2.12 firmware serious safety issue!

[Tawpie]

23 minutes ago, bcarp said:

Are we sure the 2.12 wheel spin issue has been fixed in the new 2.12 versions?

I am NOT sure that it is fixed, I didn't want to go there again because 2.09 isn't available anymore (2.09 is not available in SoftTuner, I didn't check EUCWorld or DB).

BTW, it's highly recommended you charge to green LED plus one or two hours (when you charge) in order to prolong the battery life. I know it goes against the advice given for your phone, but our battery packs are different. Take the time to give this a watch... 

 

Edited August 26, 2022 by Tawpie

[bcarp]

2 hours ago, Tawpie said:

BTW, it's highly recommended you charge to green LED plus one or two hours (when you charge)

Thanks for following up. I watched some of that video, then got bored :). Nothing new really. I charge to 80% because my wheel isn't used that much right now, but go to 100% + a bit more for balancing once in a while when I know I'm about to ride at least 10% of the battery away the next day. The problem with charging to 100% isn't the charge cycles which is what I think this video is saying; it's maintaining the voltage stress on the cells when kept at that voltage, an issue not directly addressed in this video although it might be implied. Of course, I'd feel much more comfortable being able to balance the cells myself like hobby lipos with a separate balance lead, but that's not possible with EUCs. Anyway, that's another topic...

[Funky]

6 hours ago, bcarp said:

Thanks for your comments. The main issue I've had is the problem with battery being chewed up when charging stops. So, If I use a timer to estimate a charge to 80% battery, when the timer cuts the power to the charger, then the wheel will be down to, who knows, 70? 60? 50? by the time I get to it. This is apparently fixed on the newer firmwares.

Are we sure the 2.12 wheel spin issue has been fixed in the new 2.12 versions? If so, then I'll bite the bullet & see if Soft tuner can update. I have no idea by Darknessbot & KingSong apps are telling me no updates available.

Just in case you didn't know. 80% charging is the fastest way to ruin your batteries.. Allways charge to 100% if you can and leave charger plugged in another 1-2hrs after it turns green.

You don't BALANCE the batteries rightly at 80%.. Most balancing happen at the last 99% or so. And leaving it plugged 1-2hrs is for that "extra" balancing. (My 18xl wheel. When charger turns green it still are pulling ~50Watts from the wall and over ~2hrs slowly goes down to 2.5Watts. <<< That's right there is when balancing happens.) Unbalanced cells is what kills these batteries pack. You may think that 80% charging is better. But in real world you are killing your EUC slowly.. As you charge only to 80% some cells get lower and lower voltage. Some may be 4.2V and most weak one may be 3.95V. And over time if you charge only to 80% that weak one will slowly go lower and lower voltage. And at one point the pack will die. Because of no RIGHT balancing. If you charge to 100% each time more or less each cell will be 4.2V..

Example 80% charging: The weak one which is 3.95V never goes to 4.2V.. And over time will go lower and lower voltage. Because it never "charges" to full.

100% charging: You balance the cell always. Meaning the weak cell may charge to 4.2V every time. (Worst case ~4.1V). But it doesn't go lower like 80% charging. Because you never "balance" the cells. 

Even if you charge to 100% every 5th charge or 10th is not enough.. But hey, if you don't care that one day year later the wheel will die. You do you.  

 

You may lose 1% overnight.. If you don't "power cycle" the wheel.

Edited August 26, 2022 by Funky

[sidderke]

On 8/25/2022 at 2:00 PM, plentora said:

All I can say is that 2.12 is not the firmware you want to upgrade to.

I'm still running on 2.18 and it works fine, no troubles.

Sorry I meant 2.18

[plentora]

21 hours ago, sidderke said:

Sorry I meant 2.18

Yup, 2.18 seems to be fine, I've now had it for 100km or more.

[sidderke]

I just had the win spin on me with the new 2.18 firmware after the lift sensor didn't detect me lifting it. Can confirm it shuts off correctly now :-) Good thing as well, as I was in a fancy hotel and I didn't want to ruin their floor. 

[Funky]

2 hours ago, sidderke said:

I just had the win spin on me with the new 2.18 firmware after the lift sensor didn't detect me lifting it. Can confirm it shuts off correctly now :-) Good thing as well, as I was in a fancy hotel and I didn't want to ruin their floor. 

You can always try tilting sideways, to cut off the motor. If it doesn't shut off at free spin.

And if sideways tilt also doesn't work.. Well, then the floor is ducked.  

[Spaghetteh]

This happens to me on occasion with my 18XL... I'll tilt it as much as I can forward or back and it will start screaming that I need to slow down but won't disengage the motor. When that happens, I brace the side of the wheel against my knees/lower thighs and squat down to a half-sitting position to get the wheel past 45 degrees sideways and that will cause it to disengage the motor.

Warning/disclaimer: Do this at your own risk... losing your balance while doing this could cause a free-spinning wheel to fall on top of you which I think we can all agree would be very bad.

[Funky]

9 hours ago, Spaghetteh said:

This happens to me on occasion with my 18XL... I'll tilt it as much as I can forward or back and it will start screaming that I need to slow down but won't disengage the motor. When that happens, I brace the side of the wheel against my knees/lower thighs and squat down to a half-sitting position to get the wheel past 45 degrees sideways and that will cause it to disengage the motor.

Warning/disclaimer: Do this at your own risk... losing your balance while doing this could cause a free-spinning wheel to fall on top of you which I think we can all agree would be very bad.

If you got honeycomb pedals, you can simply lift it up with one hand holding handle other pedal. I think if you got strong grip you can do the same with regular pedals also.

[v8nice]

What is the release note of 2.18 firmware ?

[Robse]

3 minutes ago, v8nice said:

What is the release note of 2.18 firmware ?

A good guess could be: "fixedd err in ap#2-wwe soft.land -ena rr-pft. %tiltnon mark &to2gone"

[plentora]

On 9/4/2022 at 3:22 AM, Spaghetteh said:

This happens to me on occasion with my 18XL... I'll tilt it as much as I can forward or back and it will start screaming that I need to slow down but won't disengage the motor. When that happens, I brace the side of the wheel against my knees/lower thighs and squat down to a half-sitting position to get the wheel past 45 degrees sideways and that will cause it to disengage the motor.

Warning/disclaimer: Do this at your own risk... losing your balance while doing this could cause a free-spinning wheel to fall on top of you which I think we can all agree would be very bad.

Or you can upgrade to 2.18 which has been working fine for many hundred kilometers for me ..

[Alla Shkolnik]

On 8/25/2022 at 5:56 PM, Tawpie said:

2.09 did have an issue where only the KS app would unlock a locked wheel, EUCW and DB couldn't do it.

We fix it for Darknessbot on Android and iOS, several versions ago👌

 

On 8/26/2022 at 7:03 AM, bcarp said:

I have no idea by Darknessbot & KingSong apps are telling me no updates available.

JFYI, we use the same update servers with KS app. We always will be show the same information about update 🙂

[mrelwood]

 

On 8/25/2022 at 1:15 PM, bcarp said:

Can anyone give me reasons why I should or should not update from 1.07 please?

I don't have experience with the 16X, but on the 18XL and 16S the ride modes got hugely improved. It felt as if the wheel got 50% more power. It was a very nice, reassuring feel, and I liked it a lot. In the times of 2.02 it was quite obvious if a KS was on 1.xx or 2.0x, the feel was that different.

I do think that by 2.09 the feel did get slightly back closer to the 1.xx, and I actually slightly preferred the 2.02 dynamics (on the 16S).

I wouldn't think twice whether to upgrade or not. New firmwares being beta tests doesn't sound like a correct statement to me, since the older firmwares are even more beta than the latest one. It's extremely rare to have any firmware updated without increasing the version number, so the upgrades that decrease the "beta" status are the ones with a newer version number.

I have always upgraded the firmware to the very latest ones on all my (16S & V11) wheels. No issues at all, but a heck of a lot of improvements.

[jack5d]

Hi guys, I updated my 14S to 2.12 (2.18 can't find it) and the spoken warnings are gone! total silence! I have tried everything, but nothing, there is only the tilt-back! 

[enaon]

48 minutes ago, jack5d said:

Hi guys, I updated my 14S to 2.12 (2.18 can't find it) and the spoken warnings are gone! total silence! I have tried everything, but nothing, there is only the tilt-back! 

try power cycling the wheel and test if the voice warnings are there, without connecting an app.

Edited October 5, 2022 by enaon

[Robse]

2 hours ago, jack5d said:

Hi guys, I updated my 14S to 2.12 (2.18 can't find it) and the spoken warnings are gone! total silence! I have tried everything, but nothing, there is only the tilt-back! 

Below is under the assumption, that you have a working edition of the KingSong App

1: Power of your wheel

2: Turn off BT on any device near your wheel ( +~10 meters )

3: Power on your wheel

4: Start the Kingsong App - it will ask you for permission to turn on BT - this is ok.

5: Connected to wheel, choose this menu item (pic #1)

6: In voice control, turn OFF Voice Speak Switch (pic #2)

7: Exit all menus, exit Kingsong App.

8: Turn off wheel

wait 10 seconds.

9 : Turn on wheel

10: Connect again as above #4

11: Connected to wheel, choose this menu item (pic #1)

12: In voice control, turn ON Voice Speak Switch (pic #2)

13: Exit all menus, exit Kingsong App.

14: Turn off wheel

Turn on wheel, test.  Good luck

If it works - all fine  if not, then there's something wrong with that firmware. 

From time to time i experience the same on my 16X, but i guess it has something to do with a combination of different settings in KingSong App, EUC world and Wheel Log. And after all, we are just users of shitty unfished chinese hard and software - so no wonder.

 

[jack5d]

2 hours ago, enaon said:

provare a guidare la ruota e testare se gli avvertimenti vocali sono lì, senza collegare un'app.

I tried but it does not change, the only voice alert is that of the Bluetooth connection or disconnection, while the over power or speed warnings are missing completely 

[jack5d]

3 minutes ago, Robse said:

Di seguito è sotto l'ipotesi che si abbia un'edizione di lavoro dell'App KingSong

1: Potenza della ruota

2: Spegnere BT su qualsiasi dispositivo vicino alla ruota ( +~10 metri)

3: Potere sulla ruota

4: Inizia l'App Kingsong - vi chiederà il permesso di accendere BT - questo è ok.

5: Connesso alla ruota, scegliere questo menù (pic #1)

6: Nel controllo vocale, gira Off Spesa di voce (pic #2)

7: Esce tutti i menù, uscita Kingsong App.

8: Spegnere la ruota

aspettare 10 secondi.

9 : Gira sulla ruota

10: Connettersi di nuovo come sopra #4

11: Connesso alla ruota, scegliere questo menù (pic #1)

12: Nel controllo vocale, gira Su Spesa di voce (pic #2)

13: Esce tutti i menù, uscita Kingsong App.

14: Spegnere la ruota

Gira al volante, prova.  Buona fortuna

Se funziona - tutto bene In caso contrario, c'è qualcosa che non va in quel firmo.

Di tanto in tanto sperimento la stessa cosa sul mio 16X, ma credo che abbia qualcosa a che fare con una combinazione di diversi ambienti in KingSong App, World EUC e Wheel Log. E dopotutto, siamo solo utenti di un cinese molto poco sospeso e software - quindi non c'è da stupirsi.

 

Thanks, I try, but don't change nothing . . 

[enaon]

41 minutes ago, jack5d said:

I tried but it does not change, the only voice alert is that of the Bluetooth connection or disconnection, while the over power or speed warnings are missing completely 

nice, so it looks like they indeed messed up the voice alerts for the 14s on 2.12. 

 

ps. the voice option is always on for Kingsongs when they boot up, if an app connects the voice gets disabled, the app must send the "voice on" to enable them again (this explains why Robse is reporting no voice sometimes, the command got lost in transit most probably), so if they are not working on power up with no app connected, it is a bug.
 

Edited October 5, 2022 by enaon

[RoboFixIt]

If you run into an issue and already updated you can try and backdate to an earlier firmware with "SoftTunner". There's a lot of features that are blocked in the app so it doesn't always show the options to backdate, the only way to unlock all the features is to get a username and password from KS but they wont give that out to the public. Why not? hmmm they think we are to stupid and may break the already broken update? lol I suggest we need better apps for EUC's in the future and we should start working on that project now

Edited October 5, 2022 by ElectronxCycles

[jack5d]

I have news for 14S ! update 2.20 is out (reported by eucworld, but not by the official kingsong app) and the wheel is back to talking!! but I would like to understand why the kingsong app didn't signal update, do you have any ideas? 

[Seba]

On 10/5/2022 at 9:05 PM, ElectronxCycles said:

I suggest we need better apps for EUC's in the future and we should start working on that project now

But we already have a pretty good app - EUC World. If there is something that EUC World is lacking of, just let me know

[Maccomplete]

How did you change back to a previous version? Im using an iPhone?

[Uras]

On 2/5/2023 at 10:27 PM, jack5d said:

I have news for 14S ! update 2.20 is out (reported by eucworld, but not by the official kingsong app) and the wheel is back to talking!! but I would like to understand why the kingsong app didn't signal update, do you have any ideas? 

Yes, it's the same for 16x. I just updated to 2.20 which I've been ignoring till now. Hopefully it will fix the calibration issue I'm having; I calibrate the wheel and it reverts to leaning forward part way through the ride.

Edited July 13, 2023 by Uras