Pulled over on an EUC.

[RayRay]

 Nice try!  

2 hours ago, GothamMike said:

Attach a small Rollerblade wheel to the back, then it become an "Electric Bicycle"

 

Apparently, neither wheel can be less than 14 inches in diameter to be considered a bike in WI. E-bike max is only 20mph anyway, (unless adding 'pedal power').

 

[Lex Smith]

On 11/21/2021 at 4:28 AM, VikB said:

An EUC is never going to be considered an e-bike or e-scooter. The self-balancing part of the equation makes that impossible. You'll never meet the requirements [mechanical brakes and firmware enforced top speed for example...] Taking the ticket to court will raise the issue's profile in the minds of your area's LEO. I think in the end you'll find it even harder to ride an EUC there.

Part of the challenge of riding a device/vehicle that isn't legal is that you may run into these sorts of issues. I think keeping a low profile is better than fighting.

Self balancing scooters and e-bikes are in development so I wonder whether that will throw a spanner in the works?

 

[VikB]

7 hours ago, Lex Smith said:

Self balancing scooters and e-bikes are in development so I wonder whether that will throw a spanner in the works?

 

I don't see anyone confusing an EUC with a scooter/e-bike of any variety, but that said #1 let's see what this new scooter/e-bike tech ends up looking like and #2 let's see if it's legal to use.  There is a lot of scooter/e-bike tech you can buy today that is not legal in most places. They are easier to ride without problems vs. an EUC because they look [at least somewhat] like a legal device. 

[Paul A]

 

[OldFartRides]

Cannot like for some strange reason. I mean, come on.
Unicycles are hard. The electro/gyro development was a game changer for them.

Bicycles are easy.

[DavidB]

Yep, take one for the team and pay the fine. As Shane and the others said rather well, any argument from your self will just make things worse. Last thing you want is extra attention.

Western Australia just this week introduced e-rideable legislation. Max speed 25kmh (15mph) and 10kph (6mph) on footpaths. e-Rideables must be under 25kg. Riders must be over 16 years age etc etc. As RayRay said "We're better off now (in legal grey area) then in a future that regulates euc's to 5 years ago specs. (i.e. slow & weak) "

The press release also stated any rideable exceeding these limits will be regarded as a motor vehicle that does not meet road safety standards, is not registered or insured and the rider unlicensed and would be charged accordingly.

 

[mrelwood]

1 minute ago, DavidB said:

e-Rideables must be under 25kg

This is harsh. Not thinking of EUCs even, but don’t many regular slow e-bikes already go above 25kg?

[Paul A]

The gps/self drive technology might one day mean pizza deliveries etc are by automated carts.

[mike_bike_kite]

2 hours ago, Paul A said:

 

Honda demoed an interesting self balancing motorcycle a year before this:

 

[DavidB]

47 minutes ago, mrelwood said:

This is harsh. Not thinking of EUCs even, but don’t many regular slow e-bikes already go above 25kg?

ebikes are not regarded as e-rideables  in this law. They have their own legislation which mirrors European ones. Pedal assist, 200W or 250W now etc. In fact EUCs did better than scooters though there are still questions as technically the unicycles are not supposed to be capable of more than 25kmh, not just ridden below that. Previously all e-rideables were illegal there though there was a small EUC community but they were so few as to be almost invisible.

[Tawpie]

4 hours ago, DavidB said:

Western Australia just this week introduced e-rideable legislation.

Nightmare scenario.

[VikB]

2 hours ago, Tawpie said:

Nightmare scenario.

So pretty much all EUCs that people actually ride went from being illegal in W.Austrailia to illegal. 

[mrelwood]

12 minutes ago, VikB said:

So pretty much all EUCs that people actually ride went from being illegal in W.Austrailia to illegal. 

Being illegal vehicles is not yet the part that should scare us. All modern EUCs have been illegal in most of Europe for several years, yet there are only a few countries that enforce the law in a way that makes it a problem.

 I’m not sure what the current status of understanding is about the NYC traffic law, but it was only rather recently realized that all EUCs may have been illegal there all this time. I think the amount of people who worry about it affecting their riding is probably about two.

Edited November 25, 2021 by mrelwood

[Paul A]

Lime scooters, 14.8 mph top speed, 250 watts, 45 pounds.

World wide Lime scooters might be setting the standard that laws follow to accommodate.

[Paul A]

The recent NY Broadway Bomb video by Hsiang, had the NYPD seemingly concede it was futile to try to stop the event.

NYPD set up traffic and escort controls.  Peaceful, mass civil disobedience, seems to have worked, bit like Gandhi.

Maybe crazy NY will eventually legalise, introduce registration and plates, insurance etc for EUCs and PEVs.

[VikB]

8 minutes ago, Paul A said:

The recent NY Broadway Bomb video by Hsiang, had the NYPD seemingly concede it was futile to try to stop the event.

 

No being able to stop hundreds of people doing something like that doesn't have anything to do with the police's ability to stop one or two individuals doing something illegal. I wouldn't expect the Bomb to influence anything in the rest of the EUC world. 

[Paul A]

The high profile exposure of Broadway Bomb and the wide variety of PEVs on display.

Videos of riding with complete disregard to traffic controls, safety etc.  Seems to indicate that even individual riders do not appear to fear police enforcement.

Events in NY and USA do influence the world.

NY is often called the cultural capital of the world.  It's sheer size, ethnic diversity, openness to new ideas, wealth etc.

Western European civilization, sciences, technologies, arts etc are due in large part to the Mediterranean Sea enabling trade, which facilitates cultural diversity and exchange/spread/adoption/invention of new ideas and advancements.

Peoples of cultures and indigenous societies that were isolated were very less developed.

[DavidB]

It could have been worse in Western Australia...ie power restrictions or a total ban.

There are a few anomalies. You are allowed on "unlaned" roads (good) but then must go maximum half the speed of the cars (bad) even though cyclists are not speed restricted. NB: "Cars" in Western Australia usually means large 4WDs with deadly "bull bars".

 

Whilst riders can use footpaths, dual paths and bike paths they can not use a bike path on a 50kmh+ road. Huh??

Good news is that the Road Safety Minister (and Transport Minister) used e-scooters at the press event announcing the new law. Someone should teach him to ride a V12 then after he becomes hooked mention that the V12 is illegal as it weighs 29kg. They can be open to persuasion. ie normally in Australia you must wear a life jacket boating but in Western Australia kiters and windsurfers are given a pass if they stay within 400m of the shore.

A bit of gentle lobbying to increase weight and speed may work. Who knows that may be the plan all along. I am sure they got bombarded with comments from people who did not want them at all, let alone on the footpaths. So starting light and slow until they were accepted may have been a necessity. 

https://www.wa.gov.au/government/announcements/new-erideables-legislation-expected-christmas

 

Edited November 26, 2021 by DavidB
addition

[Paul A]

It is the large consumer markets of places such as USA, NY, Europe etc, adopting EUCs that enable manufacturers to produce.

The tastes, preferences, demands of these markets are the influence felt by others around the world.

 

[Lex Smith]

14 hours ago, DavidB said:

Yep, take one for the team and pay the fine. As Shane and the others said rather well, any argument from your self will just make things worse. Last thing you want is extra attention.

Western Australia just this week introduced e-rideable legislation. Max speed 25kmh (15mph) and 10kph (6mph) on footpaths. e-Rideables must be under 25kg. Riders must be over 16 years age etc etc. As RayRay said "We're better off now (in legal grey area) then in a future that regulates euc's to 5 years ago specs. (i.e. slow & weak) "

The press release also stated any rideable exceeding these limits will be regarded as a motor vehicle that does not meet road safety standards, is not registered or insured and the rider unlicensed and would be charged accordingly.

 

If you wore a battery pack on your back connected via a removable big ass cable then you could get the weight down quite a bit on the big wheels  😉 

[mhpr262]

7 hours ago, Lex Smith said:

If you wore a battery pack on your back connected via a removable big ass cable then you could get the weight down quite a bit on the big wheels  😉 

I have been wanting something like that for years - imagine if Inmotion for instance offered an external backpack 1.000Wh battery that you could plug into all wheels from their line-up! Double the range of your V10F in a second!

[mrelwood]

3 hours ago, mhpr262 said:

I have been wanting something like that for years - imagine if Inmotion for instance offered an external backpack 1.000Wh battery that you could plug into all wheels from their line-up! Double the range of your V10F in a second!

Unfortunately you’ll remain wanting. It’s just not possible to make it happen safely. The voltage difference between the main battery and the backpack battery mean that they can’t be used together. And putting one’s butt on the literal line dangling on your back and external connectors is simply not something that can be safely done for us enthusiast EUC riders.

 Then there’s the concern of a cable short during a crash, which is hard for the batteries to take gracefully.

[GothamMike]

On 11/24/2021 at 5:32 PM, RayRay said:

 Nice try!  

Apparently, neither wheel can be less than 14 inches in diameter to be considered a bike in WI. E-bike max is only 20mph anyway, (unless adding 'pedal power').

 

I know there is a EUC with 2 tires side by side.  I would still try the sticker and Call it an "e-Bike" 

You might ask the judge if he can kick it back to the legislature, citing changes in technology. Looks like you should move to a nicer state anyway.

[div]

4 hours ago, mhpr262 said:

imagine if Inmotion for instance offered an external backpack 1.000Wh battery

Kingsong did (tried) this with the KS-power, a 4,5Kg external 84V / 777Wh pack that acted as a charger which could be used while riding.
It never went very far, and Mr Flex who tested it was unconvinced by its practicality.

I've also seen @sbouju ride his MS3 (?) with a similar (homemade) setup a few years back.

Edited November 26, 2021 by div

[duanew]

1 hour ago, mrelwood said:

Unfortunately you’ll remain wanting. It’s just not possible to make it happen safely. The voltage difference between the main battery and the backpack battery mean that they can’t be used together. And putting one’s butt on the literal line dangling on your back and external connectors is simply not something that can be safely done for us enthusiast EUC riders.

 Then there’s the concern of a cable short during a crash, which is hard for the batteries to take gracefully.

It is possible but requires extra electronics.   I have been doing it for a while on my onewheel plus.   I use a boost converter to boost the voltage and limit the current going to the Onewheel.  This way any voltage battery can be used for extra range.  Also there are connectors that pull apart if I fall off.  The next problem is if the wheel will accept a charge while riding.