Rehab1 Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 My wife has finally recuperated from her rotator cuff issues and I had planned to resume training on her new KS16S. For those who might remember my wife's first wheel that I began her training on was a KS14C. Unfortunately after one day of training it ended up at the bottom of a lake along with my truck. I purchased the new KS16S from @Jason McNeil approximately 6 weeks ago as a replacement for the her KS14C. I have never owned a Kingsong before and unfortunately only rode my wife's KS14C for 1 hour before it's demise. I initially received input from other forum members that the KS14C might not be the best option to teach my wife as it was way to squirrelly. Myself, I found it easy to ride and my wife's first lesson went fairly smooth as she was navigating by herself around my truck holding on. I've have owned the NB1E+ and currently ride my Inmotion V5F+ and V8, the ACM 1600 and Luffy and now the KS16S. I have been riding the KS16S exclusively for the past 2 days and have experimented with all 3 riding modes ( learning, cycling and player). The learning mode is way to soft and unresponsive for me, the cycling mode is slightly better but still no where near my comfort zone when riding the V5F+, V8 and ACM. Switching the setting to Player Mode is the closest I can find to riding comfortably without having all of my somatosensory inputs firing constantly in high gear. This morning was my longest ride so far on the 16S, approximately 2 hours. I returned home with sore calve and thigh muscles. I have been riding for almost 2 years and the sore feeling in my legs reflects back to my first few weeks of training. The inner side of my shins are not sore like neophyte excessive gripping just my lower extremity muscles were fatigued and sore. As I rode around the lake this morning with no traffic or pedestrians to contaminate my senses I tried to analyze the difference between this wheel and the others. My conclusion was that balancing the 16S required more mini somatosensory inputs. For instance turning a corner and slowing down at the same time resulted in a slight backward pitch of pedals, something I was not use to. I was continually providing millisecond balance corrections with my lower body that was definitely greater than the other wheels I ride. Some may say I am just not use the idiosyncrasies of the KS16S, which I would probably agree, but I have not experienced these sensations with any of the other wheels I ride except when I first began learning. I can now easily focus in on the characteristics of each wheel and make a fairly sound determination of the handling and comfort in a short period of time. Don't get me wrong I love the KS16S, it's appearance, larger battery packs, the torque going up hills, built in trolley handle and sound system. I received many complements at 7 am this morning riding around the lake where people were literally coming off their porches and asking me questions and expressing "That is so cool! , "It's jamming", and the customary "How Much". I just don't think this will be a good training wheel for my wife. I now plan to teach her on the V8. Unfortunately I now need to make another protective cover. I would be curious to hear feedback from others that have ridden the V5F+, V8 , ACM 1300/ 1600 and the KS16S. Do you have similar opinions riding this wheel and most importantly would you initially train someone on the KS16S? I know @Jason McNeil has experience riding each of the wheels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HermanTheGerman Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 Actually I have learned EUC riding on a KS16B. From learning point of view there is not much difference to a KS16S, except that the S has a little bit more weight (I have the 640Wh variant of the B). From my point of view absolutely nothing speaks against learning on a KS16S, if one accepts that it is heavy and it is necessary to develop calf musculature, and a positive influence on the motoric development will be shown significantly in coordination, balancing and fine motor skills after 10 to 14 days training. This is nothing which comes from one day to the next. But after 2 weeks or so things will go fast, because brain and musculature have adapted. I recommend to ride 4 days in a row for at least 45 minutes per day, but not longer than 90 minutes, better 2 times 45 minutes (e.g. forenoon and afternoon), and then do a one or two day break, and then again ride for 4 days in a row, and so on. As soon as the fun factor is there, one should ride and train as much as he/she wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenaissanceMan Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 3 hours ago, Rehab1 said: Some may say I am just not use the idiosyncrasies of the KS16S, which I would probably agree, but I have not experienced these sensations with any of the other wheels I ride except when I first began learning. I can now easily focus in on the characteristics of each wheel and make a fairly sound determination of the handling and comfort in a short period of time. I upgraded recently from my faithful KS16B to the new KS16S, still keeping the KS16B. It took me about 400km on the KS16S before I felt the same confidence as with my 16B after (real) 1500km. Why? IMHO, the 16S is much more powerful and reacts faster (and smoother) to acceleration, turns etc than the 16B. One has to be more precise and measured in your commands to the 16S. That and the angled pedals. I now have a significantly wider stance on the 16S than on the 16B. I started with the usual closer stance on the horizontal pedals of the 16B with resulted in pain in the ankles and knees on the 16S. However, with a slightly wider stance on 16S without the ankles touching the wheel the pain is now gone and I have a very comfortable and stable stance. The dipping of the pedals in narrow turns was becoming really annoying on the 16B until I re-calibrated the front (where the on/off switch is located) a few degrees up. The 16S so far has (without any calibration from myself) no detectable dipping in turns. I ride in player mode (the stiffest setting). So essentially what I would recommend is keep on riding the 16S, it soon will be highly rewarding ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted September 3, 2017 Author Share Posted September 3, 2017 2 hours ago, HermanTheGerman said: From my point of view absolutely nothing speaks against learning on a KS16S, if one accepts that it is heavy and it is necessary to develop calf musculature, and a positive influence on the motoric development will be shown significantly in coordination, balancing and fine motor skills after 10 to 14 days training. Thanks for the response. To me it was not the weight as my ACM 1600 is much heavier. It was the increased sensitivity. Maybe I should just start my wife out on the Learners Mode and forgot about the way it feels and responds to me. 2 hours ago, RenaissanceMan said: So essentially what I would recommend is keep on riding the 16S, it soon will be highly rewarding ! Thanks. Yes I plan to keep riding it. I'm just trying to figure out if the KS16S is the right wheel for her to begin learning on. I only have one chance to convince her that this is a fun hobby. Maybe I should just let her try the other wheels as well and she can make her own determination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 1 hour ago, Rehab1 said: Thanks for the response. To me it was not the weight as my ACM 1600 is much heavier. It was the increased sensitivity. Maybe I should just start my wife out on the Learners Mode and forgot about the way it feels and responds to me. Thanks. Yes I plan to keep riding it. I'm just trying to figure out if the KS16S is the right wheel for her to begin learning on. I only have one chance to convince her that this is a fun hobby. Maybe I should just let her try the other wheels as well and she can make her own determination. If you, with your vast experience and knowledge, can't convince your wife that this is fun, we're all lost I learned on the ACM. I actually think it's easier to learn on a less nimble wheel like the ACM. I think I would have even had an easier time with the MSuper. Hindsight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve454 Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 1 hour ago, Rehab1 said: Maybe I should just let her try the other wheels as well and she can make her own determination. That might make it more fun and interesting. Heaviest to lightest, lightest to heaviest, or random. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted September 4, 2017 Author Share Posted September 4, 2017 2 hours ago, Marty Backe said: If you, with your vast experience and knowledge, can't convince your wife that this is fun, we're all lost I learned on the ACM. I actually think it's easier to learn on a less nimble wheel like the ACM. I think I would have even had an easier time with the MSuper. Hindsight. Unfortunately there are to many negative people in my family saying to my wife: "Your actually going to try that?" or "I would kill myself!" She is not very enthusiastic about learning to ride anymore after her shoulder injury. It would be great if she asked " Can you teach me how to ride some more today?". But that never happens. My ACM is starting to become my favorite wheel for cruising and trails. It is rock solid and a joy to ride. I believe my wife might actually feel comfortable training on it but my biggest concern is the volatile release of kinetic energy when it is dropped! Maybe I should just steal my grandson's NB1 for a few days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted September 4, 2017 Author Share Posted September 4, 2017 2 hours ago, steve454 said: That might make it more fun and interesting. Heaviest to lightest, lightest to heaviest, or random. Yes It would be interesting. I just hate making more protective covers. I might just go the foam route. Maybe Mten would be a good wheel for her to train on. Luffy is definately not a good choice with it's munchkin pedals. Mten is short and squatty with larger pedals and a fat tire. She also would have less distance to fall. Hopefully it arrives soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted September 4, 2017 Share Posted September 4, 2017 3 hours ago, Rehab1 said: Unfortunately there are to many negative people in my family saying to my wife: "Your actually going to try that?" or "I would kill myself!" She is not very enthusiastic about learning to ride anymore after her shoulder injury. It would be great if she asked " Can you teach me how to ride some more today?". But that never happens. My ACM is starting to become my favorite wheel for cruising and trails. It is rock solid and a joy to ride. I believe my wife might actually feel comfortable training on it but my biggest concern is the volatile release of kinetic energy when it is dropped! Maybe I should just steal my grandson's NB1 for a few days. I hear you. Just yesterday I dropped my MSuper and proceeded to stand and watch the wheel spin fully up while it was sitting on it's side. After seeing @eddiemoy's recent video I now realize how bad Gotway is relative to other wheels like KingSong. Gotway must be using some crappy sensors and/or firmware for them not to be able to detect rapidly enough that the wheel is not upright. Add this to my long list of improvement wishes that I have for Gotway, which will probably never be realized Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainKBLS Posted September 4, 2017 Share Posted September 4, 2017 2 hours ago, Rehab1 said: Unfortunately there are to many negative people in my family saying to my wife: "Your actually going to try that?" or "I would kill myself!" She is not very enthusiastic about learning to ride anymore after her shoulder injury. It would be great if she asked " Can you teach me how to ride some more today?". But that never happens. My ACM is starting to become my favorite wheel for cruising and trails. It is rock solid and a joy to ride. I believe my wife might actually feel comfortable training on it but my biggest concern is the volatile release of kinetic energy when it is dropped! Maybe I should just steal my grandson's NB1 for a few days. I completely agree that the ACM is solid and is my choice over my V8. However for learning, I think the V8 is more suitable. The extra 10 pounds is really noticable. The lighter weight of the V8 makes it easier to control as well the slightly taller height where you can use your knees to stabilize. That's what I'm training my wife on. Same here, there's no way she will ever ask me to teach her. I'm giving her the guilt trip that we need to learn this before we get older and can get around better. So far, I've managed to get three sessions where I hold her hand and ride along side. That is working out quite well. Hopefully after a month or so she'll be on her own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Onymous Posted September 4, 2017 Share Posted September 4, 2017 2 hours ago, Rehab1 said: ning to ride anymore after her shoulder injury. It would be great if she asked " Can you teach me how to ride some more today?". But Get her that smashing outfit like Yoshi was wearing if she is worried about her shoulder. It has shoulder pads, back pads elbow, forearm pads and is form fitted so it will look great too. Here is a pic What woman wouldnt wear an outfit at least once? Just my 2cents Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radial Posted September 4, 2017 Share Posted September 4, 2017 2 hours ago, Rehab1 said: Maybe I should just steal my grandson's NB1 for a few days. You say that like you're joking. I learned on a Ninebot One E+, and it was perfect for that purpose. I rarely ride it anymore since I got the V8, but it was the perfect training wheel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted September 4, 2017 Author Share Posted September 4, 2017 1 minute ago, CaptainKBLS said: I'm giving her the guilt trip that we need to learn this before we get older and can get around better. So far, I've managed to get three sessions where I hold her hand and ride along side. That is working out quite well. Unfortunately my wife knows me to well and has had tons of psych classes. Now if I could convince my grandson to apply some pressure she might cave. Best wishes on your continued training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted September 4, 2017 Author Share Posted September 4, 2017 26 minutes ago, Stan Onymous said: Get her that smashing outfit like Yoshi was wearing if she is worried about her shoulder. It has shoulder pads, back pads elbow, forearm pads and is form fitted so it will look great too. Here is a pic What woman wouldnt wear an outfit at least once? Just my 2cents Actually @YoshiSkySun stole my jacket! She might be agreeable to the lighter colored jacket with some pink bling. 13 minutes ago, radial said: You say that like you're joking. I learned on a Ninebot One E+, and it was perfect for that purpose. I rarely ride it anymore since I got the V8, but it was the perfect training wheel. No joke! I learned on the NB1E+ before passing it onto my grandson. Oh god she would kill me if she knew we were talking about her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted September 4, 2017 Author Share Posted September 4, 2017 1 hour ago, Marty Backe said: Add this to my long list of improvement wishes that I have for Gotway, which will probably never be realized We hate them but keep on buying! Any word on your Mten? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoshiSkySun Posted September 4, 2017 Share Posted September 4, 2017 I understand where your wife is coming from...the emotional scars hurts more than the physical ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted September 4, 2017 Share Posted September 4, 2017 1 hour ago, Rehab1 said: We hate them but keep on buying! Any word on your Mten? No. I'm sure it's somewhere in the Pacific ocean, slowly winding it's way here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan Onymous Posted September 4, 2017 Share Posted September 4, 2017 Actually, I got the orange one because I ride amonst obliviots in traffic and need to be seen. However I was drawn to it because it is reassuring to me that I am more prepared knowing the experience that a fall could happen through no fault of your own. I had a bad fall while totally unprotected and the tendons in my left hand are just coming back to full strength without pain. I was lucky my elbows didnt break as well as my right elbow swelled up nicely. Then I check the news and see three hapless pedestrians, walkers, people that use their feet instead of a wheel, get rolled over like pizza dough by some prius on the news and think - hmmm there's lots of risk out there. So dont ride unprotected and its that foot mobile thingy people do without a wheel is pretty dangerous around town too. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electricpen Posted September 4, 2017 Share Posted September 4, 2017 35 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: No. I'm sure it's somewhere in the Pacific ocean, slowly winding it's way here. I realize it is a small sample size but my Kingsong 16s came directly from China actually and it took 12 days. They seemed to think that was faster than average too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted September 4, 2017 Share Posted September 4, 2017 17 minutes ago, electricpen said: I realize it is a small sample size but my Kingsong 16s came directly from China actually and it took 12 days. They seemed to think that was faster than average too. I guess we can't be too picky for free shipping Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HermanTheGerman Posted September 4, 2017 Share Posted September 4, 2017 9 hours ago, Rehab1 said: Maybe I should just start my wife out on the Learners Mode and forgot about the way it feels and responds to me. Thanks. Yes I plan to keep riding it. I'm just trying to figure out if the KS16S is the right wheel for her to begin learning on. I only have one chance to convince her that this is a fun hobby. Maybe I should just let her try the other wheels as well and she can make her own determination. I can only speak for myself, but I do not recommend learners mode, because I hated it from beginning, the wheel acted like a hippo in deep mud. If you believe that players mode is too reactive for a beginner, then try the medium mode (I believe it has a different name now, but at my KS16B it is called riding mode). And I believe your idea to let her try all wheels and make her own decision is a great one, not only from a technical, but also from a psychological point of view. Unfortunately my wife refuses strictly to ride an EUC, although she is an excellent skier. 5 hours ago, Rehab1 said: Unfortunately there are to many negative people in my family saying to my wife: "Your actually going to try that?" or "I would kill myself!" For my wife things like that (negative mood from relatives or friends) would just push her to do it anyway. I believe some of this sense of contradictoriness is in all wives of the world, therefore you possibly can make use of that e.g. saying: "Wouldn't it be great if you pass aunt Emma on a EUC, although she said you shouldn't do it because SHE thinks it's sooo dangerous ?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted September 4, 2017 Author Share Posted September 4, 2017 4 hours ago, HermanTheGerman said: I can only speak for myself, but I do not recommend learners mode, because I hated it from beginning, the wheel acted like a hippo in deep mud. Easy to visualize that image! 4 hours ago, HermanTheGerman said: And I believe your idea to let her try all wheels and make her own decision is a great one, not only from a technical, but also from a psychological point of view. I agree! She likes making up her own mind without pressure. 4 hours ago, HermanTheGerman said: Unfortunately my wife refuses strictly to ride an EUC, although she is an excellent skier. That is interesting. 4 hours ago, HermanTheGerman said: For my wife things like that (negative mood from relatives or friends) would just push her to do it anyway. I noticed you left out husband. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted September 4, 2017 Author Share Posted September 4, 2017 8 hours ago, YoshiSkySun said: I understand where your wife is coming from...the emotional scars hurts more than the physical ones. I'm going to shame her and say "Look at Yoshi! He got hurt, was in a wheelchair and he's up and riding again. Toughen up lady!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted September 4, 2017 Author Share Posted September 4, 2017 7 hours ago, Stan Onymous said: Actually, I got the orange one because I ride amonst obliviots in traffic and need to be seen I was not aware the jacket came in orange! Yes you will definately stand out in the crowd! Actually orange is smart because it CONCERTRATES! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainKBLS Posted September 4, 2017 Share Posted September 4, 2017 10 hours ago, Stan Onymous said: Get her that smashing outfit like Yoshi was wearing if she is worried about her shoulder. It has shoulder pads, back pads elbow, forearm pads and is form fitted so it will look great too. Here is a pic What woman wouldnt wear an outfit at least once? Just my 2cents She could be the female Power Ranger. LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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