Hunka Hunka Burning Love Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duf Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 I would really like some feedback from a Gotway representative regarding these issues. The only thing I ever seem to hear them say is "make sure to wear safety gear". There seems to be a severe lack of accountability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fat Unicyclist Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 5 minutes ago, Duf said: There seems to be a severe lack of accountability. Welcome to China, Mr Duf! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duf Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 Just now, The Fat Unicyclist said: Welcome to China, Mr Duf! Yep indeed, nothing but the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxLinux Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 12 hours ago, zlymex said: This is because the incident happened to one my friends when we rode together in a golf course, he fried his V3. The reason: the motor connector is overheated and the insulation plastic was melted resulting in the shortage of the two connectors. As usual, proper testing would have enabled Gotway to discover this issue BEFORE beginning to ship wheels to customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EUC Extreme Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 I use EC5 connectors batteries and motor wiring. There has never been a problem. But at the same time I also change my thicker wires. All wires are 10AWG. Engine axle to double the original cables. Thicker is not possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud Posted December 10, 2016 Author Share Posted December 10, 2016 12 minutes ago, EUC Extreme said: I use EC5 connectors batteries and motor wiring. There has never been a problem. But at the same time I also change my thicker wires. All wires are 10AWG. Engine axle to double the original cables. Thicker is not possible. Thank you @EUC Extreme. If the wires are not replaced, would it be possible to use EC5 connectors or are they too large for the 14 awg wire? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoother Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 Heat generation in electrical wire is caused several ways: . too many amps for the wire gauge . wire not allowed to dissipate the heat it generates, due to traveling through insulating material . An area of poor conductivity relative to the rest of the circuit and others. any place where the current can't pass as freely as the rest of the circuit will become hot, or hotter that the rest of the circuit, if the resistance exceeds that required to pass the current without heat being generated. If there is only one spot, the heat generated at this spot with be conducted along the wire and heat it up. It is accepted that wires can get warm during normal use. And it is accepted that extra heat is generated during periodic, extreme use. But when extreme use becomes sustained over a period of time, the heat overall, and the heat specifically at a point of high resistance, can become too great, and insulation starts to melt. And maybe solder starts to flow too, if heat is sufficient. And in extreme cases, fire erupts. additionally, as we all know metal expands and contracts on every heat cycle, imagine your overheated crimp joint expanding and contracting just a tiny bit, every time you climb a steep hill, or accelerate hard, or brake hard, or descend a steep hill Can you see that joint loosening?. Now add the smoke and other gasses created when the insulation burns, and imagine it depositing everywhere in the vacinity, including your crimped surfaces. Can you imagine the resistance going up? dont get me wrong, crimping is used a lot in electrical work. my last job was to wire 100 apartments in a re purposed office building. Every floor had 2 riser closets and each had 5x 50mm csa (cross sectional area) cables to connect to the distribution boards ( imagine copper as thick as your little finger) . Every one was crimped, but I had industrial sized crimp fittings and a crimper the size of small bolt cutter. But for a EUC that IM riding, solder and crimp, or direct wire to wire solder. I don't need any more reasons to face plant. my last personal project was renovating a large motorcycle (Honda ST100 with abs and traction control) there was a lot of rewriting to do and additional circuits. Most wires i soldered, but some I crimped (mostly because my local store didn't stock solder fittings) the number of crimps that just pulled loose I couldn't count on one hand. Hobby crimp fitting aren't that great. Come to think of it, when I get home, I might go through the bike again replacing those crimps with solders fittings, @zlymex has all the answers to all of this. He's got his own Little EUC community over there that depends on him to sort out the problems, and his experience is vast. He produces nice clear photos to back up his points. I take his word as gospel. Besides, look at that rack of equipment! He must know what he's doing. ? Oh , and @EUC Extreme too. He has also seen all the ways an EUC fails, and improved most of the weak spots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jer Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 Took a look at my connectors on my V3,and they seemed to be pretty secure, plenty of solder. The other end crimped and withstood a good tug. I have confidence in the connections on on my machine so I will leave them as is. However I would still recommend everyone to check theirs as this could hurt an awful lot and has the potential to be even worse, if it happens at the wrong place and time. Jer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EUC Extreme Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 4 hours ago, Cloud said: Thank you @EUC Extreme. If the wires are not replaced, would it be possible to use EC5 connectors or are they too large for the 14 awg wire? Thanks In my opinion you can use. In my opinion it is always that, rather too large than too small Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nomad Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 If I have enough cable length what I did before was strip the ends twice as long and then create two V shaped hooks of the ends. Hook them together and then tightly twist each end back around itself. This is stronger mechanically than just intertwining and/or twisting IMO. And don't forget to put on the shrinktube on the cable the first thing before putting the ends together.. Then apply the solder and finally warm the shinktube over it with the shaft of the soldering iron (not the tip). Well that's how I did it in the past the few times I ever soldered anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 On 12/8/2016 at 10:57 PM, jer said: <snip> Gotway should comment as to whether or not this is potentially systemic or a very rare occurrence. Jer Anybody who's been involved with EUCs for any period of time knows that Gotway's quality control is near non-existent and some of their design choices are questionable. I've rarely seen them comment on anything. The only reason they stay in business is that they make high performance wheels and have no competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donafello Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 5 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: Anybody who's been involved with EUCs for any period of time knows that Gotway's quality control is near non-existent and some of their design choices are questionable. I've rarely seen them comment on anything. The only reason they stay in business is that they make high performance wheels and have no competition. I hope that soon we get a company that really makes a high performance wheel and has great customer support and quality control. I guarantee you that it would do very well once word gets out about them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 20 hours ago, Scully said: Thanks for the heads up, I'm not loving the idea of messing with it - might cause issues with the warranty. I think the Gotway warranty is worth about as much as the paper it's printed on, so don't let that stop you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 14 hours ago, Duf said: I would really like some feedback from a Gotway representative regarding these issues. The only thing I ever seem to hear them say is "make sure to wear safety gear". There seems to be a severe lack of accountability. I've given up waiting to hear feedback from Gotway. If it's ever happened I'm not aware of it. We desperately need a competitor for the performance wheels that Gotway sells. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donafello Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 8 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: I've given up waiting to hear feedback from Gotway. If it's ever happened I'm not aware of it. We desperately need a competitor for the performance wheels that Gotway sells. When I decided to purchase a Msuper I purchased knowing that any problems I had I would be the one fixing it. With the company being in china its almost impossible to get any warranty work done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud Posted December 10, 2016 Author Share Posted December 10, 2016 21 hours ago, Scully said: Thanks for the heads up, I'm not loving the idea of messing with it - might cause issues with the warranty. If one doesnt feel comfortable resoldering, then definitely dont do anything. I woukdnt do anything either if my connections didnt fail. I guess the point i was trying to make was at least open the wheel up and pull on the wires to check they are holding. Replace if they are not holding well or if you are good and soldering and have experience with this kind of thing. @zlymex or someone else, can you please recommend a particular type of shrink wrap and where to buy it , that i should use either over the wires when i solder them together , or maybe over the wire and the connector as im more likely to use connectors like Xt150? Do i understand it correctly that after i slip the connector cover over the metal part, it covers the petal but doesnt go over more to extend beyond the metal? Id like somethin that cover the connection and goes beyond it over the insulated wire. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xebeche Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 Reading frequently about all these various types of problems and failures on Gotway wheels (V3 especially), it seems to me that we should start to vote against obviously non existent quality control on Gotway wheels with the money in our pockets ! Because as long as there is enough people who buy those wheels accepting that the QC is non existent, they really have no reason to do anything about that... I know that we are all passionate about our wheels, but shouldn't the fastest, strongest wheel, also be the one which takes all possible safety and quality aspects most seriously? V3 for example costs 1650 EUR in Europe (820Wh version). Just for comparison, for 2000 EUR you can get CUBE E-Bike with Bosch motor and 500Wh battery - that means both veeeery nice bicycle from known manufacturer, together with the whole very high quality electric part (motor, battery, display, controller). My point is we are not talking peanut money for these wheels here and we should expect and demand some quality from manufacturers for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxLinux Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 1 hour ago, Cloud said: Id like something that cover the connection and goes beyond it over the insulated wire. Heat shrinkable tubing usually comes in long lengths (approx. 6-12 inches) that you can cut to the length you want. It's a tube that you slip over your connection. Choose the smallest diameter that is big enough to fit over your connection. When you apply heat to the tubing it shrinks very tightly over the connection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 4 hours ago, Marty Backe said: Anybody who's been involved with EUCs for any period of time knows that Gotway's quality control is near non-existent and some of their design choices are questionable. I've rarely seen them comment on anything. The only reason they stay in business is that they make high performance wheels and have no competition. did anybody see the v3s+ review from speedyfeet? they sent him some wheels...where ALL wheels on both side were equipped with only the right pedal version(left/right pedals are different)...so total asynchron..... Really, some of their workers seam to be blind...and then think about them doing important solder work.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxLinux Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 5 minutes ago, KingSong69 said: think about them doing important solder work A shipment with all wheels missing a pedal. THAT IS SAD AND DISGRACEFUL!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 30 minutes ago, MaxLinux said: A shipment with all wheels missing a pedal. THAT IS SAD AND DISGRACEFUL!! Not missing! sorry, i wasnt exact enough.... the v3 pedals are different for each side...but this batch had the right version pedal on the left and the right side....whichjust looks silly....and could be seen directly. look at the video...speedyfeet on youtube....its a good laughter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esaj Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 5 hours ago, Cloud said: @zlymex or someone else, can you please recommend a particular type of shrink wrap and where to buy it , that i should use either over the wires when i solder them together , or maybe over the wire and the connector as im more likely to use connectors like Xt150? Do i understand it correctly that after i slip the connector cover over the metal part, it covers the petal but doesnt go over more to extend beyond the metal? Id like somethin that cover the connection and goes beyond it over the insulated wire. Thanks! I don't know if there's much difference between different heat shrink tubings, there aren't any really high voltages in play here, so mostly they're there just to stop things from touching. With real high voltages (kilovolts-range), you'd maybe need to take into account the strike-through voltages, but for this, my (hobbyist) opinion would be that pretty much anything that fits goes And like someone said above, remember to slip the tubing on the wire before soldering, I've done the mistake of forgetting it far too many times Kinda hard to slip the tube into a wire that's connected to something on both ends... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve454 Posted December 11, 2016 Share Posted December 11, 2016 On 12/9/2016 at 0:50 AM, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said: Those Gotway connectors appear to be non-serviceable so they likely insert permanently into their housings. @esaj did some nice connector work with his battery packs. Maybe he can recommend something. I did find these: http://www.andersonpower.com/us/en/products/sb-sb-boots/sb-50.aspx http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/crimp-solder.htm @Hunka Hunka Burning Love that is the best soldering tutorial I have ever seen, not even a video just pictures but outstanding photography and super clear explanation! The second one I mean, I didn't watch the first one yet. But wow, I never even heard of putting the solder and flux in first, crimping, and then heating to solder inside the crimp. That's some next level information, where do you find this stuff? Information guru or master of links is what you are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve454 Posted December 11, 2016 Share Posted December 11, 2016 6 hours ago, xebeche said: shouldn't the fastest, strongest wheel, also be the one which takes all possible safety and quality aspects most seriously? Not necessarily, that is part of the appeal of the Gotway, that it is fast and dangerous, like a Ferrari, you get a lot of performance but you have to know that with a focus on performance there might be corners cut on safety. But I get where you are coming from, and I agree, it should also be the safest wheel, as long as it is not going full speed. Especially with the cost of the wheel, the quality of the electrical system should be second to none. It should be the very best wiring available, everything in the wiring should be double checked at the factory, with a quality control mark inside the case. Case in point, I have a 2009 Kia sportage, just yesterday got a recall notice that the HECU (hydraulic electrical control unit) could be susceptible to corrosion, overheat, and cause a fire. Apparently there have been a few fires, especially near salt water environments. (probably from people living near the ocean) If riding in a steady speed I think these things never fail until the battery gives out IMO. DOH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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