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An open letter


Uniwheel

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On 12/6/2017 at 11:26 PM, KingSong69 said:

Back EMF is one of the reasons why we see more and more 84Volt high speed wheels

I don't understand why that would be the case, given the motor specification fits to the battery specification, and Justin Lemire-Elmore from Grin Technologies seems to not see the reason either:

for a view annotations to the vid see also

 

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There's no question I think, in anyone's minds, that it does indeed look great.

But the uniwheel seems to be the cosmic dictionary definition of 'too little too late.'

£900 for these specs is ambitious, bordering on arrogance, bordering on delusion.

Be awesome to be proved wrong though.

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3 hours ago, WARPed1701D said:

My only other reservation would be the lack of a trolley handle and I would strongly advise the Uniwheel team to look into creating a bolt on option similar to the V5. Even 22lb is heavy after a while and you can't always ride everywhere.

+1

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1 hour ago, Mono said:

I don't understand why that would be the case, given the motor specification fits to the battery specification, and Justin Lemire-Elmore from Grin Technologies seems to not see the reason either:

 

 

Awesome, informative video - thanks for posting it. I subscribe to that channel but missed this episode from 2015. have only watched the first half hour (it's 1 hour 45 minutes long), but I'm sure my IQ already went up a couple points. It's interesting that Grin Technologies sells pedal unicycles, and all kinds of DIY eBike parts and accessories, but nothing for EUCs (yet).

edit: Justin mentions a couple EUC prototypes he built several years ago starting at the 46:00 minute mark.

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1 hour ago, KingSong69 said:

You also have to have in mind that lifepo4 have a lifespan of 3,6 volt down to 2,5 Volt...

You can get 90% of capacity without a voltage drop (if discharge is constant). That is the point, same consistent behavior from 100 to 10%. Actually, when you detect a voltage drop, it is time to recharge.

Motor has been designed by Uniwheel, by some ex-dyson engineer (say the journalist). I guess we can't use the Chinese motors standards... 

A123 26650 2500mAh (Green)-Capacity.png

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  • 3 weeks later...

I have been in the EUC game 14 months, and in that time, the leading edge has changed out of all recognition.  I think Uniwheels problem was that they were trying to beat the wheels of the day, which was ok if you're releasing your product, the next day. If you're releasing, 18 months down the line you have to design a product that will be competitive with the leaders when you release, not now. Seems impossible? Then how do you explain the existence of the ks16s,  Gotway Tesla,  ks18s, MSuper V3+,and Rockwheel 2 (can't remember the exact name while typing here)?  and others, it's not an exhaustive list. 

If the Uniwheel 2 is aimed at the current crop of front runners , it will miss the mark again, because the game will have moved on, again.

As for their fancy Batteries, it's a bit like VHS and Betamax.  Sure Betamax was better but VHS marketing strategy flooded the market and drowned Betamax.  You can't force customers to accept something different (even if it's better) if no one else is doing it.  Sure, you'll get a few risk takers, some battery perfectionist nerds, and some who just like the colours, but the lions share of the market will go to the leading edge mainstream players, rightly or wrongly.

as old school IBM mainframe computer salesmen used to tell prospective clients: " No one ever got fired for specifying IBM". And they were right. Who wants to take a risk on the other guy?

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I agree, except for the battery part. There are no real network effects for batteries (except possibly the battery price, which is a big one) when EUC-riding is concerned. You don't ride differently whether so many % of your group have a certain kind of batteries or not. So battery type = cost consideration, only that.

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  • 1 month later...

I'm asking myself why Uniwheel is removing 80% of potential customers that will buy it by not providing Android App... Who want to buy a Uniwheel and not be able to setup it because it can be done only on iPhones ?

I know it's Europe, we probably test a little bit more stuff that we put on the market but come on, you should at last have beta test program...

Dear Uniwheel, what can you do about that ?

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1 hour ago, TomOnWheels said:

I'm asking myself why Uniwheel is removing 80% of potential customers that will buy it by not providing Android App...

How do you know that there will be no Android App for the wheel?

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2 hours ago, TomOnWheels said:

I'm asking myself why Uniwheel is removing 80% of potential customers that will buy it by not providing Android App... Who want to buy a Uniwheel and not be able to setup it because it can be done only on iPhones ?

I know it's Europe, we probably test a little bit more stuff that we put on the market but come on, you should at last have beta test program...

Dear Uniwheel, what can you do about that ?

Quoting page 8 of the Uniwheel manual... 

Quote

Our App,  Uniwheel, will be available to download from both the App Store and the Google Play store from January 2018.

 

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So I decided to read the full manual (why? Well it is refreshing to read a EUC manual that is well written in english!) and I like some of the features of this wheel.

The battery packs can be isolated by removing a built in fuse so the terminals are dead. Great for travel or carrying a spare.

The cells are Lithium Iron Phosphate. From what I heard on here and on reading Wikipedia this is a great cell for EUC use. High discharge rates and an almost flat voltage curve of around 3.2v. Also much more stable in the event of physical damage as the oxygen atoms are more tightly bound chemically resulting in less chance of a runaway fire (remember Yoshi's ACM fire after his huge crash).

Pedal pitch can be set without the use of the app. Just use the two power buttons (one on each side of the raised central casing) to set your preferred pedal angle (no angle readout though).

If I had the money I'd love to try one of these wheels. I think it has great potential for its intended target audience.

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1 minute ago, Mono said:

We seem to have pretty reasonable amounts of evidence that it does exist.

Until we get a non-paid up shill/uniwheel employee doing a proper autopsy on a delivered retail model, I'm still putting this in Loch Ness Monster territory.

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Just now, Paddylaz said:

Until we get a non-paid up shill/uniwheel employee doing a proper autopsy on a delivered retail model, I'm still putting this in Loch Ness Monster territory.

I can see that. I can also see that you had good reasons 6 months ago. Not now anymore though ;) 

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3 hours ago, WARPed1701D said:

The cells are Lithium Iron Phosphate. From what I heard on here and on reading Wikipedia this is a great cell for EUC use. High discharge rates and an almost flat voltage curve of around 3.2v. Also much more stable in the event of physical damage as the oxygen atoms are more tightly bound chemically resulting in less chance of a runaway fire (remember Yoshi's ACM fire after his huge crash).

Lithium Iron Phosphate batteries for e-rideables are old hat, no? Heavier and lower discharge rate than their lithium ion counterpart:

http://www.ebikeschool.com/lithium-batteries-created-equal/

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46 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

Lithium Iron Phosphate batteries for e-rideables are old hat, no? Heavier and lower discharge rate than their lithium ion counterpart:

http://www.ebikeschool.com/lithium-batteries-created-equal/

You are probably right. I'm not an oracle on the subject. I just picked up a few things on a quick search.

I saw that energy density is lower but thought that discharge power was very high and the cycle life was much longer (4x longer). If you could charge a LFP battery to full capacity 2000 times vs other chemistrys to just 80% to obtain the same 2000 cycles lifespan you are probably on even ground by being able to utilize that extra 20% all the time. Their resistance to overheating and runaway fires and exhibiting a flat discharge curve also appeared appealing. They are also more environmentally friendly assuming our batteries are Lithium Cobolt based...which I don't know but it is apparently a commonly used anode.

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@WARPed1701D yeah, I was always semi-curious why Lithium Iron Phosphate was seemingly abandoned in today's modern e-rideables, considering it was always touted as more fire-safe and environmentally-friendly.

I'm assuming that the higher discharge, higher energy density gains, and possibly cost, overwhelmingly favors lithium ion battery use, hence, why we don't see them used in EUCs, whereas the early e-bikes primarily seemed to use LFP.

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4 hours ago, Mono said:

I can see that. I can also see that you had good reasons 6 months ago. Not now anymore though ;) 

do you know someone who has one? Do we have independent, confirmation this is indeed 'shipping?' 

Obviously it 'exists' but I'm specifically referring to the notion of an 'active' retail shipping product that people are receiving and experiencing. 

 

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29 minutes ago, Paddylaz said:

do you know someone who has one?

no

Quote

Do we have independent, confirmation this is indeed 'shipping?' 

I don't know what that means. I see shops advertising it differently. I have seen the vid of a bulk delivery and unboxing you have seen too, I guess... I have seen their social media guy coming here for advertisement...

29 minutes ago, Paddylaz said:

Obviously it 'exists' but I'm specifically referring to the notion of an 'active' retail shipping product that people are receiving and experiencing. 

Sure, we all know that prototypes of the Uniwheel existed.

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7 minutes ago, Mono said:

no

I don't know what that means. I see shops advertising it differently. I have seen the vid of a bulk delivery you have seen too, I guess...

Sure, we all know that prototypes of the Uniwheel existed.

ok

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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