Safe EUC Storage

[Paul A]

Full immersion in water for an extended period of time might be the only way for a lithium fire.

The FDNY did that with the S22.

 

Some recent progress in improving safety.  Strengthening the internal separator.

NTU researchers invent new technology that can prevent Lithium-ion battery fires

3,531 views

Sep 15, 2021

 

CNA

1.8M subscribers

 

 

[Paul A]

Hsiang has a major collision at high speed on the S22 quite a few days before the fire.

The damage to the S22 might not have been apparent immediately.

 

The Tesla featured in the following video was damaged in an accident.

It was in a junk yard for three weeks before it self ignited.

 

___________________________________

 

Tesla goes up in flames as firefighters struggle to extinguish battery

726 views

Jun 23, 2022

The Independent

408K subscribers

 

Firefighters in Sacramento, California, struggled to extinguish a Tesla fire after it spontaneously erupted in flames.

The vehicle was sitting in a wreckage yard after being involved in an accident three weeks ago, where it sustained major damage.

By the time firefighters arrived, it was completely engulfed by fire and every time the flames appeared extinguished, they were reignited by the battery.

The crews eventually put the fire out by submerging the Tesla into a pit of water, completely submerging the battery.

 

 

 

[Paul A]

Maybe have a metal grate above the EUC in the container.

Purchase sand from hardware store.  Packaged in paper sacks of 25kg.

Place sacks of sand above EUC.

When the flames burn through the paper sacks, the sand is released and dumped onto the EUC.

Might help to smother the flames, contain ejecting projectiles, etc.

[Funky]

32 minutes ago, Paul A said:

Maybe have a metal grate above the EUC in the container.

Purchase sand from hardware store.  Packaged in paper sacks of 25kg.

Place sacks of sand above EUC.

When the flames burn through the paper sacks, the sand is released and dumped onto the EUC.

Might help to smother the flames, contain ejecting projectiles, etc.

Yeah - i saw that you mentioned that already.

But if i wanna use sand - i need to buy "bigger" size box.. So there would be place for the sand.

30x60x80 box. Euc maybe ~12x50x50 i would need at least 50kg sand to fill up half of the box. (Could add "molds" inside the box, so there would be smaller gaps from walls to euc.) Then it would be harder to place euc inside - as it will need to sit right in "spot".

Then again if i would use sand, i don't really need to insulate the "box". Because as soon it starts to burn, the sand will drop - putting out fire.

I wonder how "big" & "bad" would ks18xl fire be..  

Edited June 26, 2022 by Funky

[UniBlab]

Make a heat-activated dunk tank

 

 

 

[Funky]

10 hours ago, UniBlab said:

Make a heat-activated dunk tank

 

 

 

If i had a "lower" floor or basement i could cut a hole in my room floor.  Otherwise you need to lift the euc somewhere high up. No thanks.

[RagingGrandpa]

I'll just leave this here  

 

On 10/22/2021 at 11:24 AM, RagingGrandpa said:

  There are some nice demonstrations of sand used to suppress battery fires online.

It helps but isn't great...

Quote

 

 

On 10/22/2021 at 11:09 AM, Paul A said:

Bags of sand as the walls, and laid on top of the grill, enclosing the EUC.

If a fire starts, hopefully the bags will burn through, the sand on top and the sides will be released

Similar ideas using water have been proposed... but it's quite a contraption to create, store, and maintain

 

On 1/11/2021 at 6:14 PM, RagingGrandpa said:

 

On 3/23/2021 at 4:16 PM, Seba said:

 

[Paul g]

On 9/15/2022 at 9:28 PM, Robse said:

Text copy from reddit: (it´s not my RS ;-) )

This afternoon, my house, whilst my whole family was inside, almost completely burned down from a battery fire. The wheel wasn't even plugged in, I hadn't used it since the night before, and have been using it almost daily since I got it in November 2020(with a few issues, I've had to replace the motherboard twice and motor once). The fire brigade were close by and said if they had gotten there even a few minutes later it could have been too late. The video only shows downstairs were the wheel was located and the fire started, but there is soot and smoke all over the house. Absolutely terrifying incident, if anyone has any ideas on how to contact Begode and get some kind of compensation or anything , your help would be greatly appreciated. Fortunately our house insurance will cover most of the repair costs but they suggested we should try contact the manufacturer/supplier. Stay safe guys, really disappointed and still very shook up, I had absolutely fallen in love with this hobby but this has pretty much ruined most of the love I had for it.

That is where a fire proof box comes in handy. It’s not gonna be perfect, but if it has an alarm installed on it it might just give you enough time to throw it out of the house and limit damage.

[Aztek]

Here are the perfect storage cabinets for the true fanatic: https://www.uschemicalstorage.com/drumloc-chemical-drum-storage/

 

[Funky]

2 hours ago, Aztek said:

Here are the perfect storage cabinets for the true fanatic: https://www.uschemicalstorage.com/drumloc-chemical-drum-storage/

 

I would love to have one... Any sugar daddy's here?  

[Eucner]

3 hours ago, Aztek said:

Here are the perfect storage cabinets for the true fanatic: https://www.uschemicalstorage.com/drumloc-chemical-drum-storage/

 

That looks serious, but wasn't even fire rated.

[Aztek]

4 hours ago, Eucner said:

That looks serious, but wasn't even fire rated.

They actually have chemical and fire cabinets, if you dig in their products at the site.

[pico]

44 minutes ago, novazeus said:

i'm back.

Sorry to hear about your mishap.

Welcome back! Nice to hear that you are alive and kicking. (CBD must work then ...) I missed your colorful posts...

 

Edited December 3, 2022 by pico

[novazeus]

just to be clear, 

thc not cbd, is the cancer killer.

 

cbd is just like salt or pepper on a steak, thc is the steak.

anything over 25mg of cbd will ding ur liver long term, i know because the cbd hitchiking on my solventless cannabis extract when i was taking 4000mg a day(btw a gummy is 5mg).

if u have terminal cancer and the only medical treatment is available is hospice, 

u gotta take alot because now ur in a war with cancer.

i did a psa in july and i still have my initial 35.4 psa prostate, was 0.3. 

yeah it definitely will keep u alive if u can cope with delta 11 thc in ur brain/mind.

trust me, i've had lots of humans want to save their lives taking extract orally, and most choose death over medicating with cannabis extract. that's why the govt saying it's addictive is just completely lying because no living thing likes taking cannabis extract including me and i've probably averaged 2000mg a day since april 2014.

and btw, learned how to ride these things under the influence of more thc than the scientists think a human can tolerate.

thanks for the welcome back. 

 

 

[Crab]

I too am a survivor, found it at psa 16 and cut it out. 3 years later and I’m less than .01, undetected.

[novazeus]

22 minutes ago, Crab said:

I too am a survivor, found it at psa 16 and cut it out. 3 years later and I’m less than .01, undetected.

that's great. i didn't have that option and my doc teaches remote prostatecnomy at usf.

i was 35.4, started taking extract and nothing else and got my psa down to 16.1 before starting radiation in jax.

i probably didn't need radiation, but that was the protocol i designed for myself.

oral thc combine with radiation.

a couple months afre i completed my sessions, they discovered combining radiation with thc in rats made their brain cancer go away.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/11/141114085629.htm

[Crab]

If mine comes back I’m quitting my job and hitting the thc, just unable to at current employer due to FAA guidelines.

Edited December 3, 2022 by Crab

[novazeus]

18 minutes ago, Crab said:

If mine comes back I’m quitting my job and hitting the thc, just unable to at current employer due to FAA guidelines.

think how i feel siting here almost 9 years after my doctor said they could keep me out of pain until i died in three months.

i just tried to help a friend of a friend, 73 years old, pc, the doctors were still wanting to mustard gas him some more.

he managed to down 1000mg over a period of about 8 days and said no more.

he died about three weeks later, 3 days after hospice arrived.

taking thc orally for cancer treatment, ain't recreational.

think of it like mental chemo, or if ur old enough, the last 12 hours of a 24 hour lsd dosage.

lsd is waaaaaaaaaaaay easier to take.

although doing lsd 24/7 would ding ur body. doing thc 24/7 just dings ur brain.

why i live like a hermit on my ranch.

no driver's license, tag, insurance, vehicle.

but hey, i got a text from my sister who is threatening litigation against me, that her husband dropped dead yesterday. he was 74. his name was win. not yesterday.

haha, in 2015 i tried to help an atty in nc and her husband was concerned she wouldn't be able to do her work on thc.

i asked him how much work she'd do dead.

she did extend her life a few years by doing thc rectally. never could handle the mental side effects, which are terrible.

but living a very solitary life, a high iq, massive doses of lsd and psilocybin mushrooms as a kid, kinda prepared me for this.

oh sorry, got off my thought.

i learned to ride a frigging euc, all the while taking at least 2000mg a day.

and never falling!

i drive and operate my tractor and backhoe on the ranch. yesterday i delicately picked a 2000 pound pallet of feed out of the delivery pick up.

but the govt if i was involved in an accident off of the ranch, if they took a blood sample, hopefully it would blow up their machine or they'd think it was broken.i'd be guilty because i have thc in a massive amount in my bloodstream. that's the whole idea. cancer needs blood too and ur bathing it in thc.

4-5-22 i showed my attys a little skin cancer on my back. i did a photo diary where u can see the decarboxylated cannabis extract(rso)slowly ate the tumor away. no scar. no nothing. no stinging. but somehow i could feel it working. 

the pictures are what they are. miracle. instead of taking massive antibiotics and getting it scooped out deep, uh, maybe go to ur dispensary and try it topically.

and when the vet says to euthanize ur dog or cat because of cancer, try rso for a week. it's never too late. trust me, i was knocking on heaven's door but God said no u stay down there for awhile.

[novazeus]

yeah this fire battery thing, is very disconcerting to me because i'm sleeping about ten feet from a 2000watt bluetti power station. i'm offgrid.

this forum is a wealth of information for me about batteries etc. two bluetti solar panels went out on me today. 4 months old. solar sucks unbelievably!

however, because of my age and fighting cancer and every govt on the planet thinks i'm an outlaw killing cancer with cannabis, i was looking at these yachts, silent 60, silent 80, that are cats that are solar/battery powered. massive battery packs.

but from what i've learned here, and experiencing first hand, idk if i'd feel safe out at sea.

what do u electrical engineers think? will battery powered vehicles ever be as safe as diesel?

[Tawpie]

4 minutes ago, novazeus said:

will battery powered vehicles ever be as safe as diesel?

There are 'safer' battery chemistries, the challenge is that they don't hold much energy per unit volume or kg. Dino juice happens to be very energy dense and we've over a hundred years figuring out how to package, move, store and use it relatively safely. Storing large amounts of electrical energy in portable packages is relatively new, and there's a lot that still needs to be figured out.

The downside of operating at sea is that you are surrounded by one of the most destructive substances known to mankind. It's responsible for an insane number of accidental deaths and likely leads the way in property damage year after year. By all rights it should have been banned eons ago. Dihydrogen Oxide. Nasty stuff.

[novazeus]

17 minutes ago, Tawpie said:

There are 'safer' battery chemistries, the challenge is that they don't hold much energy per unit volume or kg. Dino juice happens to be very energy dense and we've over a hundred years figuring out how to package, move, store and use it relatively safely. Storing large amounts of electrical energy in portable packages is relatively new, and there's a lot that still needs to be figured out.

The downside of operating at sea is that you are surrounded by one of the most destructive substances known to mankind. It's responsible for an insane number of accidental deaths and likely leads the way in property damage year after year. By all rights it should have been banned eons ago. Dihydrogen Oxide. Nasty stuff.

u know, i'm glad u brought that up.

ya see, the old house which i was siphoning my power from burned up 7/11,

so i've been living with this BLUETTI Portable Power Station EB200P 2200W for about 4 months now in my somewhat converted container, insulated and nice garage mat type flooring, ac. it has a cooling fan and it's only under load for the coffee maker and microwave for a couple minutes a day.

and i've been noticing that electrical type smell lately, and doing cannabis and all, ur paranoid anyway, but also it clears out ur sinuses so ur can detect odors better.

not to offend anybody. i'm a 68 yo contractor. i couldn't have built a bunch of homes without home depot and china.

but china's quality control is shit. but what are u gonna do. and they make UR drugs, not mine.

u think that smell is bad coming off these batteries?

or maybe it's the charger. i'll do a sniff test tmrw.

Edited December 3, 2022 by novazeus

[novazeus]

ya, if the boat catches on fire, ur screwed.

[Tawpie]

Don't know about the smell... deserves investigation.

The one good thing about your Bluetti power stations is that the chemistry they use (LiFePo4), is one of the 'very unlikely to catch themselves on fire' chemistries so you're about as good as you can get right now. Fire wise. How well the rest of the thing is designed and assembled, it sounds like you're finding out. It is a consumer device which means it's designed and built as cheaply as they feel they can get away with, so there is always that.

Edited December 4, 2022 by Tawpie

[novazeus]

1 minute ago, Tawpie said:

Don't know about the smell... deserves investigation.

The one good thing about your Bluetti power stations is that the chemistry they use (LiFePo4), is one of the 'very unlikely to catch themselves on fire' chemistries so you're about as good as you can get right now. Fire wise. How well the rest of the thing is designed and assembled, it sounds like you're finding out. It is a consumer device which means it's designed and built as cheaply as they feel they can get away with, so there is always that.

what's the battery chemistry in these euc's?

as soon as jason gets me my new mten4, it will be in here with me too. 600 watts.

[Tawpie]

26 minutes ago, novazeus said:

what's the battery chemistry in these euc's?

It depends, but newer ones are generally Lithium Nickel Cobalt Aluminum Oxide (NCA) or possibly Lithium Nickel Manganese Cobalt Oxide (NMC). If they're older, especially the 18650 package, you'll likely see Lithium Cobalt Oxide (LCO) cathodes in there. The only way to tell for sure is to find out what the battery cells' model number and manufacturer are, then look up the data sheet.

Edited December 4, 2022 by Tawpie