to where we want them. 

Ferrari does not need to catch up with Bugati and neither does Kingsong to Gotway. They are both progressing fantastically and since there are no competitve EUC sports, the argument of which has better performance is moot. On paper Gotway is Bugati.

 

I enjoy bantering with you Bill ?

I have literally hundreds of miles of trails where I can comfortably ride my Gotway wheels faster than 22-mph, so your Bugati argument doesn't work with me.

I feel that you keep trying to redefine performance. Trolley handles, speakers, etc., have nothing to do with performance. My whole discussion in this thread has been about speed/acceleration and range.

Many Monster owners would disagree with your characterizations of it. You are flatly wrong IMHO. I don't know if you've ridden one for more than an hour or two, but clearly it doesn't scratch any of your itches, which is perfectly fine. No need to disparage it though.

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My point is that 215 mph is a performance speed and so is 22mph or 30 mph. I have ridden on those trails with you and even on the well paved downhill at the ill fated Carlos resevoir trip you barely cracked 20 mph and we were going down hill. I kept up fine with my 19mph V8 and I even passed everyone going down the dirt hill section. I am sure you go faster on your own, especially on your beloved but soon to be old hat(only to you) Tesla, but realistically I doubt you really go faster than 22- 25 mph for very long except over the best surfaced trails.

maximum speed performance may be something that Gotway has over Kingsong, but the mini cooper was a great performance car, not because it was the fastest, but because it was more nimble, better at cornering, and better balanced for the tracks it was racing on. Performance is more than speed. It is the utilization of these aspects in a real life situation. As stated before, since there are no competitive sports for EUCs the paper specs argument is moot in a real world scenario. Kingsong has just as much performance and range as the Gotway line for most of the uses in the real world. Yes Gotway has fun acceleration, but so does Kingsong going uphills.

Your wish to have a Kingsong made like your Gotway could be telling people you arent that satisfied with your Gotways since you apparently want something else. I am beginning to wonder :huh:.... Lol you definately have the Gotways though :laughbounce2:

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3 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

The KS18S and KS14S are the only wheels that can compete with Gotway in performance and range, and the KS18S only after riding it for 1000km. 

Just a small adjustment to that, if I might... The latest firmware update drops this to 200km. 

So about 3 days riding (for you @Marty Backe).

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2 hours ago, Stan Onymous said:

My point is that 215 mph is a performance speed and so is 22mph or 30 mph. I have ridden on those trails with you and even on the well paved downhill at the ill fated Carlos resevoir trip you barely cracked 20 mph and we were going down hill. I kept up fine with my 19mph V8 and I even passed everyone going down the dirt hill section. I am sure you go faster on your own, especially on your beloved but soon to be old hat(only to you) Tesla, but realistically I doubt you really go faster than 22- 25 mph for very long except over the best surfaced trails.

maximum speed performance may be something that Gotway has over Kingsong, but the mini cooper was a great performance car, not because it was the fastest, but because it was more nimble, better at cornering, and better balanced for the tracks it was racing on. Performance is more than speed. It is the utilization of these aspects in a real life situation. As stated before, since there are no competitive sports for EUCs the paper specs argument is moot in a real world scenario. Kingsong has just as much performance and range as the Gotway line for most of the uses in the real world. Yes Gotway has fun acceleration, but so does Kingsong going uphills.

Your wish to have a Kingsong made like your Gotway could be telling people you arent that satisfied with your Gotways since you apparently want something else. I am beginning to wonder :huh:.... Lol you definately have the Gotways though :laughbounce2:

Yes, during group rides I rarely ride very fast - not very conducive to enjoying camaraderie. And in general we ride as fast as the slowest rider (you in the case of Cogswell ;))

I've said this so many times in different threads. I wish Gotway had KingSong's quality and I wish KingSong had Gotway's performance. Yes, I'm saying bad things about both companies. I'm sorry that it bothers you that I have anything negative to say about KingSong even though I've probably crapped on Gotway more than any other company if you were to read everything that I've spewed in this forum :D

Let there be no doubt. If KingSong made the equivalent of the Tesla I would have purchased it instead of the Tesla. Does this sound like someone who is irrationally biased for Gotway?

Edited by Marty Backe
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1 minute ago, The Fat Unicyclist said:

Just a small adjustment to that, if I might... The latest firmware update drops this to 200km. 

So about 3 days riding (for you @Marty Backe).

Thanks for the correction, and I did just read about that. But I would have been pissed for the last year because given all of my wheels that I own, it can take a year to accumulate 1000km on any given one :(

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1 hour ago, Stan Onymous said:

not because it was the fastest, but because it was more nimble, better at cornering, and better balanced for the tracks it was racing on.

as @Marty Backe said trolley handles and speakers don't do with performance. Performance should be about reaching from a-b at the best times in a specific environment. I don't think an F1 can perform well in rally... it cannot at all!

I didn't read the rest except for the last 5 post in this thread Edit:7 by the time I write and post this :P

Edited by IPS Malta
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On 1/21/2018 at 10:47 PM, Marty Backe said:

Yeah, my problem is that I have six very nice wheels. So it really is hard to accumulate a lot of miles an any particular model. You can probably understand why I dislike that 1000-km requirement that KingSong places on their 18S. It would literally take me 1 to 2 years to satisfy that requirement. And I'm not the only rider that has multiple wheels (many more people have a greater number of wheels than myself).

You could have set it on clamps balanced and allow it to do the 1000km on its own :P I guess the battery would last that long with only the motor load or maybe 2 cycles. (today solved with a FW upgrade)

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48 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

Thanks for the correction, and I did just read about that. But I would have been pissed for the last year because given all of my wheels that I own, it can take a year to accumulate 1000km on any given one :(

That's your own fault though...

Have you thought about moving somewhere with better weather? Somewhere it doesn't snow. Somewhere you can ride 365 day a year! 

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9 minutes ago, The Fat Unicyclist said:

That's your own fault though...

Have you thought about moving somewhere with better weather? Somewhere it doesn't snow. Somewhere you can ride 365 day a year! 

:laughbounce2:

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4 hours ago, Stan Onymous said:

We really need a new thread here, but I feel that the KS16s is the Best commuter wheel in performance range and ease of use. It has a built in handle, speakers, the usb port and at 22 mph you have all the speed you need on roads. Roads are, contrary to spec sheets, not smooth. Having to scan the pavement at 25-30mph is very difficult to do and keep your eyes on traffic as well. It is really only doable in short spurts and always risky. I have enough to think about on my way to and from work. Potholes spring up all the time so what was once a smooth road can quickly become a hazard.

The Gotway is the best track EUC. Break out the testosterone. If you have nice smooth trails to cruise, you can achieve the speeds the machine is made for. Unfortunately the beaches are much too crowded for anything over 22 mph, and unless you are going to enter a race on a track, they are just a heavier muted Kingsong with potential. Its like saying the Bugati goes 225 mph but the ferrari only goes 215. They are both high performance machines to drive in everyday use.

The real measurement for their performance is in the real world where those differences on the spec sheet get ameliorated. 

That Monster is a feat in Unicycles to be sure, but it would be better at 20" with pedal shocks. Then you would be able to utilize the speed and range to its fullest. However, in practical use it is too slow to compete with Motorcycles and too dangerous to go that fast on it for long stretches without shocks. Its like constantly scanning the road coming at you for 3 straight hours to get its full potential. Its just not natural.  Its size makes it the unicycle equivalent of the H2 hummer. I also worry about the safety for the 18" wheels and larger going forward if they dont start to utilize a suspension system for road travel. It is the next step in riding comfort now that range and speed are pretty much getting to where we want them. 

Ferrari does not need to catch up with Bugati and neither does Kingsong to Gotway. They are both progressing fantastically and since there are no competitve EUC sports, the argument of which has better performance is moot. On paper Gotway is Bugati.

 

well my tesla is pretty easy to use too... it also has a usb port...

its pretty much just a fact that gotways are specced out better than kingsongs... and just because you can ride on a forest track with your gotway doesnt mean that is what its best for 

i enjoy my tesla every day as a practical transport vehicle and a slower version (kingsong) would not make anything better

and no kingsong doesnt have the same range in real life situations as gotway its there in the specs sheets!

and also in real life my freind i was out riding with had to plug his KS16S in a cafe to charge it because it hit low power and i was still at 70 percent!

and no we were not doing extreme trail rides we simply went on a city ride...

but kingsongs i would say have better quality but it still depends

my tesla works very fine and nothing really is broken or is breaking or malfunctioning but there is the mosfets... if they just used a little better mosfets then it would be good but again in realistic scenarios you arent going up 30 degree hills at 30mph so it is very unlikely a mosfet will blow 

Edited by Shad0z
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9 hours ago, IPS Malta said:
10 hours ago, Stan Onymous said:

 

as @Marty Backe said trolley handles and speakers don't do with performance

No they arent performance, but they are the trade-off which is Luxury. Its like the new FIAT. You can get the luxury version, or they even make a stripped down track version of it that is a bit faster because of the seat removal, no airconditioner, no stereo. Etc. I could actually dive deeper into this analysis and this is an oversimplified breakdown of the Miata/Fiat, but it is apt in any case.

They are essentially the same vehicle with some specs higher on the track model. It does not mean that Fiat/Mazda has to catch up with Fiat/Mazda. It means they are attracting different customers. That is my point between Kingsong and Gotway. Kingsongs have tremendous range and the possibly 5-10 miles less range on certain models is 5-10 miles I dont have to worry about a critical failure from a Gotway.

Winston Churchill said "there is nothing so invigorating as being shot at without result. Perhaps that is your true thrill, not the speed. That is a type of performance... Showmanship. Ta da! ??

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