I've only riden an S18 but..

[No1up]

So, I tried locking out my suspension. I want to see how a non suspension wheel performs. But it's just not the same. For those that have used both for more than a few minutes.. can you, or are you able to describe the differences in words? I'm going back and forth between a AR NK+ or a V12 but then I stop myself.. what if I don't like them?! 😞  

[RockyTop]

Bumps hit much harder. Your pedals on average are lower making the wheel more responsive and maneuverable. ..... and the bumps hit much harder.  You will likely have more shell movement side to side between your legs giving you more turning options. .........and ....... bumps, they can hurt sometimes. 

[Ek.]

On my (rather small) non suspension wheels I am afraid to drop off curbs and it's difficult to ride where tree roots have disturbed the tarmac. On my S18, even before I was remotely confident on it, dropping off curbs was fine. It's all in the landing, which is jarring and wobbly on my non-suspension wheels (might be a bit easier on a large wheel?). Tree root navigation takes a lot less concentration on the S18. Having said that, I really enjoy green-level off road trails on my 14D. It's just quite a fatiguing wheel on longer unpaved pathways.

I like both styles of wheel. I can definitely imagine, as an S18 person, fully enjoying the V12 as well.

[mrelwood]

Oh boy… Don’t go there. You’d have to learn a new level of concentration, and constantly scan the road in front of you. Even the small cracks on the pavement would make you miss the suspension.

 Of course each wheel has their strong suits, and the S18 is relatively easy to beat on several aspects, so there would probably be some things you’d like in a Nik or the V12. But the tiresome and jarring bumpiness would probably take the day every time you ride.

I had to ride a long group ride on an MSP when I burst the tire on my V11. Despite having ridden 14000km on my previous wheel the MSX, the ride was just horrible! And I was so incredibly knackered after the ride, both physically from the constant shaking, but also mentally from the huge amount of concentration required to constantly scan the road.

[.....]

1 hour ago, Ek. said:

On my (rather small) non suspension wheels I am afraid to drop off curbs and it's difficult to ride where tree roots have disturbed the tarmac. On my S18, even before I was remotely confident on it, dropping off curbs was fine. It's all in the landing, which is jarring and wobbly on my non-suspension wheels (might be a bit easier on a large wheel?). Tree root navigation takes a lot less concentration on the S18. Having said that, I really enjoy green-level off road trails on my 14D. It's just quite a fatiguing wheel on longer unpaved pathways.

I like both styles of wheel. I can definitely imagine, as an S18 person, fully enjoying the V12 as well.

I dont find any issue with jumping an mten up and down curbs   Are your knees rather old? My 18XL doesnt mind down either, tho I'm not a fan of 'up'. Yeah, my guts are a little old for jumping heavier wheels 'up' for sure. I noticed the s18 smoothed everything out, but I dont think it increased my ability to handle object. Just a different technique. The higher center of gravity was a little unsettling tho..

[No1up]

1 hour ago, mrelwood said:

Oh boy… Don’t go there. You’d have to learn a new level of concentration, and constantly scan the road in front of you. Even the small cracks on the pavement would make you miss the suspension.

 Of course each wheel has their strong suits, and the S18 is relatively easy to beat on several aspects, so there would probably be some things you’d like in a Nik or the V12. But the tiresome and jarring bumpiness would probably take the day every time you ride.

I had to ride a long group ride on an MSP when I burst the tire on my V11. Despite having ridden 14000km on my previous wheel the MSX, the ride was just horrible! And I was so incredibly knackered after the ride, both physically from the constant shaking, but also mentally from the huge amount of concentration required to constantly scan the road.

I mean, I locked out my shock on the s18.. it wasn't so bad.. I'm very close to pulling the trigger on a Nikola...

[Zopper]

3 hours ago, Ek. said:

On my (rather small) non suspension wheels I am afraid to drop off curbs and it's difficult to ride where tree roots have disturbed the tarmac.

Even a V5F can be an offroad wheel. You just have to go slow with really springy knees and do a good job picking the trail. It’s better than no riding at all, but every bigger wheel is better.  

And @RockyTop wrote it perfectly.  Unsuspended wheels… It’s kinda like changing your soft bed for a thin layer of foam on the forest floor. You can sleep on it, get used to it, but…

[mrelwood]

2 hours ago, No1up said:

I mean, I locked out my shock on the s18.. it wasn't so bad.. I'm very close to pulling the trigger on a Nikola...

The lock lever in the shock decreases the range of movement substantially, but it definitely does not make it a hardtail.

If a well working shock is an Adidas Boost or a Nike Zoom Air shoe, locked out suspension is a regular running shoe. But it’s still a running shoe. An EUC without suspension is a Vibram Five Finger

It does sound like you have your mind set in trying one out. Why not look for the nearest local EUC meet and ask if you can try their wheels a bit? Even if it would require a few cities worth of travel, it would be much cheaper than to buy-disappoint-Craig’sList…

[PourUC]

I'm saving my funds for the next set of suspension wheels... Well one wheel from either Begode or Kingsong.

 

[mrelwood]

18 minutes ago, PourUC said:

I'm saving my funds for the next set of suspension wheels... Well one wheel from either Begode or Kingsong.

 

Not a bad idea, lots of interesting stuff coming out in the next 6 months!

S20, RS Suspension, “V13”, and S16 at some point.

Edited August 8, 2021 by mrelwood

[No1up]

5 hours ago, mrelwood said:

Not a bad idea, lots of interesting stuff coming out in the next 6 months!

S20, RS Suspension, “V13”, and S16 at some point.

Let's not get too excited.. we should be happy to get the v12 🤣

[conecones]

If you are going to be switching back and forth between a suspension and non suspension wheel, then you likely won’t be happy with the non suspension purchase unless you will be riding the wheels in very different conditions.
 

For example it’s going to take a lot of commitment to get your body accustomed to riding potholes or off-roading on non suspension wheel, and even when you finally get there, you still won’t be able to carry speed as fast as the suspension wheel. I ride a non suspension wheel off-road with someone who rides an S18 and I suffer more the rougher the trail gets. If I started riding on an S18 I would not want to go back to a non suspension wheel unless it’s purely for going fast on smooth roads.

[No1up]

4 hours ago, conecones said:

If you are going to be switching back and forth between a suspension and non suspension wheel, then you likely won’t be happy with the non suspension purchase unless you will be riding the wheels in very different conditions.
 

For example it’s going to take a lot of commitment to get your body accustomed to riding potholes or off-roading on non suspension wheel, and even when you finally get there, you still won’t be able to carry speed as fast as the suspension wheel. I ride a non suspension wheel off-road with someone who rides an S18 and I suffer more the rougher the trail gets. If I started riding on an S18 I would not want to go back to a non suspension wheel unless it’s purely for going fast on smooth roads.

I actually got to ride a 16x for about an hour today. I see what you mean. I started out thinking this isn't bad... but then when I switched back I was WOW!! This is so much more softer! Hope this makes sense. I'm a little tipsy 🤪