Mono Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 15 hours ago, US69 said: Actually back at the time the crasher/Dean himself was discussing very heavily with Eddie Moi about it, where Eddie -just by video- also wants to convice him that its wheel wobble or overleaning. So the guy who crashed himself said it was -defintitly- a cutout, he speed up to the max speed to fast, guess it was on under 50% battery, and because of that cutout/crashed. That's what I consider to be an overlean rather than a cutout, if the motor has not entirely went to idle or shut off, but many people use the term cutout more loosely. The video seems to pretty clearly indicate that the motor is still providing torque during the incident and didn't just stop working at all as a first cause of events. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 6 hours ago, palachzzz said: It is very strange, that in the list of your weaknesses you list the specifications that are written everywhere, Ninebot users knows which battery, which maximum speed, and which weight they buying. That doesn't paint the full picture, though. For example, any wheel should also list the available max torque or acceleration, not just top speed. @Hsiang's recent fall suggests that his Z10 may have dipped shortly because it limited its acceleration in the same way that the Z10 apparently limits its braking power sometimes. Then it realized that shouldn't have been and sped up, but it was already too late. The other good explanation for this dip would be a slipping tire, but from the description and video it seems less likely than the wheel dipping on its own. 5 hours ago, palachzzz said: By the way, Ninebot Z10 speed limiter: You're a gem! Giving us the cold hard facts when there is so much unclarity and speculation here otherwise Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreeRide Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 5 hours ago, palachzzz said: By the way, Ninebot Z10 speed limiter: Not entirely accurate at the tail. You'll never go 10km/h with 0% battery. On the Z10 at about 5% battery you are at 0 km/h. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriull Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 29 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: because it limited its acceleration 29 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: Then it realized that shouldn't have been and sped up Too much intelligence in the firmware? 😎😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 21 minutes ago, FreeRide said: Not entirely accurate at the tail. You'll never go 10km/h with 0% battery. On the Z10 at about 5% battery you are at 0 km/h. Pretty sure that's just the formula he extracted somehow. There's going to be additional tiltback when the voltage drops too low and stuff like this, but the speed limit alone might be programmed to 10kph at most. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED209 Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 13 hours ago, Rehab1 said: Is it just me or does the guy shooting the video have nerves of steel? He never wavered during the crash. He was too busy watching @Marty Backe latest video upload.🤣 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 3 hours ago, Chriull said: Too much intelligence in the firmware? 😎😁 The crash of @Hsiang though can be explained without intelligent firmware. By lowering his CoG and hence releasing weight he allowed the wheel to speed up and catch up under him, but then was not able to control the situation when the wheel was back under his body. It was a very unfortunate chain of events. This doesn't explain though what started this chain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Afeez Kay Posted November 17, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) Hi All Electric Unicycle Owners and yet to be owners. I have been lucky enough to be lent a Ninebot One Z10. There are two camps regarding this wheel. You either like this wheel or you hate it, and I must admit I was one of those that did not initially care much about this wheel. I always thought it was overhyped and it only got by on looks alone. Lets be clear, the Ninebot One Z10 is not perfect, and I am guessing that Ninebot production and design of this wheel was shaped by regulatory reasons (the below 60v) and looks ( wanting to look like something batman would ride, for marketing reasons). The end result is a machine that at first glance, is more style over substance, but if you give it a chance, it is a wheel that when you take your time to understand its shortfalls, you will start to understand the uniqueness of this wheel, what it excels at. I believe it is in a separate category of One, at the moment. To the glaring issues: The tire, over 4 inches wide, while it looks cool, it is impractical at times. Going over grooves on the road, is a nightmare, it follows the groves, so it’s a guessing game to know how the wheel will behave on different unpaved surfaces. Definitely gives your core muscles a work out. The low-ish battery capacity, below 1Kwh (995wh, I believe), the Gotway MSX and the Kingsong 18XL has about 1600wh. Due to the weight of this wheel, I would say the battery capacity is equivalent to a 800wh gotway ACM. Not to mention the large surface area of the tire that generate more rolling resistant compared to the Gotway MSX or the Kingsong 18L and XL. The weight. This thing is heavy and I would not wish the burden of carrying this wheel even on my worst enemy. This is not an easy wheel to transport around if you have to use public transport where steps are involved at stations. So at this point we have established that it is heavy, range and battery capacity is not the best and that the wheel is nothing but style over function. Let’s flip this around... The weight of the wheel gives it is a higher centrifugal force, therefore turning this wheel at higher velocity is similar in some ways to riding a motor bike. It is extremely stable at high speeds. This is what gives this wheel it’s (UN)characteristic riding style. You can not ride this wheel with the same skill and style as other EUCs. Riding this wheel and turning at higher speed is engaging, challenging but FUN. It’s different. I have a Gotway Tesla, if I can compare the two, the Tesla is akin to a Porsche 911 Turbo, its a tool, it’s connected, responsive, it does the job and does it clinically well. The Z10 is a Mercedes G Wagon, it’s boxy, it’s heavy, expensive, impractical, but ask most G Wagon owners and they will tell you it’s one of the most fun vehicle they have or owned. It’s so silly that it’s Fun. And that’s it. The z10 is in a new category of wheels. The first of its kind. The MSX and the Kingsong 18L and XL are BETTER at being EUCs as we know and love... But if we all want practicality in all our vehicles then there will be no market for cars like the Lamborghinis and Ferrari’s or the Mercedes G Wagon of this world. The truth is the Z10 is a unique, Silly and Fun wheel. The Z10 is a trail blazer and will not be forgotten. It’s a Silly Fun Wheel. The Ninebot One Z10 is AVANTGARDE!! Edited November 17, 2018 by Afeez Kay Editing 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z3n Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 21 minutes ago, Afeez Kay said: I wonder what the story about that rolling stones tongue is? Mind to elaborate more please? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afeez Kay Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 1 hour ago, z3n said: I wonder what the story about that rolling stones tongue is? Mind to elaborate more please? It’s a shoe insole 😆 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Rehab1 Posted November 17, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) 4 hours ago, z3n said: I wonder what the story about that rolling stones tongue is? Mind to elaborate more please? Or Gene Simmons tongue. In fact this might look awesome hanging out the back of my Z10. Edited November 17, 2018 by Rehab1 8 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lukasz Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 (edited) 7 hours ago, Afeez Kay said: 4 inches wide, while it looks cool, it is impractical at times. Going over grooves on the road, is a nightmare, it follows the groves, At first -yes but if You put your legs wider on the pedals, and pass first 500 km is not the problem any more - Your brain will train automatic reactions for that - also going across the slope - places where I had almost no control of direction at first rides - now I am myself wondering "what was this issue here" as now - makes no problem at all. 7 hours ago, Afeez Kay said: The low-ish battery capacity, below 1Kwh (995wh, I admit that battery could be bigger - something like 1400Wh would be nice.. I have consumed today 800Wh to cover 35km only (but outside +1 Celsius) but... In fact I quite rarely ride more than 30 km without the stop, so if in need - usually there is time to recharge... BTW - I have tested that 4A charging is OK, 5.3 A also - to full capacity and @palachzzz tested that Z10 BMS allows up to 9A charging... I am in the process of obtaining super light (0.5kg) fast charger with swichable 6/3 A currents - so - it should allow to say that 1000Wh battery is not critical issue. BTW there are also some attempts to prepare 1420Wh custom battery for Z10, but this is not yet confirmed as working (but for sure it fits inside Z10) 7 hours ago, Afeez Kay said: The weight. This thing is heavy and I would not wish the burden of carrying this wheel even on my worst enemy. This is not an easy wheel to transport around if you have to use public transport where steps are involved at stations. Weight is about the same as MSX and maybe 1 kg more than KS18XL ! Carrying around this wheel is easy, as the main handle is very well profiled it has good anti spin (not existing in MSX, wheel is small and if You know how to carry it - it is easier than MSX . Moreover - trolley handle does not interfere with main handle - so if you go through the train station for example pushing the wheel by trolley handle - and have to go up the stair - it can stay retracted while You carry the wheel. KS18L has the same handle for both actions - You have be sure that it clicked back in place before you can carry it again, and if only one side locks - it is easy to break the KS18L handle... MSX handle is kind of crippled - to short, not in the center of the wheel, gets stuck easy when you want to push it back into the chassis.... 7 hours ago, Afeez Kay said: It is extremely stable at high speeds. True 7 hours ago, Afeez Kay said: You can not ride this wheel with the same skill and style as other EUCs. Riding this wheel and turning at higher speed is engaging, challenging but FUN. It’s different. Yes - Z10 needs re-learning how to ride, but then .. . A LOT of FUN Edited November 18, 2018 by Lukasz 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
palachzzz Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 (edited) Regarding max speed, did you see that? Edited November 18, 2018 by palachzzz 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toshio Uemura Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 9 hours ago, palachzzz said: Regarding max speed, did you see that? For now we are taking on bicycles, but it won’t be long ... a few years from now, some of us ... the brave ones ... will leave motorbikes behind ... 😝 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afeez Kay Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 (edited) 17 hours ago, Lukasz said: At first -yes but if You put your legs wider on the pedals, and pass first 500 km is not the problem any more - Your brain will train automatic reactions for that - also going across the slope - places where I had almost no control of direction at first rides - now I am myself wondering "what was this issue here" as now - makes no problem at all. I admit that battery could be bigger - something like 1400Wh would be nice.. I have consumed today 800Wh to cover 35km only (but outside +1 Celsius) but... In fact I quite rarely ride more than 30 km without the stop, so if in need - usually there is time to recharge... BTW - I have tested that 4A charging is OK, 5.3 A also - to full capacity and @palachzzz tested that Z10 BMS allows up to 9A charging... I am in the process of obtaining super light (0.5kg) fast charger with swichable 6/3 A currents - so - it should allow to say that 1000Wh battery is not critical issue. BTW there are also some attempts to prepare 1420Wh custom battery for Z10, but this is not yet confirmed as working (but for sure it fits inside Z10) Weight is about the same as MSX and maybe 1 kg more than KS18XL ! Carrying around this wheel is easy, as the main handle is very well profiled it has good anti spin (not existing in MSX, wheel is small and if You know how to carry it - it is easier than MSX . Moreover - trolley handle does not interfere with main handle - so if you go through the train station for example pushing the wheel by trolley handle - and have to go up the stair - it can stay retracted while You carry the wheel. KS18L has the same handle for both actions - You have be sure that it clicked back in place before you can carry it again, and if only one side locks - it is easy to break the KS18L handle... MSX handle is kind of crippled - to short, not in the center of the wheel, gets stuck easy when you want to push it back into the chassis.... True Yes - Z10 needs re-learning how to ride, but then .. . A LOT of FUN Thank you for the feedbacks and analysis of my initial one week review of the Z10, coming from such an experienced Z10 rider means a lot. I would very much appreciate if you can let me know where I can get the fast charger for the Z10. Big fan and I enjoy your YouTube videos 😊👍🏾 Edited November 18, 2018 by Afeez Kay Spelling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 (edited) On 11/16/2018 at 1:44 PM, Marty Backe said: This was not a cutout and says nothing about the quality of the Z10, IMHO. The Z10 rider (looking ok in the peak of the triangular shadow to the left) raises his arms from hip to over his shoulders in about four video frames. He's out of balance in a short amount of time and off the Z10 about 6 frames later. Perhaps the rider attempted to speed up the Z10 just before passing the videographer..... resulting in a power shutoff. Edited November 18, 2018 by Bob Eisenman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoberAce Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 @Marty Backe I read this about bike paths in California today: http://bike.lacity.org/category/bike-lanes/ California Streets and Highways Code S&H Code 890.4. As used in this article, “bikeway” means all facilities that provide primarily for, and promote, bicycle travel. For purposes of this article, bikeways shall be categorized as follows: (a) Bike paths or shared use paths, also referred to as “Class I Bikeways” which provide a completely separated right-of-way designated for the exclusive use of bicycles and pedestrians with crossflows by motorists minimized. Bicycle Paths are designed for the use of people on bicycles and on foot. The Z10 surely rolls! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
palachzzz Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 12 hours ago, Bob Eisenman said: The Z10 rider (looking ok in the peak of the triangular shadow to the left) raises his arms from hip to over his shoulders in about four video frames. He's out of balance in a short amount of time and off the Z10 about 6 frames later. Perhaps the rider attempted to speed up the Z10 just before passing the videographer..... resulting in a power shutoff. Take a look at the frame where the rider is no longer on the wheel, the wheel restored the horizon. This is not a shutoff, cutoff, shutdown (or any other word means that wheel doesn't work more), it's overlean. after that: 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, palachzzz said: after that: That frame is before (check his shadow) not after. I made an animated gif but access to Google Drive might not work with Android app assigned permissions I used. Here is a link, you might need to download it to view: https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=1UspVDXovQ0HNVxwLiydEOz16DAiSOKpl Over lean...humm.... Edited November 19, 2018 by Bob Eisenman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 8 minutes ago, Bob Eisenman said: made an animated gif Here is a Facebook link which should allow public Access https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10215873965633736&id=1583706302 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 13 hours ago, Bob Eisenman said: Perhaps the rider attempted to speed up the Z10 just before passing the videographer..... resulting in a power shutoff. The power is still on, otherwise the pedals would be dipping much quicker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Mono said: The power is still on, otherwise the pedals would be dipping much quicker. Three video frames at maybe 15-30 fps isn't slow.... perhaps 3 feet in distance before hands up.....but you be the judge....ok? @Mono My screen capture video of the source video was 28-29 frames per second at a low bit rate from Android's screen display. Frames we're extracted from that video after cropping in video post processing software for the animated GIF. Edited November 19, 2018 by Bob Eisenman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 12 minutes ago, Bob Eisenman said: Three video frames at maybe 15-30 fps isn't slow.... perhaps 3 feet in distance before hands up.....but you be the judge....ok? This incident is consistent with a cutoff, the pedals just "flip over" 90º: 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, Mono said: the pedals just "flip over" 90º: Got it...I've seen that video before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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