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Dangerous moutain riding - EUC limits ??


Pingouin

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Hi guys !

So you may know that I ride very often in the moutains, mostly with "14" Gotway EUC, I really love it because it creates a challenge, your skills & balance are put to the test every instant, there are suprising stuff you would never have thought of, slippery dirt, a root sticking out, rocks that will knock you off when bumping into your pedals..

It will exhaust you sometimes, if you ride for hours, but it's much more managable than foot hiking, the biggest effort being putting your weight on the pedals to climb & being able to keep your balance in extreme situations.

I really think every rider should try it, because it will improve your confidence in riding on uneven terrain, and your general skills, plus the most awsome sceneries can be found at the top of a moutain, and what a reward being able to reach something that seemed impossible !

However, I recently almost killed myself by riding near a cliff, and bumping into an unexpected root, I fell off but started running...my EUC went straight towards the cliff, I tried to catch it, I don't really know if it was a good idea because this reflex almost made me fall down the cliff with the EUC, as my hand instinctively grabbed the EUC to prevent it from falling, but the inertia of the EUC pulled me to a dangerous extend.. This episode remined be that anything can happen at ay time and that our instinct might take over during these moments, and this one is a dangerous one.

This is not the first time I put myself in danger, I also did it by tring to descend a rocky path with some sand, I almsot hit my head on a rock but thankfully I was able to put my arm forward (see picture), I'm thinking that I might be trying to push my limits too far, and the limits of the EUC too far, not sure.

Do you guys think that this kind of riding is worth it ? I still think so but I would like to have your honest opinion :)

aBovFor.jpg

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I occasionally use Paracord (nylon cord with a bit of stretch) and teether that to the handle just for runaway wheels.

I do occasionally ride hills with my 14 inchers but not the way you or Marty do it.

I trolley it a lot as a mobile energy saving cane, and where there's doubt I quickly trolley it. Basically I use the wheel to quickly go through the flat boring bits.

Be mindful that one of the owners of Segway was killed when he fell off a cliff while on it.

If you get stranded with low battery power and you wheeled in, it's just pure misery, absolute misery, trolleying the wheel back several miles to civilization. I've never had a dead wheel but I have had to walk miles on a few occasions.

You just don't realize how vast the distances are on a wheel that rolls at 14 mph and then you have to walk that at 3 mph.

Much worse has to be lugging a dead wheel over hill and dale.

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I love trail riding.  Haven't done much "mountain" riding, but certainly some hills and rock etc.  I love doing it, but in Maine there are so many ticks that it deters me from doing it too much.  The last time I went in the woods I ended up with over 20 ticks on me...trails were amazing, challenging and everything that makes them worth doing, but the ticks kinda put a damper on the finish...As @LanghamP mentioned, I think that using a tether would be a good way to avoid making a simple fall turn into something more dangerous (like falling off a cliff) :shock2:

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Definitely worth it! Very impressed the MCM3 can do that (at least with your weight). And you will want a small and most of all light wheel for this, so you can more easily twist the wheel to keep balance. Also, downhills, a bigger/heavier wheels really feels more unsafe to ride. Even my ACM feels big going down really steep offroad hills. Light really is better for this kind of riding.

I would not use a tether, let the wheel come to rest by itself and you make sure you care about your safety first. Tether might pull you off balance, make the wheel hit your legs, or (worst case) drag you down a cliff with the wheel;)

You're also very right that this builds skill very fast.

Love that picture, this is exactly what I wanted from an ideal wheel.

3 hours ago, LanghamP said:

Be mindful that one of the owners of Segway was killed when he fell off a cliff while on it.

Well if you don't look where you're going, or if you are not in the mindset "What would happen if I fall right now?" all the time for this, your own fault. You also can't run down such paths on foot with your head in the clouds. You just need to act like you are on the rough terrain you are.

3 hours ago, LanghamP said:

If you get stranded with low battery power and you wheeled in, it's just pure misery, absolute misery, trolleying the wheel back several miles to civilization. I've never had a dead wheel but I have had to walk miles on a few occasions.

You just don't realize how vast the distances are on a wheel that rolls at 14 mph and then you have to walk that at 3 mph.

Much worse has to be lugging a dead wheel over hill and dale.

Trolley? You mean carry:D Very true, you get places very quick with a wheel and walking back is so much slower.

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17 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

Definitely worth it! Very impressed the MCM3 can do that (at least with your weight). And you will want a small and most of all light wheel for this, so you can more easily twist the wheel to keep balance. Also, downhills, a bigger/heavier wheels really feels more unsafe to ride. Even my ACM feels big going down really steep offroad hills. Light really is better for this kind of riding.

I would not use a tether, let the wheel come to rest by itself and you make sure you care about your safety first. Tether might pull you off balance, make the wheel hit your legs, or (worst case) drag you down a cliff with the wheel;)

You're also very right that this builds skill very fast.

Love that picture, this is exactly what I wanted from an ideal wheel.

Yeah, I don't reall know if a heavier rider could do it, the MCM3 has 800-1800W power, not much compared to the 1500-4400W ACM, but at least the cables don't overheat :D

It's only a 340Wh battery, so for a heavier rider I guess a 680Wh would be a must, I can ride about 22km in the moutains before reaching the 20% mark, it regens during the descent but the climbs are very power demanding. I've tested my ACM on the same terrain, it's much quicker in the descent (on flat) but it's weight that makes it sable when speeding, makes it unstable on uneven terrain, let's no talke about the Monster...not suited for my riding in the moutains because unlike @Marty Backe's trails there are a bunch of pebbles, sticks & roots everywhere so balance can be lost quite easily with something as tall and heavy as the Monster.

I think that since I've began to ride often on moutain trails, I am a much better rider than I used to be, even when you think you've reached a good skill level, there is always so much more to learn !

Oh, one last thing, the MCM3 pedals are known to be slippery, when they are covered in dirt, in combination with sandals, it can scare you from time to time while riding over pebbles !

2 hours ago, Maximus said:

I love trail riding.  Haven't done much "mountain" riding, but certainly some hills and rock etc.  I love doing it, but in Maine there are so many ticks that it deters me from doing it too much.  The last time I went in the woods I ended up with over 20 ticks on me...trails were amazing, challenging and everything that makes them worth doing, but the ticks kinda put a damper on the finish...As @LanghamP mentioned, I think that using a tether would be a good way to avoid making a simple fall turn into something more dangerous (like falling off a cliff) :shock2:

@Maximus @LanghamP I don't thing using a tether would be less dangerous, I guess it could get stuck in branches and also if my EUC does fall off a cliff, it might just take me with it :D

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14 minutes ago, Pingouin said:

if my EUC does fall off a cliff, it might just take me with it :D

I can't say from personal experience, as I don't use a tether, but I keep thinking that it would be a good idea.  I ride on trails that have water off the edges and occasionally I have to jump off my EUC and grab the top handle to ensure the wheel doesn't run off.  The tether would be something that you would hold onto, but not something that is attached to you, so if the wheel is out of control and you don't feel safe holding on, I think you'd just let go rather than letting it take you over the cliff :) .  I could see it being a pain if you had to avoid tree limbs a lot, but I think that the suggestion was just as an alternative to bending over and potentially losing your balance as you try to control the 30 pound wheel while your center of gravity is moving toward the edge of the cliffs.  Best of luck with the mountain riding.  I'm looking forward to doing more of it myself and maybe I'll try a tether so I can give a first hand account of the experience...

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I put the loose ends of the teether in my pocket; I want to be able to pull the wheel off balance when it starts to roll downhill without stopping.

I started using the occasional teether when I saw just how amazingly far a wheel can roll on its own. Get it just right and I assume a wheel will roll forever...

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If I had money then I would ride and crash doing sketchy things. When I first got my wheel I did challenge myself over mostly rough trails and grassy steep hills, and then I did that less as I grasped our wheels are more like delicate sports cars that easily break, their sensors are very easily knocked a kilter, and repairing them looks like a pain. Even getting a flat to be an hour long repair job.

I do go on not-rough unpaved trails, but I guard my EUC with my life. I use it more as my utility vehicle that I need to get back, and while enjoying the wheel is my primary reason for going out I also understand it's my ticket home.

I wonder if Uber can pick me up on some of these trails if my wheel breaks down.

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I agree with everything you've been saying. I just wish Gotway would come out with a powerful high capacity (800wh+) wheel with a wide tire. As it stands I think KingSong still owns this segment of the market with the 14C and the upcoming 14S.

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I find it easy to picture other people doing it, but hard to picture myself doing it.  

Trails are actually the main place I bought an EUC for ... but not dangerous ones.  I'm also thinking of going with one of my dogs, so i have to be extra careful.  I wouldn't want to knock him off a cliff or just panic or hurt him.  

I'm no daredevil either.  In fact I'm pretty nervous around heights. 

I think you also have to ask yourself how disposable you feel your wheel is.  If you crash or just make some ridiculous error in judgment and your wheel flies off a cliff or into an inaccessible gully ... are you okay with just swallowing the loss?   

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I like mountain ride and ridding on uneven terrain too. Two of us rode on this mountain(again) Yesterday and the steepest is 32% according to Google Earth.
 P1070925s.jpg
Both EUC of us(Mspuer3) got over heated because of this.

Here is what we did last month.
23-cliff.thumb.jpg.17c8c12295b3006790ee1d4ac8121cf4.jpg

It is dangerous but manageable, and most of all fun, start at easy one and riding slow.

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1 minute ago, zlymex said:

I like mountain ride and ridding on uneven terrain too. Two of us rode on this mountain(again) Yesterday and 

Here is what we did last month.
23-cliff.thumb.jpg.17c8c12295b3006790ee1d4ac8121cf4.jpg

It is dangerous but manageable, and most of all fun, start at easy one and riding slow.

Wow you are a confident rider!  I would even feel a bit nervous walking on a trail like this.  You have almost no room for error or for a little bit of bad luck.

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21 minutes ago, zlymex said:

I like mountain ride and ridding on uneven terrain too. Two of us rode on this mountain(again) Yesterday and the steepest is 32% according to Google Earth.
 P1070925s.jpg
Both EUC of us(Mspuer3) got over heated because of this.

Here is what we did last month.
23-cliff.thumb.jpg.17c8c12295b3006790ee1d4ac8121cf4.jpg

It is dangerous but manageable, and most of all fun, start at easy one and riding slow.

That's my kind of riding :thumbup:  Now I would probably break the switchback trail into a few sections separated by a few minutes of rest to avoid stressing the cabling.

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25 minutes ago, Dingfelder said:

Wow you are a confident rider!  I would even feel a bit nervous walking on a trail like this.  You have almost no room for error or for a little bit of bad luck.

Thanks. I think confidence comes from practice as we used to ride a lot more difficult but dangerless tracks

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11 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

@zlymex Nice photos!

What is your and the other guy's weight? Makes a lot of difference. @Pingouin is quite light too. Assuming 20 kg wheel, 25% incline for a 60 kg person is the same power usage as 20% incline for an 80kg person. So quite the difference.

That's right. My weight is 75kg(my wheel is 23kg) and the guy with me Yesterday is about the same. The friend on the photo weigh less at about 62kg.

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11 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

That's my kind of riding :thumbup:  Now I would probably break the switchback trail into a few sections separated by a few minutes of rest to avoid stressing the cabling.

I've seen the bad cable:P, mine have already tubeless to dissipate better.

One more photo
594bdf1b1b10f_webwxgetmsgimg(8).thumb.jpg.4c491cd8b36319b35bf53d90f68bbb14.jpg

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35 minutes ago, zlymex said:

I've seen the bad cable:P, mine have already tubeless to dissipate better.

One more photo
594bdf1b1b10f_webwxgetmsgimg(8).thumb.jpg.4c491cd8b36319b35bf53d90f68bbb14.jpg

I'm curious, since it looks like you enjoy remote riding like I do; do you have contingency plans for if your wheel breaks down?  I now try and always ride with at least one other person, and now I'm looking into creating a harness that would allow me to hoist the wheel on my back so I could hike out.

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38 minutes ago, zlymex said:

I've seen the bad cable:P, mine have already tubeless to dissipate better.

One more photo

What does tubeless mean?

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