Sam Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 They are located in Singapore and it says on their website that they ship worldwide by air which is the main reason I wanted to order a kingsong 680 watts from them but I just want to know if anyone has ordered a electric unicycle from their website and is it safe to order? I live in PNG just north of Australia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistagear Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 KS have informed the market that Wheelies is the only distributor for Singapore , therefore no warranty from other sellers. In PNG that leaves you with choice between Wheelies in Singapore or Milbay in Australia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esaj Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 2 hours ago, Mistagear said: KS have informed the market that Wheelies is the only distributor for Singapore , therefore no warranty from other sellers. In PNG that leaves you with choice between Wheelies in Singapore or Milbay in Australia Or from anywhere else in the world, probably including directly from China. You have weird consumer protection if it works like that... If I recall correctly, here it works something like this (from consumers point-of-view): even if there's no actual warranty, the seller is responsible that the product remains usable "for a reasonably expectable lifetime" for such product ("defect liability"), warranty or not. Warranty cannot limit the requirements of Consumer Protection Act. Factory may give the reseller a guarantee or not, but between customer and reseller, it's the reseller's responsibility to handle the guarantee and/or defect liability, even out of their own pocket if they ordered from China and the original manufacturer refuses to give parts/etc for warranty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowMo Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 Tell that to @tinawong. KS has weird exclusive distributor warranty rights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esaj Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 On 19.3.2016 at 11:21 AM, SlowMo said: Tell that to @tinawong. KS has weird exclusive distributor warranty rights. But that shouldn't affect the responsibilities of the reseller according to local consumer protection laws... If they're selling goods without manufacturer/importer warranty, they take the risk of having to pay for warranty repairs themselves. But I don't know how it works if the manufacturer is in country A, reseller is in country B and the customer is in country C (ordering from abroad). Probably best to look up the consumer protection laws for each country. [REDACTED]. I mixed up Milbay with another company who started a small war about warranty issues before. See my latter post in this thread: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neale Gray Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 Moderator "the nonpartisan presiding officer" ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esaj Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 1 minute ago, Neale Gray said: Moderator "the nonpartisan presiding officer" ?? Nope, we're not. We're humans, have flaws and have our own biases. As I see it, the only requirement pretty much is that we're not affiliated with any manufacturer or company, and are "fair" in our actions (regarding hiding/deleting posts and such), working for the best of the community as a whole. The thing I clinged onto in this thread, is pretty much: 3 hours ago, Mistagear said: KS have informed the market that Wheelies is the only distributor for Singapore , therefore no warranty from other sellers. In PNG that leaves you with choice between Wheelies in Singapore or Milbay in Australia No, it does not leave you only with those two choices. You can view the issue from different angles (like how does the local consumer law work on this? Even if there is no factory warranty, is the reseller obliged to make repairs?), and then decide what's best for you. Ordering from Milbay, Wheelies or somewhere entirely different place? I think that telling people why they should not buy from anyone else except you works a lot worse than telling people why they should buy from you. Stuff like "we've got spare-parts in stock all the time and our own technicians who can repair your wheel in a matter of days, instead of weeks waiting for parts" would probably work better than "if you don't buy from us you don't get any warranty", which sounds inplausible (or then Australia has very weak consumer protection). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neale Gray Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 Ok clearly @esaj has some unknown problem as certainly Milbay have no idea who he is (hiding in anonymity ) He certainly has strong opinions on Australian consumer law for a person supposedly in Finland, as expected he comments are inaccurate with no basis other than his own opinion as he states. . For the real information about Australian consumer law and Milbay Australia's warranty visit http://www.milbay.com.au/CustomerViews/WarrantyInfo A quick check anywhere online will reveal that Australia has some of the worlds highest standards and certification processes. Australia does not accept amateur resellers, check out the list of those who sold un certified hoverboard products for xmas 2015. They are yet to receive their fines. https://www.recalls.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/1081137 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esaj Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 16 minutes ago, Neale Gray said: Ok clearly @esaj has some unknown problem as certainly Milbay have no idea who he is (hiding in anonymity ) I'm not even sure what you meant by that, but sure, I have my own problems, which are entirely unrelated to Milbay Actually, my nickname in the forums is my first name and the first letter of my surname. 16 minutes ago, Neale Gray said: He certainly has strong opinions on Australian consumer law for a person supposedly in Finland, as expected he comments are inaccurate with no basis other than his own opinion as he states. . Yes, those are my own opinions, and I'm not familiar with Australian consumer law. But as you state that: 16 minutes ago, Neale Gray said: For the real information about Australian consumer law and Milbay Australia's warranty visit http://www.milbay.com.au/CustomerViews/WarrantyInfo A quick check anywhere online will reveal that Australia has some of the worlds highest standards and certification processes. Based on this (no, I didn't go through the links except by quickly skimming ), I'd expect that even if Kingsong (for example) wouldn't give any factory warranty, an "unofficial" Australian reseller would have to replace or repair a faulty unit. Which kind of makes the "no warranty" -point moot, but I could be wrong. 16 minutes ago, Neale Gray said: Australia does not accept amateur resellers, check out the list of those who sold un certified hoverboard products for xmas 2015. They are yet to receive their fines. https://www.recalls.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/1081137 It's good that you have such strong system to weed out bad resellers. But how about you'd concentrate on telling people why they should buy from you, instead of why they shouldn't buy from else? The message so far seems to have been "buy from us or you don't get any warranty, ever!" sounds downright hostile, and will likely scare people away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neale Gray Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 For those unaware of the consequences of their comments please read carefully http://cs.stanford.edu/people/eroberts/cs201/projects/defamation-and-the-internet/sections/precedent/cases.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esaj Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 15 minutes ago, Neale Gray said: For those unaware of the consequences of their comments please read carefully http://cs.stanford.edu/people/eroberts/cs201/projects/defamation-and-the-internet/sections/precedent/cases.html Also, to get more detailed information and up-to-date information (those court cases are from the 90's), here: https://www.eff.org/issues/bloggers/legal/liability/defamation Edit: Do note that most of these are related to US laws, so not really that applicable here, but just in general. Know your rights etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriull Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 Time to take out the popcorn and a beer - seems to get entertaining around here... Would be interesting which comments here are defamatory after reading this thread again carefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Eucist Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 1 hour ago, Neale Gray said: For those unaware of the consequences of their comments please read carefully http://cs.stanford.edu/people/eroberts/cs201/projects/defamation-and-the-internet/sections/precedent/cases.html Did you not just prove @esaj's point EXACTLY with that reply? (excerpt below) 4 hours ago, esaj said: I've seen their scare-tactics and over-abundant self-advertising in totally unrelated topics. Bashing competition. In my eyes, Milbay is a bully company, and I wouldn't personally want to deal with a reseller that acts like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmethvin Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 7 hours ago, Mistagear said: KS have informed the market that Wheelies is the only distributor for Singapore , therefore no warranty from other sellers. In PNG that leaves you with choice between Wheelies in Singapore or Milbay in Australia Is there a link somewhere to where they have "informed the market" such as a list of authorized distributors? The terms page for esports.com.sg says the manufacturer offers a 6 month warranty, are you saying this is false? Can we get some official source for that such as King Song? How do these terms differ from other distributors? There is nothing illegal about the gray market. It's just not liked by most authorized distributors, especially where they have carved out geographical territories. Manufacturers may actually like it because it increases sales, but they won't openly encourage it since it can make their official distributors mad. To me it doesn't matter whether the seller is "authorized" only whether the seller is trustworthy. If something breaks that isn't my fault, will they fix it? How much will it cost me just in shipping to get it fixed? Will they send me repair parts instead of making me send the whole EUC back? the esports.com.sg page answers those questions at least, although I haven't seen first-hand reports from their customers. Buying locally has a LOT of benefits. If I lived near Brisbane Australia I would definitely think about Milbay, or WheelGo in the UK, or electricunicyclereviews.com in the San Francisco area. Face-to-face interactions often help to work out any problems and definitely save money on shipping. Once I have to start shipping an EUC around to deal with the warranty, though, the equation changes for me and distance is less of an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomek Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 wow, @Neale Gray, perhaps @esaj went too far in accusing you of being a bully, but in response you actually proved him right .') no need to breathe fire at each other guys! what's this thing with KS resellers being so tipsy? first @kingsong-france was dissing @1RadWerkstatt, and now this... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowMo Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 Kingsong is the best! Who knows, they might be able to buy out Ninebot one day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viti Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 35 minutes ago, SlowMo said: Kingsong is the best! Who knows, they might be able to buy out Ninebot one day. mhh, maybe ... but not if the KingSong resellers more and more get infected with this 'no warranty in the world but from me-disease' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paco Gorina Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 I completely agree with @dmethvin, I bought my Ninebot locally so I can solve any problems, have a correct Invoice and may enforce my rights if something is bad. Also I didn't need to fight the transport, etc. Just picked it. Local comerce has a lot to offer most if they maintain price (more or less) and are serious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esaj Posted March 21, 2016 Share Posted March 21, 2016 On 19.3.2016 at 6:43 PM, Tomek said: wow, @Neale Gray, perhaps @esaj went too far in accusing you of being a bully, but in response you actually proved him right .') no need to breathe fire at each other guys! what's this thing with KS resellers being so tipsy? first @kingsong-france was dissing @1RadWerkstatt, and now this... Ahem, now this is embarrassing... I had actually mixed up Milbay with the KS 16 Certification & Warranty -topic that Kingsong France started a while back, didn't really hit me until now: Not that I still like Neale's way of placing ads everywhere (that's why his posts must go through moderator approval each time, I personally approved all his posts in this thread) or referring to others as "amateur online resellers", but it turns out I was barking at the wrong tree here. Sorry about that. You did threaten to sue me though (but considering the timeline, I called you bully first). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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