Sherman-S 3600wh: 100V, 20", suspension, 97lb

[MrMonoWheel]

6 minutes ago, Mango said:

When I bought my og Sherman for $3800 cad through aliexpress, I was never charged for shipping, taxes, duties or customs. So I am not too concerned it will be different for the Sherman S.

Everything I've bought big or small on AliExpress has never been charged anything after I paid the seller. Google is giving me conflicting information about VAT in the US, but I'm also not concerned.

[mrelwood]

20 hours ago, Rawnei said:

In Europe they sneak them in by train and evade all of that.

In my understanding they ship the wheel as a company internal shipment to an EU warehouse which is duty free, and from there they can ship the product to the customer without tax and customs fees.

Edited November 27, 2022 by mrelwood

[techyiam]

Marty's AVS Races, Day 1 video shows Marty trying out the Sherman-S for the time, and gave his first impressions. 

He doesn't think it rides like a Sherman. 

Time-stamped. 

 

 

Edited November 27, 2022 by techyiam

[MrMonoWheel]

28 minutes ago, techyiam said:

Marty's AVS Races, Day 1 video shows Marty trying out the Sherman-S for the time, and gave his first impressions. 

He doesn't think it rides like a Sherman. 

Time-stamped. 

 

 

Always good to hear a variety of opinions. I can see how he would think the wheel is top heavy and unwieldy, but as he said after a while it would become normal for anyone.

[techyiam]

5 minutes ago, Unicycle Santa said:

Always good to hear a variety of opinions. I can see how he would think the wheel is top heavy and unwieldy, but as he said after a while it would become normal for anyone.

I have no doubt he is right.

The Abrams weighs essentially the same as the Sherman-S, albeit with lower pedal height on the Abrams.

I was really pleasantly surprised how the Abrams rides very similarly to my V12. At a walking pace, if you are too much leaned away from the vertical, you will feel the heft of the Abrams. Otherwise, it is very manageable. I never have problems balancing the Abrams with one leg at a stop. In contrast, when I was moving from the T3 to the V12, I had to be conscientious of how I balance the wheel coming to a stop. I was lacking in leg strength then. There is more gyro on the Abrams. But if you are cornering on the Abrams with the right technique, it turns very similarly to a V12. With the wrong technique, the Abrams may not turn, more so than the V12.

And I am still riding the Abrams without pads.

Drawing from this experience, I am thinking that it may not be that bad adapting to the Sherman-S or the V12.

And since you are already riding a wheel with high pedal height and 14" rim, maybe you could adapt to the Sherman-S or V13 quite readily. 

[KiwiMark]

5 hours ago, techyiam said:

He doesn't think it rides like a Sherman. 

 

 

Not a problem to me, I've never ridden a Sherman.  I'm going to have to get used to my Sherman S no matter how it rides.  I've never ridden a suspension wheel either.  I've never ridden a wheel with pedals that high.  

Then again, when I received my RS I had never ridden an EUC.  I managed to learn to ride an EUC and I'm sure I can learn to ride a taller suspension wheel.

[InfiniteWheelie]

5 hours ago, techyiam said:

And I am still riding the Abrams without pads.

How is this even possible? How do you not just fall off the wheel on your ass when trying to brake? How do you apply more than a tiny amount of torque on the wheel?

I don't understand why someone would even try to ride like that (unless they're simply too broke for pads).

Edited November 28, 2022 by InfiniteWheelie

[techyiam]

41 minutes ago, KiwiMark said:

Not a problem to me, I've never ridden a Sherman.  I'm going to have to get used to my Sherman S no matter how it rides.  I've never ridden a suspension wheel either.  I've never ridden a wheel with pedals that high.  

Then again, when I received my RS I had never ridden an EUC.  I managed to learn to ride an EUC and I'm sure I can learn to ride a taller suspension wheel.

Totally. 

I found that the V12 rode very differently than my T3. The T3 rode very similarly to the RS-19, EX.N, and the Commander.  It took me a bit to learn to ride the V12. I now enjoy to ride both types of wheels.

Now that I have gotten used to the V12's non-dipping pedals during sharp turns, I need to watch myself on the Abrams. Thankfully the pedal height on the Abrams is quite high, so I am not scrapping pedals readily. 

[Clem604]

6 hours ago, Unicycle Santa said:

Always good to hear a variety of opinions. I can see how he would think the wheel is top heavy and unwieldy, but as he said after a while it would become normal for anyone.

He's right, I had a chance to ride it around the Eevees shop and it is top heavy although it's nothing I couldn't get used to. Man that suspension is so smooth 😍

[techyiam]

3 minutes ago, Clem604 said:

He's right, I had a chance to ride it around the Eevees shop and it is top heavy although it's nothing I couldn't get used to. Man that suspension is so smooth 😍

Thanks for reminding me, I need to go down there to see whether the Sherman-S is more top heavy than the Abrams. Smooth suspension is sounding enticing just about now. I could use something more cushy than the Abrams. 

 

[BKW]

When I first got the shermax it felt way too heavy riding it around. Now it's like a toy to me and i don't even notice it. The same will be for the sherman-s

[DavidB]

I noted Adam (WrongWay) was worried about the pedals being bolted directly to the battery case and whether the lugs on the battery case may end up cracking. It seems to me if anything is going to break it will be the pedals themselves. The amount of metal between the pedal axle and the rider's weight is very small and the leverage great. Anyone doing Shibby_time like jumps should carefully check for cracks.

 

Maybe Leaperkim made them sacrificial like the lift handles thinking it is better to break a pedal than a battery case lug. But somehow I think it was just styling/marketing over engineering.

Edited November 28, 2022 by DavidB

[KiwiMark]

I don't regard stock pedals as all that important, I'll end up changing them soon enough.

I'll possibly buy some NyloNove pedals for my Sherman-S, once they are available.

[DavidB]

8 minutes ago, KiwiMark said:

I don't regard stock pedals as all that important, I'll end up changing them soon enough.

I'll possibly buy some NyloNove pedals for my Sherman-S, once they are available.

They will be safer too, I'm sure.

I've read the stock are magnesium so there wont be the usual weight saving you get over the 2kg/pair Begode ones.

Are you the Hamilton Mark?

Edited November 28, 2022 by DavidB

[Clem604]

I will also be replacing the stock pedals with aftermarket ones when my S comes in. After trying the pedals in person just reinforces my opinion on them after seeing Adam's video. The spikes just don't stick out enough IMO, I don't like how the spikes are recessed into the pedal. I also don't like how the philips head screws in the pedals stick out slightly further than the spikes. I hear freemotion is working on a pedal for the Sherman S, I'm sure others will follow.

[KiwiMark]

14 minutes ago, DavidB said:

Are you the Hamilton Mark?

Yep, living and working in Hamilton. NZ.  It's not a bad city to get around, but the paths & roads are pretty rubbish and I am looking forward to having suspension on my main wheel.  Good pedals & pads will also help when hitting bumps, by holding my feet in place better.

[DavidB]

34 minutes ago, KiwiMark said:

Yep, living and working in Hamilton. NZ.  It's not a bad city to get around, but the paths & roads are pretty rubbish and I am looking forward to having suspension on my main wheel.  Good pedals & pads will also help when hitting bumps, by holding my feet in place better.

Caught some of your river trail trip vids a while back. Last year? year before? Don't remember when exactly. Looked pretty nice. Will be interested to hear how you get on with the S.

[InfiniteWheelie]

Ultimately I think this structural battery case is a bad idea. It’s not a good way to attach the forks and pedals.

The forks can be attached with a metal bridge as discussed already, no problem there. Now to address the pedals…

The upper suspension (red part) currently sits inside a sleeve. This sleeve has threaded holes, which the battery case bolts onto.

My suggestion is to simply make this sleeve extend further down, and double as a pedal hanger. The battery case would still bolt onto this sleeve, but the case would simply hang there with no rider weight. All the rider weight would be on this metal sleeve/pedal hanger.

 

Since we already seem to agreed that the fork bridge is a superior design, what are your thoughts on extending the suspension sleeve downward to double as a pedal hanger? In my opinion (just like the fork bridge) this is the the most direct and rigid way to connect the pedals.

 

Edited November 28, 2022 by InfiniteWheelie

[Freeforester]

ExtremeBull probably did this before you woke up this morning, having stolen the idea from your head last night 😳🤣👍🏻

Edited November 28, 2022 by Freeforester

[MrMonoWheel]

8 hours ago, InfiniteWheelie said:

Ultimately I think this structural battery case is a bad idea. It’s not a good way to attach the forks and pedals.

The forks can be attached with a metal bridge as discussed already, no problem there. Now to address the pedals…

The upper suspension (red part) currently sits inside a sleeve. This sleeve has threaded holes, which the battery case bolts onto.

My suggestion is to simply make this sleeve extend further down, and double as a pedal hanger. The battery case would still bolt onto this sleeve, but the case would simply hang there with no rider weight. All the rider weight would be on this metal sleeve/pedal hanger.

 

Since we already seem to agreed that the fork bridge is a superior design, what are your thoughts on extending the suspension sleeve downward to double as a pedal hanger? In my opinion (just like the fork bridge) this is the the most direct and rigid way to connect the pedals.

 

This would be tricky. For the sleeve to extend downward it would have to get past the wider portion of the upper stanchion that contains the dust seals/sliders etc, which means it would have to be wider/thicker to maintain the required strength. Furthermore, having that piece of metal extend downwards that far would allow some pretty extreme torsional forces to be applied under heavy riding, although if the battery cases are screwed into the lower part close to the pedal hanger it shouldn't be an issue. 

Regarding the way the pedals are currently mounted to the battery case, I think its not the best idea. Magnesium alloy can be pretty brittle depending on the makeup. Now it's true that so far the material the Sherman S is made from seems quite strong, people have taken hammers to it without issue. And many car wheels are made of magnesium alloy and they experience much higher forces than this. But if the material isn't high grade and you hit a rock/crash/etc, hairline cracks could form around the pedal hangers in the battery cases which over time would lead to failure.

There's a reason pedal hangers are usually short, stout, thick chunks of metal vs being molded into the bottom edge of a battery case.

 

All that being said, my Sherman S from GTKing is expected to arrive at his store next week at which point it will be shipped to me. I still have a week to cancel my preorder, hopefully we get some good info on the V13 in that time 😂

[techyiam]

2 hours ago, Unicycle Santa said:

All that being said, my Sherman S from GTKing is expected to arrive at his store next week at which point it will be shipped to me. I still have a week to cancel my preorder, hopefully we get some good info on the V13 in that time

 The second batch of the V13's are currently in transit.

You have to steer blind now. Hmmmm.

Are you going to be a proud owner of a Sherman-S, that is the question? Pressure, pressure. 🙂

Actually, based on what we know up to this point, isn't it safer to get the Sherman-S, due the price you are getting it for. The crux of the problem here is that the V13 has never been in the hands of someone outside of China. And the consensus on the Sherman-S so far is pretty positive. You are playing the odds. You are getting the Sherman-S now to hedge the possibility that the V13 doesn't work out, and you will still get Sherman-S for a great price. The other more straightforward approach would be to cancel, and wait for the V13. And should the V13 doesn't work out, then you would have to buy the Sherman-S at a higher price.

Will it be too much hassle, or at a significant financial loss should you decide to sell the Sherman-S at a later date?

Edited November 28, 2022 by techyiam

[MrMonoWheel]

49 minutes ago, techyiam said:

 The second batch of the V13's are currently in transit.

You have to steer blind now. Hmmmm.

Are you going to be a proud owner of a Sherman-S, that is the question? Pressure, pressure. 🙂

Actually, based on what we know up to this point, isn't it safer to get the Sherman-S, due the price you are getting it for. The crux of the problem here is that the V13 has never been in the hands of someone outside of China. And the consensus on the Sherman-S so far is pretty positive. You are playing the odds. You are getting the Sherman-S now to hedge the possibility that the V13 doesn't work out, and you will still get Sherman-S for a great price. The other more straightforward approach would be to cancel, and wait for the V13. And should the V13 doesn't work out, then you would have to buy the Sherman-S at a higher price.

Will it be too much hassle, or at a significant financial loss should you decide to sell the Sherman-S at a later date?

Thats what I have been considering. I actually have both the sherman S and V13 on order. I am paying 3300 for either wheel, so price is the same. The issues I have with the Sherman S are the lack of waterproofing, poor lighting, no PWM tiltback, worse fit and finish, and more difficult maintenance. However regarding the waterproofing, it would be pretty easy to open everything up and silicone everything to seal it. There have been quite a few reports of all the screws becoming loose over just a few hundred kilometers. A guy in my group had all the axle bolts loose in this time. The Sherman will also most likely get better range. 

The V13 has waterproofing, PWM tiltback, app support, modularity (allegedly), better lighting, and more power/speed. But the suspension uses a slider system similar to the V11 even though it has an improved damper setup, according to Kuji the V13 is the ultimate cruiser while the sherman is better at rough stuff like trails. Im leaning more towards the V13 due to the better build quality and features.

[techyiam]

7 hours ago, Unicycle Santa said:

The V13 has waterproofing, PWM tiltback, app support, modularity (allegedly), better lighting, and more power/speed. But the suspension uses a slider system similar to the V11 even though it has an improved damper setup, according to Kuji the V13 is the ultimate cruiser while the sherman is better at rough stuff like trails. Im leaning more towards the V13 due to the better build quality and features.

I understand, but my main point is that we don't know how the V13 is going to ride. Additionally, all the safety claims by Inmotion have not been verified. Be careful with 22" wheels too. You may find that you won't be able to accelerate nor brake well enough. I am not saying this is the case for the V13. But it could be. We just don't know at this point.

That is one of the reason why I bought a interm big wheel. I needed to figure out which direction to go. And I am glad I did. Without riding a big wheel, I just didn't have the experience to make the right choices.

On paper, I like the V13 for my use case. But there is no way I would buy one without knowing more.

Mind you, it is not the end of the world. If you find that the V13 doesn't work out for you, either by hearing really bad things about it before you buy, or don't like it after owning it, you could buy something else then.

Edited November 29, 2022 by techyiam

[MrMonoWheel]

52 minutes ago, techyiam said:

I understand, but my main point is that we don't know how the V13 is going to ride. Additionally, all the safety claims by Inmotion have not been verified. Be careful with 22" wheels too. You may find that you won't be able to accelerate nor brake well enough. I am not saying this is the case for the V13. But it could be. We just don't know at this point.

That is one of the reason why I bought a interm big wheel. I needed to figure out which direction to go. And I am glad I did. Without riding a big wheel, I just didn't have the experience to make the right choices.

On paper, I like the V13 for my use case. But there is no way I would buy one without knowing more.

Mind you, it is not the end of the world. If you find that the V13 doesn't work out for you, either by hearing really bad things about it before you buy, or didn't like it after owning it, you could buy something else then.

Completely agree. I'm basing everything on speculation 😂 

[Steve Evans]

fyi ewheels told me today that they should be receiving vessel tracking info for shermanS in about a weeks time.

Edited November 28, 2022 by Steve Evans