Marty Backe Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 4 hours ago, palachzzz said: Guys, this video is not about Ninebot Z, it was Rockwheel GT16 wheel. I saw video with Dean's fail.. but I can't find it. If anyone finds the Dean video please post it. I never saw it and would be very interested in seeing a supposed Z10 failure caught on film. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Lukasz Posted November 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted November 16, 2018 (edited) Hello - Coutesy of Palachzzz - "Dean" video - see the overlean on the first picture - and that wheel stabilized - on the second picture - also side video - he is riding really fast, wears only helmet... (and beach shoes/slippers + shorts ) Edited March 14, 2021 by Lukasz videos deleted due to forum disc space limits 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steef Klonoa Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 (edited) Looks like rider error to me. I think I see a dip in the road, it didn't just cut out. Edited November 16, 2018 by Steef Klonoa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Lukasz said: Hello - Coutesy of Palachzzz - "Dean" video - see the overlean on the first picture - and that wheel stabilized - on the second picture - also side video - he is riding really fast, wears only helmet... (and beach shoes/slippers + shorts ) This is the "Dean" video that @US69 was referring to??? This is old and the consensus was the fall was due to a wheel wobble throwing the rider from the wheel. I even posted a slow-motion version of this video and you can clearly see that the wheel starts to wobble. This was not a cutout and says nothing about the quality of the Z10, IMHO. Here's my closer look at this video that I posted a month ago 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lukasz Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 (edited) 36 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: This is the "Dean" video that @US69 was referring to??? Lets see @US69 feedback.... As @Marty Backe posted YT link - I will soon delete video as it is consuming my local quota, but I will post another interesting one - in fact VERY interesting - showing very high efficiency of the Z10 stabilization system... Edited November 16, 2018 by Lukasz 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 21 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: This is old and the consensus was the fall was due to a wheel wobble throwing the rider from the wheel. I even posted a slow-motion version of this video and you can clearly see that the wheel starts to wobble. This was not a cutout and says nothing about the quality of the Z10, IMHO. Actually back at the time the crasher/Dean himself was discussing very heavily with Eddie Moi about it, where Eddie -just by video- also wants to convice him that its wheel wobble or overleaning. So the guy who crashed himself said it was -defintitly- a cutout, he speed up to the max speed to fast, guess it was on under 50% battery, and because of that cutout/crashed. But please....leave that all beside now! Whatever if was...wobble-cutout-overleaning.....that i mentioned this was just a reaction to the statement that there was NEVER any crashes or even problems reported with the Z10. I even said that the outside build quality is top notch on the z10! But saying there was/is no problems with the Z10 is just not the case. Tell that to the sellers, that have to open up a third of them because of BMS firmware problems. The EUC scene is phenomenal.... say something about problems with a certain wheel and all the owners go on the barricade, “protecting” their EUCs that heavy, like it is in really no other hobbyscene. It really is no fun. When i see some arguments here, like that it is a good thing only to recuperate one battery and have them running on different voltages, or that it might be even wanted that the wheel only runs on one battery pack- honestly my toenails get rolled.......and for my own best its good to leave the discussion then. I mean, its absolutely my own fault, since i lately got “KS media rep” people which didnt know my longtime -i guess(better say hope) unbiased- history here, often seam to get the impression, anything “bad” i say is only because i am company related now and thats competition bashing! Even when i state it in the post (“thats not meant as ...”), doesnt help at all. About on more of the half of discussions lately i save up my opinion just because of that reason...... And-i dont know why- on the Z10 it is the worst of all...no wheel is as glorifiedand overhyped as this one! I mean, what is it what makes the owners setting the bar how they judge a wheel to an absolutely other level on this one then on any other wheel? The nice terminator optics??? This wheel has - again: in my 9wheels experience view- several weaknesses that somehow get overseen. Just to mention some: the relativly small batterysize, the max speed, the speed reducement on lower battery, the weight, the trolley, the (sky)light, the weak-underdimensioned board and parts inside, the very special drive characteristics because of the hard wide tire, missing calibration...puuh...did i forget any? And no..i am not hating the Z10...i even can imagine to have one as it has some drive fun! As my third/fourth wheel perhaps, i would have defintitly hold it after the 2 week testing.....But as THE one and only wheel? Really? Nope, not for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Marty Backe said: This is old and the consensus was the fall was due to a wheel wobble throwing the rider from the wheel. I even posted a slow-motion version of this video and you can clearly see that the wheel starts to wobble. I can't quite agree with the consensus then (it's the first time I see the vid, thanks for the slowmo @Marty Backe!). To me, the sequence of events starts with the wheel dipping forward for no obvious reason in the second frame after the tire reappears in the sun. Edited November 16, 2018 by Mono Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Mono said: I can't quite agree with the consensus then (it's the first time I see the vid, thanks for the slowmo @Marty Backe!). To me, the sequence of events starts with the wheel dipping forward for no obvious reason in the second frame after the tire reappears in the sun. That's what I was thinking ... here's a closer look and you can see the headlight and pedals tilted down in second photo. Edited November 16, 2018 by Nic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, Nic said: That's what I was thinking ... here's a closer look and you can see the headlight and pedals tilted down. To my eyes, one side of the wheel is dipping. In a cutout I would expect both pedals to dip forward. I guess we'll never agree or really know what happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 28 minutes ago, US69 said: Actually back at the time the crasher/Dean himself was discussing very heavily with Eddie Moi about it, where Eddie -just by video- also wants to convice him that its wheel wobble or overleaning. So the guy who crashed himself said it was -defintitly- a cutout, he speed up to the max speed to fast, guess it was on under 50% battery, and because of that cutout/crashed. But please....leave that all beside now! Whatever if was...wobble-cutout-overleaning.....that i mentioned this was just a reaction to the statement that there was NEVER any crashes or even problems reported with the Z10. I even said that the outside build quality is top notch on the z10! But saying there was/is no problems with the Z10 is just not the case. Tell that to the sellers, that have to open up a third of them because of BMS firmware problems. The EUC scene is phenomenal.... say something about problems with a certain wheel and all the owners go on the barricade, “protecting” their EUCs that heavy, like it is in really no other hobbyscene. It really is no fun. When i see some arguments here, like that it is a good thing only to recuperate one battery and have them running on different voltages, or that it might be even wanted that the wheel only runs on one battery pack- honestly my toenails get rolled.......and for my own best its good to leave the discussion then. I mean, its absolutely my own fault, since i lately got “KS media rep” people which didnt know my longtime -i guess(better say hope) unbiased- history here, often seam to get the impression, anything “bad” i say is only because i am company related now and thats competition bashing! Even when i state it in the post (“thats not meant as ...”), doesnt help at all. About on more of the half of discussions lately i save up my opinion just because of that reason...... And-i dont know why- on the Z10 it is the worst of all...no wheel is as glorifiedand overhyped as this one! I mean, what is it what makes the owners setting the bar how they judge a wheel to an absolutely other level on this one then on any other wheel? The nice terminator optics??? This wheel has - again: in my 9wheels experience view- several weaknesses that somehow get overseen. Just to mention some: the relativly small batterysize, the max speed, the speed reducement on lower battery, the weight, the trolley, the (sky)light, the weak-underdimensioned board and parts inside, the very special drive characteristics because of the hard wide tire, missing calibration...puuh...did i forget any? And no..i am not hating the Z10...i even can imagine to have one as it has some drive fun! As my third/fourth wheel perhaps, i would have defintitly hold it after the 2 week testing.....But as THE one and only wheel? Really? Nope, not for me If that's not hating the Z10, I'd like to see what you would write if you did hate it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 Any firmware issues can be fixed with updates. Hopefully I will get my Z10 before Xmas ... I'm still waiting and still happy with choosing a Z10 ... I don't need an MSX 100v to wipeout at 43 mph ... Z10 is plenty fast and I love the fat tyre. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Nic said: That's what I was thinking ... here's a closer look and you can see the headlight and pedals tilted down in second photo. AFAICS the wheel had already dipped in the first frame that you are showing. In the second frame the dip gets even further and the wobble starts. The rider already knows he is in serious trouble in the second frame (both arms up in the air). And even if a wobble started the chain of events, I don't think it should ever lead to a nose dip as deep as we can see in the second frame. Edited November 16, 2018 by Mono Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Girth Brooks Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 Unless the Ninebot Z10 is somehow (extremely doubtful) a lesser product than the other non-EUC products I and my son own of theirs and really abuse quite frequently then I cannot be convinced it is not the highest quality EUC you can buy. The second generation will likely have a bigger battery and more speed. I waited for the Z10 100% over another EUC brand simply over the quality that has been proven to me personally by Ninebot. I think many fans of other brands are relentlessly searching for cut-out failures (or anything really) with the Z10 simply because it seems to be a fairly common occurrence with GW or Inmotion wheels they own & love. You can argue this, but I've been reading constantly all over this forum for several weeks, and it is blatantly obvious that there is very real envy over the attention the Z10 gets over "more capable" wheels. The Z10 is certainly an oddball as compared to more traditional models and certainly has flaws, but quality and engineering damn are not on the list of negatives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
houseofjob Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 No wrist guards, knee pads, ... obvious rookie for any seasoned EUC rider who’s learned from past falls. Why do people still get stiffy’s for these newbie EUC fail posts? Forum goers here know newbie falls are super unreliable to draw any hard, grand-sweeping conclusions from, as the newb always blames the wheel, regardless (I should know, I’ve been the newb in this scenario before!) IMHO there’s nothing to be learned / gleaned from this tantalizing faceplant porn 💩 That said, I’m opening a brand new YouTube channel dedicated to only EUC faceplanting, 1M subs here we come! 🤠💩 And @US69 we’re all very biased here, just depends on how, and to what degree we admit it! Take me for example, my favorite Terminator optics were clearly Aanold’s Ray Bans in T2: Judgement Day 😎 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_from_NZ Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 19 minutes ago, houseofjob said: I’m opening a brand new YouTube channel dedicated to only EUC faceplanting, 1M subs here we come! Subbed. But seriously, have you seen my EUC crash video? I know its only the first time ive got on a wheel, but clearly the wheel is at fault... Actual. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 57 minutes ago, houseofjob said: That said, I’m opening a brand new YouTube channel dedicated to only EUC faceplanting, 1M subs here we come! 🤠💩 Will an animated re-creation be allowed? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) Is it just me or does the guy shooting the video have nerves of steel? He never wavered during the crash. Edited November 17, 2018 by Rehab1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerome Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 6 hours ago, Mono said: AFAICS the wheel had already dipped in the first frame that you are showing. In the second frame the dip gets even further and the wobble starts. The rider already knows he is in serious trouble in the second frame (both arms up in the air). And even if a wobble started the chain of events, I don't think it should ever lead to a nose dip as deep as we can see in the second frame. Huh? In a cutoff you don't know your in trouble, You simply hit the ground. The pedals are dipping forward because he is accelerating to hard. Riders, especially but not limited to new riders, are likely to blame themselves about as much as someone coming home busted from a casino is likely to say he was a big loser. Other than the MSX , no wheel is perfect and the Z10 is no exception. Cutting off, however, is not one of is imperfections. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post palachzzz Posted November 17, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) 10 hours ago, US69 said: Just to mention some: the relativly small batterysize, the max speed, the speed reducement on lower battery, the weight, the trolley, the (sky)light, the weak-underdimensioned board and parts inside, the very special drive characteristics because of the hard wide tire, missing calibration... It is very strange, that in the list of your weaknesses you list the specifications that are written everywhere, Ninebot users knows which battery, which maximum speed, and which weight they buying. The speed reducement inherent to most of wheel for safity reason. "weak-underdimensioned board and parts inside, the very special drive characteristics because of the hard wide tire" - I don't understand what do you mean there and why it is weakness. Сalibration can be restored in the way that is used for all old Ninebots without the application. The light is a known problem, and @Lukasz showed how to fix it in about the first video. Trolley - yes it is problem, and there are no solution yet. I don't know why, but in you post you talk a lot about people (Ninebot owners), but not about wheel itself. You state the wrong things, but when you was corrected you became so angry. I have already met this, but for some reasons it was only Kingsong owners, not Gotway, not Inmotion, only some of the Kingsong owners behave this way. What wrong with you guys? In general, I can write a list of weakness for each wheel of this year, and even without listing specifications, it will be large enough Edited November 17, 2018 by palachzzz 4 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post palachzzz Posted November 17, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted November 17, 2018 By the way, Ninebot Z10 speed limiter: 3 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) 13 hours ago, Jerome said: Huh? In a cutoff you don't know your in trouble, You simply hit the ground. The pedals are dipping forward because he is accelerating to hard. Riders, especially but not limited to new riders, are likely to blame themselves about as much as someone coming home busted from a casino is likely to say he was a big loser. Other than the MSX , no wheel is perfect and the Z10 is no exception. Cutting off, however, is not one of is imperfections. I agree that this was not a cutoff. As a side remark: the word cutoff is used in a loose sense by many of us when we refer to an overlean. I gave up on correcting the word usage (did it many times). I didn't use the word cutoff in this case (and I will continue using it only when I mean the motor turned off or idle). My analysis was that the fall was due to nose dipping as opposed to the apparent consensus that "the fall was due to a wheel wobble". I can't say for sure why the nose dipped. Quick acceleration is of course a possible reason. I can't judge the acceleration from the vid and I don't perceive a specific leaning action preceding the event. Judging from the parking cars, the speed is rather below 30km/h, which isn't a lot for a wheel with 45km/h maxspeed, but I don't know the battery status. If the acceleration was steady, ideally, tilt back should prevent this situation, but I doubt that acceleration is part of tilt back calculations on any wheel at this point in time (it should!). So it was quite possibly an overlean due to the lack of knowledge of how EUCs work and can be used. Edited November 17, 2018 by Mono 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED209 Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) 9 hours ago, Rehab1 said: Is it just me or does the guy shooting the video have nerves of steel? He never wavered during the crash. He must have assumed that the Z10 rider was attempting a new trick. Edited November 17, 2018 by Edddeus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
palachzzz Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 31 minutes ago, Mono said: the speed is rather below 30km/h It was at least 9.5 m/s or ~35 km/h after a falling. But maybe +- because of camera angle. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, palachzzz said: It was at least 9.5 m/s or ~35 km/h after a falling. But maybe +- because of camera angle. True, nice analysis, that should be pretty accurate (you took the frames right after the time count flipped, I checked That also suggests to me that he was considerably accelerating before. Edited November 17, 2018 by Mono Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) 11 hours ago, Rehab1 said: Is it just me or does the guy shooting the video have nerves of steel? He never wavered during the crash. No, I think he was toggling the anti-theft feature in the latest firmware release... Edited November 17, 2018 by Nic 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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